Pa. bishops hid sex abuse of hundreds of children, grand jury finds

[on_the_hill]

Having observed and analyzed the “New Atheist” phenomenon since its inception, there are two common denominators which accompany its charges regarding debate, and rhetorical polemics : They are always shrill, and they are always angry.

I find it insulting when an atheist, by insinuation, presupposes that the Catholic lay faithful somehow are unsympathetic to the victims of these heinous crimes. Let me make this perfectly clear: the victims of clerical sex abuse have been, and are, fellow Catholics…our brothers and sisters in the faith. And since we Roman Catholics are “One Body” as a church, it is we, all of us, who grieve and lament most personally, and intensely for the victims of clerical sexual abuse.

I assure you, not a soul on this site condoned or defends what happened, at any level, or in any way. To insinuate the contrary is offensive, and defamatory.

You’re right, mostly. BlueEyedLady hits an important point, though. At least, it’s a point I, myself, suspect: The move to cover up was/is an attempt to protect the institution of the Church from critics and to preserve the allegiance of the faithful. I choose not to protect the people who betray the ideals they stand for.

 

[sirach2v4]

Or it could be about holding those accountable who were involved with the abuse of children and the subsequent institutional cover up…

Just because the old statute of limitations has run and some of the abusers have died doesn’t get them off the hook entirely if it can be proven they did something, particularly those involved in covering it up. They should be held accountable.

Is there a statute of limitation for crimes against humanity?
see wiki

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimes_against_humanity

 

[sirach2v4]

An allegation in Seattle

seattletimes.com/seattle-news/times-watchdog/priests-secret-file-details-trail-of-abuse/

 

[Path_Finder]

Having observed and analyzed the “New Atheist” phenomenon since its inception, there are two common denominators which accompany its charges regarding debate, and rhetorical polemics : They are always shrill, and they are always angry.

I find it insulting when an atheist, by insinuation, presupposes that the Catholic lay faithful somehow are unsympathetic to the victims of these heinous crimes. Let me make this perfectly clear: the victims of clerical sex abuse have been, and are, fellow Catholics…our brothers and sisters in the faith. And since we Roman Catholics are “One Body” as a church, it is we, all of us, who grieve and lament most personally, and intensely for the victims of clerical sexual abuse.

I assure you, not a soul on this site condoned or defends what happened, at any level, or in any way. To insinuate the contrary is offensive, and defamatory.

This may be related or it may not be, so I hope this is not offensive to anyone per just walking into a conversation and seeing people discussing things.

Atheists are what? Like 1, 2, 5% of the population in America at least, I know it is low.

Protestants are a large portion of the Christian population.

One can take a guess of whom I find able to use this in a more offensive way but at the same time, I do believe these problems have slowed down a lot. Any story is horrific but I think if there is one instance that happens today, it is largely blown up in the media.

 

[pristine2]

I do believe these problems have slowed down a lot. Any story is horrific but I think if there is one instance that happens today, it is largely blown up in the media.

A comforting belief.

Just wait until you discover that your diocese, after decades of coddling homosexual and pedophile priests, has secretly paid out 10s of millions of dollars in compensation and can no longer afford to support its Catholic schools.

That’s what happened to us last week.

 

[JPUSC]

Catholic dioceses declare bankruptcy on eve of sexual abuse trials

Stretching from Delaware to Alaska, these bankruptcy proceedings often have taken years to hammer out, as the church and victims negotiate the terms of how much victims should be compensated. The payouts to victims have been in the millions of dollars – in San Diego, the diocese paid more than $198 million to 144 abuse victims, the largest clergy sexual abuse settlement to date.

Bankruptcies can help to bring order to chaos, says Pamela Foohey, an associate professor at Indiana University’s Maurer School of Law. They ensure that hundreds of lawsuits become more manageable and that all victims get paid – not just those who file cases early.

But victim advocates and attorneys say churches that declare insolvency often do it for a less noble purpose. They say it has become a go-to move for dioceses to stop damaging trials and avoid putting church officials on the witness stand.

“Bankruptcies don’t protect kids,” said victims attorney Patrick Noaker, whose suit against Stitts was supposed to go to trial last week. “Trials and disclosures do.”

…

Declaring bankruptcy allows the church time to negotiate settlements with victims, organize its assets in a reorganization plan and ensure that victims get some sort of financial compensation for the alleged abuse.

But many see bankruptcy as a way to stop lawsuits that would force church officials to publicly testify about how they handled – or avoided – allegations of child abuse.

“The archdiocese was scared of officials getting on the witness stand and answering difficult questions about how they handled sexual abuse. So they avoided the issue and declared bankruptcy,” said Noaker, the attorney. “That’s not the sign of an organization committed to transparency and helping children.”

Bankruptcies are federal filings that automatically freeze civil lawsuits until the bankruptcy is complete – which can take years – and bar any future lawsuits. Suits are frozen while the archdiocese inventories its assets and establishes a trust from which victims are then paid. Legally, a trial can continue after the bankruptcy is complete, but that is extremely rare.

According to Noaker, who has been involved in a number of diocese bankruptcy proceedings, no sexual abuse cases against a diocese that were set to go to trial and then paused by church bankruptcy have made it back to a public courtroom. All were settled by other means.

Most of the 12 Catholic dioceses that have filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy did so on the eve of public trials. The Archdiocese of Portland, Oregon, filed for bankruptcy in 2004 before jury selection in a negligence lawsuit, according to the Star Tribune of Minneapolis. In San Diego in 2007, the diocese filed for Chapter 11 hours before the first of more than 40 sexual abuse lawsuits.

“These bankruptcies always happen right before big trials,” said Barbara Dorris, victims outreach director of the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests, or SNAP. “Then trials are stalled. All discovery stops. All documents remain secret. We feel it’s far less about money or the victims than protecting church documents and secrets.”

revealnews.org/article/catholic-dioceses-declare-bankruptcy-on-eve-of-sexual-abuse-trials

 

[mdef303]

The victims deserve all the compensation and support they need. No room for tolerance at all for distasteful crimes like these. They need not only punished here on earth but from God as well. Let’s pray out faith and churches will not tolerate this behavior and stay strong in the gospels word.

 

[JPUSC]

Watchdog: Catholic Church transfers property worth some $100 million

The Catholic Diocese of Orange has transferred ownership of properties worth some $100 million to individual churches over recent years.

Church officials say the move aligns the laws of God’s church with the laws of man, but critics denounce it as an attempt to insulate the diocese from big payouts if it’s sued.

Dozens of parcels have changed hands since 2009, with the bulk transferred in 2012. Valuable properties that once belonged to the diocese and now belong to the churches include the Mission Basilica San Juan Capistrano, St. Joseph in Santa Ana, Saints Simon and Jude in Huntington Beach and more than a dozen others throughout the county.

“More than five years ago, the Diocese of Orange underwent a process to bring the civil organization of its parishes into alignment with their canonical status,” diocese spokesman Ryan Lilyengren said. “This legal change made the civil structure more congruent with the established canonical status of our parishes.”

…

Catholic dioceses across America have been doing similar transfers in recent years, including in San Francisco – where the city’s legal attempt to force the church to pay property transfer taxes failed – as well as Nashville, Tenn.; Portland, Ore.; and Spokane, Wash., which were rocked by hefty lawsuits stemming from the priest sex abuse scandal. That scandal cost churches billions and bankrupted several dioceses.

The Diocese of Orange weathered the scandal without such drastic action. It agreed in 2005 to a $100 million settlement with nearly 90 victims who had alleged abuse by Catholic priests, nuns and lay teachers.

At the time, that was the largest payout of its kind in history. Several smaller settlements were reached before and after, and church watchers say abuse claims yet to come are the church’s main liability going forward.

…

The diocese stressed the transfers were strictly administrative, completely unrelated to the abuse conflict, and it feels they should not be linked in any way.

The diocese was among the first to settle abuse claims “and has instituted one of the most robust systems for protecting children and young people of any organization,” spokesman Lilyengren said.

Not everyone is convinced about its motives.

“It’s a typical corporate defense measure, meant to protect assets,” said Patrick J. Wall, a former priest, Benedictine monk and legal consultant who helped shape the diocese’s $100 million settlement.

Wall said people who feel they’ve been wronged still can sue the diocese, but they’d also have to sue individual parishes as well, making the legal process more cumbersome.

ocregister.com/articles/diocese-686747-church-parishes.html

 

[unafraid]

A comforting belief.

Just wait until you discover that your diocese, after decades of coddling homosexual and pedophile priests, has secretly paid out 10s of millions of dollars in compensation and can no longer afford to support its Catholic schools.

That’s what happened to us last week.

Sad to here you had to endure such a thing. Unfortunately, our family went through the same thing three years ago. It was traumatic for everyone, but there were two men who fought hard to save the school, came up with a viable plan, and in the end were rebuffed, who were most damaged by this . They both became cynics. One, a good friend, fell into a deep depression.

As an aside, both the pastor and the business manager were homosexual, and each showed very little compassion for the families involved throughout the whole affair.

Thankfully, we found a better school, better church, and better priest, right down the road. We just have to persevere through all of this madness. Satan only wins when we give up.

 

[mdef303]

It’s no ok to believe that “Satan” did this. It’s the phsyco, corrupted priests that their whole intention was to do this. this hurts, and quite honestly I would like to knock these pedophile priests and the ones who moved them around out cold. (I’m a boxer). I hope gods has wrath on these disgusting men and have mercy and comfort for the victims. If I knew one of them homosexuals I would knock em out cold. Swear b

 

[mdef303]

It’s no ok to believe that “Satan” did this. It’s the phsyco, corrupted priests that their whole intention was to do this. this hurts, and quite honestly I would like to knock these pedophile priests and the ones who moved them around out cold. (I’m a boxer). I hope god has wrath on these disgusting men and have mercy and comfort for the victims. If I knew one of them homosexuals I would knock em out cold. Swear b

 

[Modern_Revert]

What the hell were they thinking?

The total lack of comprehension of the future ramifications of what they did and what they failed to do?

It’s mind-boggling.

 

[Lormar]

I hate to say it, but the Church’s first concern has been for a long time now to protect its hide/reputation.

Read any book about these priests and their victims and you will see that’s what it was all about - silencing the victims.

 

[Lormar]

A comforting belief.

Just wait until you discover that your diocese, after decades of coddling homosexual and pedophile priests, has secretly paid out 10s of millions of dollars in compensation and can no longer afford to support its Catholic schools.

That’s what happened to us last week.

When this abuse crisis first came to light for most Catholics in the early 2000’s, our diocese got mad because parishioners stopped giving money, and we got homilies on “don’t punish the Church!!” When they sufficiently shamed the Catholics in the pews, not a few of them refinanced their homes, or dipped into their retirement savings, to bail the diocese out of their financial crisis.

 

[HB11]

Hello BlueEyedLady,

It’s not about ignoring it. We must learn from the past. However, it just suspicious regarding timing (in general, not any one specific case). Also, why is it that only Catholic abuse makes national news? Where are the national press stories about abuse in the Episcopal Church? Or the Methodist Church? They have bishops too. What about Jewish Rabbis? What about pastors at large Baptist and/or non-denominational Churches? What about the abuse from Muslim clergy?

Also, why isn’t abuse from public school teachers and high school coaches national news?

But, if it happens in the Catholic Church, it’s national or world news.

It’s the hypocrisy that is the issue here. Let’s treat all child abuse the same, with the same level of disdain for such a horrid crime. Let’s not give a 50 year old case in the Catholic Church more attention than a high school incident from last month.

Again… let’s treat all sexual abuse the same.

God Bless

 

[pristine2]

Hello BlueEyedLady,

It’s not about ignoring it. We must learn from the past. However, it just suspicious regarding timing (in general, not any one specific case). Also, why is it that only Catholic abuse makes national news? Where are the national press stories about abuse in the Episcopal Church? Or the Methodist Church? They have bishops too. What about Jewish Rabbis? What about pastors at large Baptist and/or non-denominational Churches? What about the abuse from Muslim clergy?

It’s the hypocrisy that is the issue here.

Sorry but this is denial, and equivocation. If an explanation is really needed, let’s spell it out:

1. The priesthood is intended to be celibate, not only to preserve the innocence of the priest himself, but to facilitate the intimate spiritual relationship between priest and parishioner necessary for the sacraments (especially the sacrament of reconciliation). So in this sense you are right … the hypocrisy is the issue. But even more so, it is the BETRAYAL.
2. While there is sexual corruption in the clergy of the other religions you mention, it doesn’t make “makes the news” because (with the possible exception of Islam, where victims could only face further abuse upon disclosure) the problem isn’t NEARLY as widespread, nor has there been anything like the massive cover-up in response. Part of this is because there is no expectation of celibacy placed upon non-Catholic clergy that they can betray.

Purging sexual corruption in the priesthood is the challenge we face. It cannot be done in secret.

 

[estesbob]

Hello BlueEyedLady,

It’s not about ignoring it. We must learn from the past. However, it just suspicious regarding timing (in general, not any one specific case). Also, why is it that only Catholic abuse makes national news? Where are the national press stories about abuse in the Episcopal Church? Or the Methodist Church? They have bishops too. What about Jewish Rabbis? What about pastors at large Baptist and/or non-denominational Churches? What about the abuse from Muslim clergy?

Also, why isn’t abuse from public school teachers and high school coaches national news?

But, if it happens in the Catholic Church, it’s national or world news.

It’s the hypocrisy that is the issue here. Let’s treat all child abuse the same, with the same level of disdain for such a horrid crime. Let’s not give a 50 year old case in the Catholic Church more attention than a high school incident from last month.

Again… let’s treat all sexual abuse the same.

God Bless

A good Example of this was several years ago, back when archbishop Chaput was still in Colorado, The legislature tried to pass a law removing the statutes of limitation on sex abuse cases . However the law excluded pretty much everyone but Catholic clergy- it remanined in effect , for instance ,for schoolteachers and government officials . When Archbishop Chaput opposesd the law as it was clearly directed primarily at the Catholic Church there were banner headlines about how the Church was trying to protect abusive Priests

 

[Thorolfr]

 

[pnewton]

1. While there is sexual corruption in the clergy of the other religions you mention, it doesn’t make “makes the news” because (with the possible exception of Islam, where victims could only face further abuse upon disclosure) the problem isn’t NEARLY as widespread, nor has there been anything like the massive cover-up in response…

This is an unproven myth, except the part about any cover up. The only reason there is no cover up elsewhere is because no cover up is needed, as preachers can simply leave and apply elsewhere. Some have the goal of protecting children, but some will lie and mislead, as the real goal is destroying the Catholic Church.

 

[Catholic_Press]

In the wake of a grand-jury report that denounced the handling of past sex-abuse complaints in the Altoona, Pennyslvania diocese, Bishop Mark Bartchak has ordered the removal of banners …

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