Papal Interpretation of Scripture

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“If and when One is a Informed and fully Practicing Catholic one eithr KNOWs or KNOWS how to find it out”.👍

So, you’re saying that as a non-Catholic I can’t really know what the Roman Catholic Church teaches because it’s an inside group with secret knowledge? Furthermore, I’m trying to get informed, but it seems to me like the “inside knowledge” is so cloak and dagger. I thought the Roman Catholic Church is transparent so that all can see how truthful it is? You know, I’ve done a lot of reading, from Aquinas to Kuhn, to Cardinal Newman, and I don’t think I have ever heard an argument like the one you have given me.
 
po18guy said:
“You’re kidding.”
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PO18,

Was this suppose to be a sarcastic question? If it is, this is very much in line with an *ad hominem *argument, as if you are trying to attack my integrity or intentions. If it is not, I would suggest that you actually interact with my thoughts. I have been intentional to argue from historical data, ask a lot of questions, and seek to learn what you believe. If you are not interested, just tell me you do not desire to discuss anything further. I have already asked you 2x or 3x if you wanted to end the conversation.
 
richport29 said:
What do these verses prove? And have they been interpreted infallibly for you to know what they mean according to the Catholic Church’s teaching?
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I must, at this point, inform you that you “appear” to be following a very predictable pattern of certain non-Catholics who enter CAF with pre-conceived and incorrect notions of the Catholic faith. Thus armed, and with little apparent desire to dialog, they seek to trap Catholics with a line of unreasonable questioning, only to subsequently proclaim they they have once again disproved, or revealed the falseness of the Catholic faith.

Normally, when this is pointed out to them, CAF Catholics are accused of failing to address “points” and then of somehow insulting or victimizing the poster. Frequently, insults are then hurled at Catholicism in general before said member is banned for violating the forum rules that they, as a Christian, agreed to obey.

Now, this pattern can continue and no one will learn a thing - or you, as a welcome guest here, can employ a touch of humility, admit that you may not know the actual truth of the Catholic faith, and we can learn from each other.

Well?
 
po18guy said:
I must, at this point, inform you that you “appear” to be following a very predictable pattern of certain non-Catholics who enter CAF with pre-conceived and incorrect notions of the Catholic faith. Thus armed, and with little apparent desire to dialog, they seek to trap Catholics with a line of unreasonable questioning, only to subsequently proclaim they they have once again disproved, or revealed the falseness of the Catholic faith.

Normally, when this is pointed out to them, CAF Catholics are accused of failing to address “points” and then of somehow insulting or victimizing the poster. Frequently, insults are then hurled at Catholicism in general before said member is banned for violating the forum rules that they, as a Christian, agreed to obey.

Now, this pattern can continue and no one will learn a thing - or you, as a welcome guest here, can employ a touch of humility, admit that you may not know the actual truth of the Catholic faith, and we can learn from each other.

Well?"
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Please don’t play the victim. If you are going to accuse me of something, please prove it. You can look at all the posts again, and see for yourself that I have been asking questions; interacting with your thoughts; and not attacking anyone here. So far the last two posts have had nothing to do with the issues at hand, and I have tried to steer the conversation back to the main issue. If you don’t want to talk, and feel like I am not humble, that I have insulted you, etc., just say, “hey, I don’t want to talk anymore.” But, if by chance, you do want to continue to talk, stick to the issues.
If your next post does not steer back to the issues at hand, and you continue to claim unsupported accusations, etc., I’m done.
 
Thank you all for your replies. I think I have a handle now concerning the Catholic viewpoint on the issue. To tell the truth, I didn’t expect such heated debate in this thread, which just goes to show that posting any thread, like launching an air strike, may have unintentional consequences.
 
richport29 said:
“If and when One is a Informed and fully Practicing Catholic one eithr KNOWs or KNOWS how to find it out”.👍

So, you’re saying that as a non-Catholic I can’t really know what the Roman Catholic Church teaches because it’s an inside group with secret knowledge? Furthermore, I’m trying to get informed, but it seems to me like the “inside knowledge” is so cloak and dagger. I thought the Roman Catholic Church is transparent so that all can see how truthful it is? You know, I’ve done a lot of reading, from Aquinas to Kuhn, to Cardinal Newman, and I don’t think I have ever heard an argument like the one you have given me.
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Look, let’s stop playing games. You want to learn about the faith, get a copy of Catholicism for Dummies. Read up, then ask questions.
 
meltzerboy said:
Thank you all for your replies. I think I have a handle now concerning the Catholic viewpoint on the issue. To tell the truth, I didn’t expect such heated debate in this thread, which just goes to show that posting any thread, like launching an air strike, may have unintentional consequences.
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I enjoy your questions and I thank you for them.
 
richport29 said:
Po18guy,

I understand that as a Catholic you believe the Magisterium is always guiding, but how would that guidance play out practically when you are looking at specific verse? For example, say you were looking at 1 John 1:1, and the Magisterium or the Pope have not given an authoritative or infallible interpretation, how would they guide you? And how would you avoid private interpretation since their is no authoritative or infallible interpretation?
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You give it you own interpretation first, then discuss it with others of the Church. If your brother rebukes you for it, you bring it to the elders (the priests), then the bishops if not resolved, then the Pope if not resolved. If you differ from the Pope’s understanding you should attempt to correct your understanding.

Eventually you will correct yourself, submit by faith to the Church’s judgement, or go apostate and reject the Church.

On the other hand if the Church sees no error in your interpretation, you are free to follow it. If you have problem with someone else’s interpretation of that same verse, then you can follow the opposite side of the process just explained above.

peace
steve
 
richport29 said:
If the Council of Trent prohibited the private interpretation of Scripture, and the Pope and Magisterium have only infallibly interpreted a few verses, are Roman Catholic lay persons partaking of private interpretation when they attempt to interpret the Scriptures when in dialogue?
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Thought I might post the pertinent Canon of Trent:

“Furthermore, in order to restrain petulant spirits, It decrees, that no one, relying on his own skill, shall,–in matters of faith, and of morals pertaining to the edification of Christian doctrine, --wresting the sacred Scripture to his own senses, presume to interpret the said sacred Scripture contrary to that sense which holy mother Church,–whose it is to judge of the true sense and interpretation of the holy Scriptures,–hath held and doth hold; or even contrary to the unanimous consent of the Fathers; even though such interpretations were never (intended) to be at any time published. Contraveners shall be made known by their Ordinaries, and be punished with the penalties by law established.”

So I would read this as saying that private interpretation is not prohibited totally; but should not contradict what the Church and the ECF’s holds as truth. Again this must be set in the context of why the Council of Trent was held. Even Luther’s opinion of private interpretation changed when he saw the logical consequences of unrestricted and often uneducated biblical scholarship.
 
I really hold certain Protestant non-denominational leaders responsible for the misinformation and continued animosity against the Catholic Church. They are living still in those years prior to the Reformation and do not seek the truth.

The Council of Trent reformed the Church. If you bring it forward to them, they refuse to listen.

Dissension within the Body of Christ is on par with other very serious vices that contradict true faith in Christ. When people want to hold on to prejudice, how do they justify that with true Christian faith? Just because the Catholic Church is large does not mean its members are not educated, not aware of true and authentic Christianity or are blind to the problems we have within our Church.

The force that is the source of power in the Church is not its believers, but the work of God in the Liturgy where Jesus comes to us to physically live within us.

What a loss to those who will not open their eyes, put on Christ, take on His forgiveness, and come to know the truth of the universal Christian Church that has been in place since Pentecost.
 
J.R.R. Tolkien opined, in a letter to his son, that the true intent of the European rebellion (“reformation”) was not on faith versus works, but on the Holy Eucharist:
“I myself am convinced by the Petrine claims, nor looking around the world does there seem much doubt which (if Christianity is true) is the True Church, the temple of the Spirit dying but living, corrupt but holy, self-reforming and rearising. But for me that Church of which the Pope is the acknowledged head on earth has as chief claim that it is the one that has (and still does) ever defended the Blessed Sacrament, and given it most honour, and put it (as Christ plainly intended) in the prime place. ‘Feed my sheep’ was His last charge to St Peter; and since His words are always first to be understood literally, I suppose them to refer primarily to the Bread of Life. It was against this that the W. European revolt (or Reformation) was really launched – ‘the blasphemous fable of the Mass’ – and faith/works a mere red herring.”
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If the Pope says that we have to adhere to a particular interpretation of Scripture then we do.
 
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