Our priest doesn't like children!

[skiblerrn]

This is going to be a little long, but bear with me, as I would like any advice you may have.

We are relatively new to our parish, as we moved in the spring. In July, a new priest was transferred to the parish. He came from a large parish with a school, and apparently did not get along with parishoners there.

Our parish is rural and very small, with a little more than 50 families. From what we understand, it has always been a very family-oriented parish, and the parishoners have never minded children in mass (even if they are a little noisy).

The new priest is bothered by any noise in the church during mass, and has begun embarassing families with children who make noise. He will stop mass and glare at parents until they take their children out.

We were at mass one Sunday morning when he did this, and the mother sat outside in her car and cried for the remainder of mass. In the priest’s defense- the little girl was being too loud, and the mother should have taken her out. (I get the impression that many in this parish are not bothered at all by noise). However, my husband and I were upset with the way the priest handled it.

We have not been back to mass there since that day, because we have a 22 month old who tends to get a little rowdy. We always take her out if she is being too disruptive, but try to correct her in the pew so that she learns to behave and sit quietly.

We have been told by other parishoners that he has continued this behavior every week, and has done things like slamming the chalice down on the altar after communion because he was angry.

There was a parish counsel meeting this week, and we were told that Fr. sat with his head in his hands and would not speak to anyone. Members of the counsel told him that they wanted to help and would pray for him, and he finally responded by yelling and saying that he cannot stand the children and their parents.

The parish held a meeting regarding these issues, which they invited Fr. to attend, but he sat in the rectory with the lights off. We were not able to attend.

From the sound of things, it is to the point that there is no reverence during mass, and families are leaving the parish. It is apparent that he may have some mental health issues. The bishop has responded by sending a letter to the parish which basically says to take your kids out if they get noisy. Obviously, there are much bigger issues here than that, and we are upset that they are not being addressed.

Does anyone have any thoughts on what else the parish can do to have these matters resolved? In my opinion the relationship between pastor and parish has been permanently damaged, and I believe that he should be assigned elsewhere. There are duties that he can be assigned, other than being a pastor.

 

[cecilia97]

My brother’s family was at a parish with a similar situation when his twin boys were infants. Twin boys!!! Father would either homilize about the “noisy” children or just stop and glare until the parent removed the child, with all the congregation staring or trying not to stare. I attended a few times and there was not any big deal with noise there…just the typical few infants crying once in a while.

They eventually just gave up on the parish and started going elsewhere. I’m always sorry to hear about somebody going through this. Do the priests who have problems with children want one of the parents to stay at home with the kids and not attend at all? Because that’s what happens. You can be the most perfect parent in the world and your infant or toddler is going to outburst at some point.

I agree that it sounds like your priest has other issues besides noisy kids. It sounds like the counsel is doing what they can. Find another parish temporarily and pray for him, would be my advice.

Was Father a perfect child? Maybe he’s forgotten a few things from his past.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Was Father a perfect child? Maybe he’s forgotten a few things from his past.

That’s a good point. Maybe he suffered mean and angry priests when he was little, and has now become one of them. In our diocese we have one particular priest – retired monsignor now – who is mean and impatient with both children and adults; he has driven a lot of people away from the Church.

Alan

 

[texaspanda]

The new priest is bothered by any noise in the church during mass, and has begun embarassing families with children who make noise. **He will stop mass and glare at parents until they take their children out. **

We were at mass one Sunday morning when he did this, and the mother sat outside in her car and cried for the remainder of mass. In the priest’s defense- the little girl was being too loud, and the mother should have taken her out. (I get the impression that many in this parish are not bothered at all by noise). However, my husband and I were upset with the way the priest handled it.

This sounds just like our church. Would swear it is the same one except we are a very large parish and Msg. Pat has been around for years. It is clearly stated in the “Rule book for Mass” at our church that a nursery is available and open for all children and that’s where they should be. It even instructs you to not speak to your older children when they join you in mass after CCD so as to not disturb anyone around you who may not have children. I am in the middle of trying to figure out a way that we can switch churches.

 

[Kronos]

This sounds just like our church. Would swear it is the same one except we are a very large parish and Msg. Pat has been around for years. It is clearly stated in the “Rule book for Mass” at our church that a nursery is available and open for all children and that’s where they should be. It even instructs you to not speak to your older children when they join you in mass after CCD so as to not disturb anyone around you who may not have children. I am in the middle of trying to figure out a way that we can switch churches.

I don’t understand. A nursery is offered whereby parents can drop their children off, enjoy Mass, and yet you refuse to do so?

 

[Lovemyfaith]

This is kind of funny to me because I just came home from the Vigil Mass and there was a girl, I would think maybe 3rd grade, who played with her (large) medal the entire Mass. It was some type of award (not a religious medal). It clanged against the pew in front of her to the sound of dropping metal on the floor and it bouncing a few times. No kidding, the entire Mass. Our pastor is not mean at all and would never acknowledge noise, but I wondered when it became acceptable to make noise during Mass.
This is not to say a public addressing isn’t over the top, but when I read about parishes where the children are so reverent, I wonder how to get from A to B.

 

[Norseman82]

This is going to be a little long, but bear with me, as I would like any advice you may have.

We are relatively new to our parish, as we moved in the spring. In July, a new priest was transferred to the parish. He came from a large parish with a school, and apparently did not get along with parishoners there.

Our parish is rural and very small, with a little more than 50 families. From what we understand, it has always been a very family-oriented parish, and the parishoners have never minded children in mass (even if they are a little noisy).

The new priest is bothered by any noise in the church during mass, and has begun embarassing families with children who make noise. He will stop mass and glare at parents until they take their children out.

We were at mass one Sunday morning when he did this, and the mother sat outside in her car and cried for the remainder of mass. In the priest’s defense- the little girl was being too loud, and the mother should have taken her out. (I get the impression that many in this parish are not bothered at all by noise). However, my husband and I were upset with the way the priest handled it.

We have not been back to mass there since that day, because we have a 22 month old who tends to get a little rowdy. We always take her out if she is being too disruptive, but try to correct her in the pew so that she learns to behave and sit quietly.

We have been told by other parishoners that he has continued this behavior every week, and has done things like slamming the chalice down on the altar after communion because he was angry.

There was a parish counsel meeting this week, and we were told that Fr. sat with his head in his hands and would not speak to anyone. Members of the counsel told him that they wanted to help and would pray for him, and he finally responded by yelling and saying that he cannot stand the children and their parents.

The parish held a meeting regarding these issues, which they invited Fr. to attend, but he sat in the rectory with the lights off. We were not able to attend.

From the sound of things, it is to the point that there is no reverence during mass, and families are leaving the parish. It is apparent that he may have some mental health issues. The bishop has responded by sending a letter to the parish which basically says to take your kids out if they get noisy. Obviously, there are much bigger issues here than that, and we are upset that they are not being addressed.

Does anyone have any thoughts on what else the parish can do to have these matters resolved? In my opinion the relationship between pastor and parish has been permanently damaged, and I believe that he should be assigned elsewhere. There are duties that he can be assigned, other than being a pastor.

Well, if people “voting with their feet” doesn’t get the attention of the pastor or the bishop, perhaps try “voting with the envelopes” - maybe when they see a decrease in the collections, they will start to take things a bit more seriously.

 

[Coder]

I think we have to be careful here because while ability to focus at mass is important we don’t want to send the wrong message about children in this society of contraception and abortion.

I would work with the priest to start a fund and hire a contractor to build a “family room” in the Church. It’s a room with a glass wall so you can see the priest and hear him on the loudspeaker but the noise cannot be heard in the Church. Should cost about $3,000 to $10,000 I would think. If there are 1,000 families then this would cost each family an average of only $10.

Also try to be understanding with the priest, he may not mean harm and I can understand his point but it sounds like he’s being a bit harsh.

I support the poor mother who cried in her car during mass. She gave life to a child and she is to be praised! We must lift up the mothers and let them know we support them.

 

[Joe_Kelley]

We, the parish, had a problem with a pastor back east, not concerning children. When a friend of the bishop complained to the bishop he was told that the pastor was psychotic, but the bishop had bigger problems.

It was Boston in the early 60’s. Now I know what the bishop’s problems were.

Voting with your envelopes is probably the best strategy, though it could result in the closing of the parish.

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

OP-
Does the Priest stop mass and glare at parents during the Homily or throughout the Mass?

 

[ChristineML]

I don’t understand. A nursery is offered whereby parents can drop their children off, enjoy Mass, and yet you refuse to do so?

Some parents choose to worship TOGETHER as a family, yes, little ones, too. Parents may also want young children to become familiar with the church, the Mass, the prayers and hymns, so that when it is time for Penance and First Communion, they will be well familiar with going to Mass. Plus, don’t children receive graces from their attendance at Mass? Not so much from attendance at church nursery, methinks.

Aside from religious reasons, for altogether practical issues parents may keep babies close for breastfeeding-on-demand purposes, may not feel comfortable leaving their young children with strangers in the church nursery, or may be concerned about picking up colds, stomach viruses, etc. from this communal care arrangement.

All of the above reasons are more than sufficient for me to decline use of church nursery services, thank you very much.

 

[Rob_s_Wife]

He will stop mass and glare at parents until they take their children out.

We have not been back to mass there since that day, because we have a 22 month old who tends to get a little rowdy.

he has continued this behavior every week, and has done things like slamming the chalice down on the altar after communion because he was angry.

There was a parish counsel meeting this week, and we were told that Fr. sat with his head in his hands and would not speak to anyone. Members of the counsel told him that they wanted to help and would pray for him, and he finally responded by yelling and saying that he cannot stand the children and their parents.

The parish held a meeting regarding these issues, which they invited Fr. to attend, but he sat in the rectory with the lights off.

From the sound of things, it is to the point that there is no reverence during mass, and families are leaving the parish. It is apparent that he may have some mental health issues. The bishop has responded by sending a letter to the parish which basically says to take your kids out if they get noisy. Obviously, there are much bigger issues here than that, and we are upset that they are not being addressed.

Does anyone have any thoughts on what else the parish can do to have these matters resolved? In my opinion the relationship between pastor and parish has been permanently damaged, and I believe that he should be assigned elsewhere. There are duties that he can be assigned, other than being a pastor.

**The parish counsel, and even more so, the parents in question, should gather together and write the bishop of these events and THAT THIS PRIEST NEEDS EVALUATION AND IS HURTING THE FAITH OF HIS FLOCK. **

---

No, a priest doesn’t have to be the kind who likes to kiss babies to be a good priest, but he does have to be able to “stand” the souls that are put into his care. Unless there’s some new technology going on in your area, every single parishoner is either a parent or a child. A shepherd who is not capable of love and compassion for his flock, needs to be given a different assignment, not moved to another flock.

---

**If you think this is damageing to the parents, imagine the damage this does our young children! We teach them this man is standing as a symbol of Christ and our Father in heaven! **

---

I pray he gets the help he needs to deal with his anger and your parish gets a priests who loves those he has been called to lead.

 

[ChristineML]

…a new priest was transferred to the parish. He came from a large parish with a school, and apparently did not get along with parishoners there.

I don’t mean to encourage malicious gossip, but is it possible to speak privately with someone in authority at this priest’s former parish to discover possible ways to help you, the parish congregation, deal with the new priest and to help the priest deal with you, his new congregation? Knowing his exact issues and what accommodation measures have or have not been tried before may be helpful to all concerned.

Our parish is rural and very small, with a little more than 50 families. From what we understand, it has always been a very family-oriented parish, and the parishioners have never minded children in mass (even if they are a little noisy).

A previous poster suggested building a “cry room,” with glass walls and speakers so those inside can see and hear, but those outside cannot be disturbed by children’s noises. This is a great idea, but in such a small congregation, $3,000 to $10,000 may be cost prohibitive. Our parish has one speaker and thick glass double doors between the main sanctuary and the vestibule, and we with misbehaving children can hear and see straight down the main aisle to the altar.

The new priest is bothered by any noise in the church during mass, and has begun embarassing families with children who make noise. He will stop mass and glare at parents until they take their children out.

I like to sit in front so my kids can see what’s going on, and they usually behave better and participate more. But I make sure to sit on the congregation’s right, on the far side from the ambo (is that what it’s called?) where the lectors read the readings from and where the priests deliver their homilies from. Parents who know their kids are likely to misbehave or make noise could sit in the back or sides for quick exits.

With that said, it is NOT REASONABLE to expect absolute silence from young children. A few seconds of noise must be tolerated for parents to try to calm upset children or, beyond a few seconds, make and carry out the decision to remove their children temporarily to calm them down outside. However, it is NEVER acceptable for someone to EMBARRASS others. It is hurtful, unkind, rude, a very bad example to set for others. How about, at the MOST, if a parent is allowing their child to make significant noise for significant length of time, just be honest and communicate apologetically, “I’m sorry, I’m very sensitive to noise, I find it very difficult to concentrate through, could I please ask the favor of quickly removing crying children? I’m very happy to have you both back right away as soon as the child is calm and happy again. Please help me with this difficulty of mine…” Maybe call a meeting with parents to jointly set community standards of what noise is acceptable in the sanctuary and what justifies removal of a noisy child out of consideration for others?

These are assertive, polite requests to accommodate the priest’s need rather than a passive-aggressive accusatory implication, “You rude, inconsiderate parent, how dare you allow your child to make one peep during Mass?” You see the difference?

We were at mass one Sunday morning when he did this, and the mother sat outside in her car and cried for the remainder of mass. In the priest’s defense- the little girl was being too loud, and the mother should have taken her out. (I get the impression that many in this parish are not bothered at all by noise). However, my husband and I were upset with the way the priest handled it.

I SO feel for the mother’s embarrassment. I have felt this emotion myself, plus frustration with my child’s behavior, but they were NOT DELIBERATELY CAUSED, the hurt would make the situation so much more painful.

 

[StephanieC]

From what you have written, it sounds as though the bishop has decided that the parishoners are the source of the problem–they won’t keep their kids quiet. (!?)

It also sounds to me like there are clearly some personal issues in your pastor’s life–whether they are neurological or psychological, we don’t know.

I don’t know what else you can do other than not attending mass there.

The bishop has been contacted & his response is to tell the parish to take noisy kids out.
Uhhh, forest for the trees, your Excellency?

 

[Norseman82]

but is it possible to speak privately with someone in authority at this priest’s former parish to discover possible ways to help you, the parish congregation, deal with the new priest

It appears to me that the old parish dealt with the
problem by shoving it on skiblerrn’s parish…

 

[Linda_Marie]

We have been told by other parishioners that he has continued this behavior every week, and has done things like slamming the chalice down on the altar after communion because he was angry.

There was a parish counsel meeting this week, and we were told that Fr. sat with his head in his hands and would not speak to anyone. Members of the counsel told him that they wanted to help and would pray for him, and he finally responded by yelling and saying that he cannot stand the children and their parents.

Does anyone have any thoughts on what else the parish can do to have these matters resolved? In my opinion the relationship between pastor and parish has been permanently damaged, and I believe that he should be assigned elsewhere. There are duties that he can be assigned, other than being a pastor.

Take it to your archbishop. Slamming the Chalice, with whatever is left of the Blood, down on the altar in anger is pretty close to sacrilege.

Indeed deliberate and notable irreverence towards the Holy Eucharist is reputed the worst of all sacrileges. Likewise conscious maltreatment of sacred pictures or relics or perversion of Holy Scripture or sacred vessels
newadvent.org/cathen/13321a.htm

Yelling at his parishioners that he can’t stand them? This man needs to go, either on a long retreat with intensive counselling or a permanent re-assignment out of a parish since he is incapable of dealing with families. He needs to be in a monastery, for instance. This sort of behaviour is unacceptable and the archbishop needs to know that this man (and your bishop for not doing anything about it) is still a big problem. Someone should film him on their cell phone so you have some evidence to present. You need to keep complaining about him until you get some action.
Some people might even leave the Church over this. You have solved it by going to Mass at another parish, but some may just stop going to Mass altogether.

 

[rayne89]

I don’t understand. A nursery is offered whereby parents can drop their children off, enjoy Mass, and yet you refuse to do so?

Jesus is truly present at Mass, remember He said “let the children come to me and do not hinder them”. I would never put my child in nursery instead of allowing them to be in the presence of Christ.

 

[EB4304]

I don’t want to sound dramatic, but this is a very serious problem. The great importance of the Mass for grace and salvation is always spoken by the saints (in fact, a French saint - I forget exactly who - once said that if we truly understood the Mass, we would die of joy). The fact that the priest’s behavior is so poisoning the Mass that people are missing out on the worship and Eucharist is really unacceptable. It could also be turning people away from the Church and distorting the image of worship in the children. I still know far too many people who cannot bring themselves to go to Confession because of a nasty priest from their first one as a child.

I would try to get people together and write to the bishop - he’s there to serve all of you. Possibly remind him of that in a very humble manner (sometimes bishops need a little kick in the pants - they’re just sinful people like the rest of us!).

I really hope all of this works out,
God bless

 

[texaspanda]

I don’t understand. A nursery is offered whereby parents can drop their children off, enjoy Mass, and yet you refuse to do so?

There was recently an incident in the nursery that has lead me to not want to ever leave my children in there again.

 

[ChristineML]

It appears to me that the old parish dealt with the problem by shoving it on skiblerrn’s parish…

Then the current parish can find out how the previous parish accomplished it and do the same. Maybe after several parish reassignments in a row, the bishop will get the message that this priest is not suited to parish work. As the OP said, there are other ministries for a priest besides parish work where (duh) there will be children. Off the top of my head, how about assigning him to a hospital, senior citizen home, or prison ministry?

But reassignment may only delay getting this priest the help he needs. The details the OP mentioned: stopping Mass and glaring people into leaving, slamming the chalice down, yelling at the parish council that he “hates children and their parents,” sitting in the rectory in the dark (?!) instead of coming to a meeting ABOUT HIM as he was invited, sounds like there is something seriously wrong with him. Difficulties with assertive (as opposed to aggressive) and calm self-expression? Anger management? Self-control? Emotional / psychological / mental health issues?

It is NO KINDNESS to the priest or to any future parish to just pass the problem to some other congregation. It sounds like he has mental health issues that must be addressed. The parish must push, push, push the bishop until he gets this priest the care he needs.