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PeaceBeWithYou
Guest
Turns out if everyone increased their monthly contribution by $10-$20/month, the Parish I attend would be in the black. I pray we can all do that, one less meal out is really all it takes.
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JMMJ
Guest
What does the diocese use it’s money for? What expenses does it cover, if all parishes are self-supporting?
My Mom is constantly receiving calls for financial donations to go directly to the diocese, via the mail.
My Mom is constantly receiving calls for financial donations to go directly to the diocese, via the mail.
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TheLittleLady
Guest
Ask your Diocese. Go to their website, look at all of the programs they run.
As a non-profit, they publish their financials, ask for a copy.
As a non-profit, they publish their financials, ask for a copy.
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twf
Guest
I’ve heard priests recommend (but not require) that we give 10% - but divided between parish and charities.
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Emedan
Guest
As a member here you have to pay 1% Church tax, the government automatically takes it from your salary. How is it financed in the states?
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Jessie
Guest
Church tax here in Germany. Seems quite well known that the German bishops are apparently rolling in it. I used to belong to an international community. The US citizens especially seemed to be very generous givers. I don’t know how it works financially at grad tours level, because despite the church tax, there is a collection on Sundays, plus annually a plea for church money (with the emphasis that anything given will stay in the parish)
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otjm
Guest
To the OP’s question:
That is almost like asking if the Pope is Catholic!
There have been numerous studies on “giving” (tithing, if you wish), and repeatedly Catholics are on a per capita basis are the lowest “givers”. Whether or not that has increased in the level of giving as the number of people in the pew has decreased I cannot answer; but it is not an unknown fact.
Those facts are from a U.S. perspective, so I cannot speak to a “Church-wide problem” as I have not seen any facts for other countries. In the US, unlike some European nations, the Church receives directly from the individual - some European countries collect through taxation and direct the money to the Church (and other Protestant entities).
Seriously, how often have we seen the collection basket pass us with some $1, $5, and $10 bills in it? Even assuming that someone had a take-home pay of $3,000 per month, or $36,000 per year, that works out to $609/week. 5% would be $30/week.2% would be @ $12/week. And that does not include any feast days (which would lower the amount “per week”).
Tithing, according to biblical principles is 10%; one can argue whether that is before or after taxes, but it seems best to after tax income. The Bible is also replete with comments about “first fruites”, meaning that it is the first thing one gives; living costs come after.
Overall, Catholics give a tremendous amount; in part because Catholics tend to be the largest group of givers, But on a person by person donation, it is exceedingly low.
And granted that one may have a percentage one gives as “charitable giving”, the parish does not seem to be a first consideration.
That is almost like asking if the Pope is Catholic!
There have been numerous studies on “giving” (tithing, if you wish), and repeatedly Catholics are on a per capita basis are the lowest “givers”. Whether or not that has increased in the level of giving as the number of people in the pew has decreased I cannot answer; but it is not an unknown fact.
Those facts are from a U.S. perspective, so I cannot speak to a “Church-wide problem” as I have not seen any facts for other countries. In the US, unlike some European nations, the Church receives directly from the individual - some European countries collect through taxation and direct the money to the Church (and other Protestant entities).
Seriously, how often have we seen the collection basket pass us with some $1, $5, and $10 bills in it? Even assuming that someone had a take-home pay of $3,000 per month, or $36,000 per year, that works out to $609/week. 5% would be $30/week.2% would be @ $12/week. And that does not include any feast days (which would lower the amount “per week”).
Tithing, according to biblical principles is 10%; one can argue whether that is before or after taxes, but it seems best to after tax income. The Bible is also replete with comments about “first fruites”, meaning that it is the first thing one gives; living costs come after.
Overall, Catholics give a tremendous amount; in part because Catholics tend to be the largest group of givers, But on a person by person donation, it is exceedingly low.
And granted that one may have a percentage one gives as “charitable giving”, the parish does not seem to be a first consideration.
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otjm
Guest
It isn’t; most likely due to separation of Church and State. People have the duty to pony up on their own.
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Cirdan_XII
Guest
On the other hand I know of many parishes, including my own, where the house provided for the priest was built at a time that the parish had three priests, plus guest bedrooms for up to three further visiting priests. It is a beautiful property with high ceilings, chandeliers, a large bay window in the dining room and a beautiful garden. But on the other hand, seeing this is an inner city location, it could easily fetch a million if sold, and one can ask whether the value the house is currently providing offsets that.
That is of course a difficult conversation to have because it was bequeathed by a famous benefactor and has a fine tradition and we have summer fetes on the lawn. But maybe at some point down the road, that question will need to be looked into.
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CilladeRoma
Guest
In my diocese, we call it the “Catholic Ministry Appeal”, and it helps with all sorts of things.
IT support, continuing education for Catholic school teachers & catechists, support for Catholic charities, the money to run the Bishop’s office, money for the tribunal to keep annulment costs low, support for retired priests and all sorts of other things that most people don’t think about.
As a collection counter, it amazes me that people think $2 dollars toward to collection every week is “giving”. If thats all you can afford, that is one thing, but when you spend more than that on coffee after church, then complain when ministries get cut or your parish closes, well there is no one to blame but yourself.
IT support, continuing education for Catholic school teachers & catechists, support for Catholic charities, the money to run the Bishop’s office, money for the tribunal to keep annulment costs low, support for retired priests and all sorts of other things that most people don’t think about.
As a collection counter, it amazes me that people think $2 dollars toward to collection every week is “giving”. If thats all you can afford, that is one thing, but when you spend more than that on coffee after church, then complain when ministries get cut or your parish closes, well there is no one to blame but yourself.
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1ke
Guest
In the US, there is no state church or church tax as there are in various European countries.
Churches are funded solely by voluntary donations of parishioners.
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Socrates92
Guest
I’m not sure that really makes sense in the context of married priests (presuming that married priests require and receive a larger stipend than unmarried priests). Would a parish just be at the mercy of the luck of the draw whether they get assigned a married or unmarried priest? If the diocese is making these assignments, shouldn’t they also make up the difference?
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Cruciferi
Guest
My former Parish (Closed) and most Churches in my Diocese are in the same situation.
No, it’s definitely not sustainable. Nevertheless, my Parish was able to hang on for about 10 additional years.
This is definitely an increasing problem in Diocese around the US. My Diocese is preparing to reorganize and close Parishes for the second time.
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PeaceBeWithYou
Guest
Losing tax exemption would shutter lots of Church doors. I imagine the fairly small deficit at this parish would increase tens of thousands of dollars per year.
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MagdalenaRita
Guest
We are seeing alot of closings in our diocese also.
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PeaceBeWithYou
Guest
That’s a shame. I know several people who quit attending Mass and contributing to the Parish as a result of being outraged by the abuse scandals that have been going on for decades and probably much longer. To my knowledge, there have not been any abuse crimes in the Parish I attend (their protest is related to the Church at large). I imagine folks all over the world have done similar things. I’m just as outraged as them but don’t feel that turning my back on Christ’s Church is the answer. The money drying up will force more changes I suppose.
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TryingToBelieve
Guest
We changed parishes this past year. The new parish is sound financially. The old parish is not. Of course we had two priest involved in the past 8 years with the scandal. We saw first hand how that impacted the church finances.
After our children graduated the school we started to look at different parishes. We were there for 18 years and we saw how much the parish and school has changed. When my kids started there was almost an enrollment of 400 kids. Now the enrollment is only 160ish.
New parish has a vibrant base and has been very welcoming. We recently talked to the choir director and most likely will be involved in the music ministry again
Also the new parish draws quite a few families from the surrounding suburbs. Us included.
There is no easy answer to this crisis but when your home parish gets rocked by the sex scandal twice in 8 years it takes a toll on the parish.
I
After our children graduated the school we started to look at different parishes. We were there for 18 years and we saw how much the parish and school has changed. When my kids started there was almost an enrollment of 400 kids. Now the enrollment is only 160ish.
New parish has a vibrant base and has been very welcoming. We recently talked to the choir director and most likely will be involved in the music ministry again
Also the new parish draws quite a few families from the surrounding suburbs. Us included.
There is no easy answer to this crisis but when your home parish gets rocked by the sex scandal twice in 8 years it takes a toll on the parish.
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Phemie
Guest
I’m in a Canadian parish and we’ve always been responsible for the priest’s salary. Plus his trip to the priests’ retreat each year. Each year there is a pan-Canada collection for the “Needs of the Church in Canada”. Poorer parishes are able to petition for grants from that money and many parishes in my diocese do. We’ve been lucky that we haven’t had to in many years.
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Emedan
Guest
We don’t have a state church in Sweden either. The Swedish IRS just helps with automatic membership fee collections which is set to 1% of monthly income. When the Lutheran church stopped being a state Church in the year 2000 the government extended collection help to all other organised faiths in Sweden.Emedan:
In the US, there is no state church or church tax as there are in various European countries.
Churches are funded solely by voluntary donations of parishioners.
You can get a dispensation from paying the fee if you don’t have the means but generally it’s collected by the IRS and automatically drawn from your salary.
This was due to it being considered unfair that the previous state church was and still is financed by tax collections of members as it had always been.
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1ke
Guest
There is no equivalent in the US. The government is not involved in any way with collection or distributing of revenue to churches.
All church revenue is solely based on individuals voluntarily contributing to the church.
In some cases that contribution can be claimed as a deduction on income taxes, but so can any charitable contribution.
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