Papal first: Francis visits Pentecostal church

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agnes_therese said:
A little respect for the office, please?

Um, maybe because he feels that Catholic persecution of Pentecostals during the fascist regime was wrong?
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Please provide support for your statement that the Pope in fact apologized for the time during fascism.

I am looking forward to the joint statement the meeting with evangelicals will produce. Unity is around the corner!
 
Mussolini was an atheist. I would be interested in seeing some of these points backed up. Still, that would seem to be Mussolini’s regime.
 
Path_Finder said:
Can you offer any evidence that “the relations between Catholic Church and the Pentecostal churches have never been better” besides personal anecdote? That is hardly objective evidence.
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Ummm how about the fact that Pope Francis visited a Pentecostal church in Rome? Or that he addressed Kenneth Copeland in a video addressed to Pentecostals? Is that objective enough? 🤷

The Catholic Church is reaching out to Pentecostals. I pray they respond with goodness as well. The history of the hostility between Pentecostals and Catholics is a sad one but I see much progress with Pope Francis’ attempts at reaching out to them.
 
Path_Finder said:
Please don’t accuse others of “smearing”.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Swaggart

Furthermore, last I knew, his channel is among the religious networks that broadcast 24/7.

If there is a more high profile Pentecostal Minister out there that the Public knows of, please identify him. Otherwise, I believe you are very much in error in making such a judgement and that is only your personal understanding about Jimmy Swaggart. And when Swaggart is anti-Catholic, that is broadcast on the airwaves often. Your own thoughts on the issue are merely your own projection.

Again, each religion is even discussed in these forums. Your Priest may say one thing but that is but one voice.

There is no way I will entertain the notion that some faiths’ followers are generally speaking, hospitable to Catholic Teaching.

And then, your description of Oneness Pentecostals really makes me wonder as well. They are a fairly large faith, I believe it is the United Pentecostal Church, we have one near us. If one did not know they were the Oneness Pentecostals, now, they may.
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Jimmy Swaggart is a disgrace to the Pentecostal movement. He is now considered to be non-denominational despite his Pentecostal beliefs. I’m just wondering why you chose such a scandalous figure to represent Pentecostalism in your statement. I am sorry if I used too strong language (i.e. “smear”). I just have heard people use Jimmy Swaggart’s infamous story as a way to discredit Pentecostals in the past.

My grandfather was a Pentecostal minister and amazing missionary. He was famous for what he did, but I would prefer not to name them (I do not want to identify myself too much on these forums). So this is why I am defensive of Pentecostals. They do great work around the world, and some have died for it. Jimmy Swaggart, while famous, is not representative of Pentecostalism.
 
Path_Finder said:
And then, your description of Oneness Pentecostals really makes me wonder as well. They are a fairly large faith, I believe it is the United Pentecostal Church, we have one near us. If one did not know they were the Oneness Pentecostals, now, they may.
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How? I am confused. Oneness Pentecostals are heretics based on their understanding of the Trinity. Their baptisms are not considered valid by the Catholic Church. This is a fact.
 
Just to add: the reason why you hear more of infamous names like Jimmy Swaggart or Joel Osteen (yes, I know he’s not technically Pentecostal) is because they are glorifying themselves at the expense of God. The vast majority of Pentecostals are not out to seek their own glory but rather God’s, thus you will not hear their name so much in the media. They tend to pick up on big scandals and bad news travels quickly. The quiet work done by Pentecostals and other Christians is often not reported.

Actually, now that I think of it, the existence of charismatic Catholicism is also an influence I believe from Pentecostalism.
Path_Finder said:
Again, each religion is even discussed in these forums. Your Priest may say one thing but that is but one voice.

There is no way I will entertain the notion that some faiths’ followers are generally speaking, hospitable to Catholic Teaching.
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I am sorry you cannot find similarities between Catholics and various Protestant denominations. It seems there are enough similarities between them that the Catechism of the Catholic Church has called Protestants “brothers and sisters in Christ”. I am glad Pope Francis does not agree with your view, seeing as he prayed the Lord’s Prayer with that Pentecostal church. Thank the Lord for ecumenism!

I truly hope you haven’t taken any offense but what I have said, Path_Finder. It is just that Pentecostalism brought me to Jesus Christ in the first place. One day, God willing, I will join the Catholic Church. But I cannot deny the role that the Pentecostal church has played in my spiritual development. Yes, I know this is anecdotal, but I cannot deny my own spiritual journey and the goodness I saw evident in Pentecostals. I truly praise God for them.

Also, to note: the priest I was referring is an official Church theologian. So I do take his words seriously. He is not speaking in ignorance.
 
Catholic_farmer said:
He is trying to bring the wandering sheep back to the fold. I hope he reaches some of them. I imagine meeting the one man on earth who best represents the will of God might change a few hearts. Are we evangelizing as much as our Holy Father?

(formerly known as “lutheran farmer”)
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Congrat’s former Lutheran farmer! Good to see you…or hear…or write you!!!👍
 
fnr;12212580 21His son said to him said:
True, but only after a true repentance. In the parable, If the son didn’t physically return (wanting to return) only then the father races to meet with him. I don’t see the Pentecostals wanting to get closer. What they have done the last 20 yrs. is taking them back further and further from unity.
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UnumCorpus said:
My grandfather was a Pentecostal minister and amazing missionary. He was famous for what he did, but I would prefer not to name them (I do not want to identify myself too much on these forums). So this is why I am defensive of Pentecostals. They do great work around the world,
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I hope for your conversion whenever it may come. I agree that there are many good and great Pentecostal people as there are in any religion. But I don’t see them or hear of them attempting to, ‘as a whole’, unite with Christ in the Church. By their nature they are divided. Only the Church may be able to bring all these lost lambs together. Yes, in our Catholic faith we too also have many lost lambs and still losing them by the bucket fills.
 
WilT said:
I hope for your conversion whenever it may come. I agree that there are many good and great Pentecostal people as there are in any religion. But I don’t see them or hear of them attempting to, ‘as a whole’, unite with Christ in the Church. By their nature they are divided. Only the Church may be able to bring all these lost lambs together. Yes, in our Catholic faith we too also have many lost lambs and still losing them by the bucket fills.
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Thank you, WilT. 🙂 And yes, this is true. My grandfather in his time was actually accused of being too ecumenical. Some of the people in his churches were suspicious that he was getting too friendly with other denominations. So there will always be people in every denomination who are sadly opposed to any kind of unification or even discussion. I hope and pray that a more ecumenical Pentecostal generation will arise.

Truly, what I hate about Protestantism is the division. If Pentecostals themselves were united, then it would be a lot easier for Catholics to dialogue with them.
 
Traditionalists are going to be mad about this, but the prophet of God in the Old Testament told the servant of some king that he could accompany his master to the pagan temple and even help him as he genuflects! Can’t find chapter verse now
 
WilT said:
I believe my question was if we should continue seeking unity with the Pentecostals that continue to retreat from Church teachings. Dialogue is fine but they continue to stray away from the Christian teachings left by Christ to his Disciples.
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Well yes of course we should continue to seek unity and not just with Pentecostals but ALL. I believe Scripture says that God came to save all men not just the Catholics or the Pentecostals.

So if the answer is yes we should seek unity, my question is how?

The word unity means being one. So does unity mean Pentecostals convert to Catholicism?

And how do Pentecostals feel about that?

I think reality is that unity will not be seen at least in my lifetime. But any progress is good.
 
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