Parishioners billed $72,000 for TLM (not a joke)

[holdencaulfield]

Excommunicated for what? All that he did was to make a calculation of the financial costs of establishing and maintaining a Latin mass community.

Because that’s a ton of money. Why should people have to pay that much money just to attend Mass. What ever happened to putting what you think is necessary in the collection tray. I always give more to small parishes, because I think that they need it. However the Church has no room to force people to pay to attend Mass.

 

[Kielbasi]

Because that’s a ton of money. Why should people have to pay that much money just to attend Mass. What ever happened to putting what you think is necessary in the collection tray. I always give more to small parishes, because I think that they need it. However the Church has no room to force people to pay to attend Mass.

$72,000 is not a ton of money for a year’s budget, and no individual is being forced to pay to attend mass.

I’m sure that the people in the Latin community will give what they think is necessary as well, the $72,000 figure gives them information to make that decision.

 

[Spiller]

Because that’s a ton of money. Why should people have to pay that much money just to attend Mass. What ever happened to putting what you think is necessary in the collection tray. I always give more to small parishes, because I think that they need it. However the Church has no room to force people to pay to attend Mass.

$72K/year is not a “ton of money” for “salary, room & board, health insurance and pension, travel expenses, church rental, office expenses, and other ministry expenses.”

Seems rather reasonable actually.

The offering (and the amount) on an individual basis is still voluntary – they aren’t garnishing any paycheck here.

I must ask again though. If those people who make use of the chaplaincy don’t pay the $72K/year, who will and who should?

 

[EddieArent]

Has Fr. Z gotten a hold of this yet? He’s sure to incensed! (no pun intended).

In all seriously, this is disheartening and disgusting. Another example of traditional catholics being treated as second-class Christians. Sometimes I wish that a certain group of Bishops would be systematically struck but lightning, but then common sense and charity kick in. I then realize that this is clearly a cross the Lord has given to some of his most devout followers to see if their charity is as deep as it ought to be, and ensure that we (traditionalists) do not follow the example of the SSPX and give up on charity and obedience regarding the magisterium.

That said, I hope that this Diocese recieves thousands of charitable letters begging that these unjust actions be recanted.

The rest of us can pray for these poor souls who are only asking for Mass and recieve a huge bill for it.

Some times there is a line to be drawn. You need to stop bashing the SSPX. They didn’t want this situation they were in; they were founded on Catholic principles with full approval before some possesed hierarchs faught tooth and nail to lie about Archbishop Lefebvre and the SSPX. You think they wanted it? You think the priests of Campos wanted Bishop Navarro to throw long serving priests out of their parishes by use of police force and the courts? Or to have Novus Ordo priests lie about holy priests and bishops to the point that a sickly priest broke down during a homily and passed off to his eternal reward as a result of all the pain that they put him through? That is nuts. It is like our Lord being spat upon and crucified once again. I know the insults won’t stop, but ultimately the more times they will be bashed I know for sure the more I know our Lord is telling us to pray for holy priests so that this crisis may be over and that He may reign in the hearts of all men, women, and children.

 

[estesbob]

It doesn’t sound that terrible at all.

The Latin Mass Community is a separate entity and they are using another parish’s facility. Cleaning , lights, gas, wear and tear, plowing the church parking lot, all cost money.

Its a cost sharing proposal and the $72,000 is for the whole year.

Agreed. Why should the TLM participants not carry the burden of the extra costs?

 

[estesbob]

Because that’s a ton of money. Why should people have to pay that much money just to attend Mass. What ever happened to putting what you think is necessary in the collection tray. I always give more to small parishes, because I think that they need it. However the Church has no room to force people to pay to attend Mass.

Ton of Money? $6,000 a month. If 125 attend they would have to contibute about $13 a week to cover the exenses.

 

[cecilia97]

Every church in our diocese pays an annual DSF fee of roughly the same amount…on top of our regular parish building maintenance, utilities, office staff salaries, etc. Sounds like it’s DSF under a different name.

And yes, our parish is about 50% Spanish-speaking. Every parish pays the DSF no matter what.

Diocesan Services Fund pays for all the things a parish gets from the diocese…Tribunal services, cathedral building, seminary, admin support, etc.

 

[John_Higgins]

What some are not understanding is that this is not St. Norbert’s adding a TLM or changing one of their vernacular Masses. It’s a new community. There is no building given them, at least right now.

Abp. Burke set up a Latin Mass parish in St. Louis. He assigned a priest and a building. Quite likely the bishop in Maine doesn’t have a church just sitting there waiting for the TLM.

The bishop has 138 parishes, 58 missions and 158 diocesan priests. Doubtless it’s a resource issue. How 'bout cutting this prelate some slack?

Excommunication? Tell me, holden, where in Canon Law is there a justification for excommunication? There isn’t? Thought so.

Goodness.

John

 

[Kielbasi]

And yes, our parish is about 50% Spanish-speaking. Every parish pays the DSF no matter what.

In some parts of the country, Spanish speaking Catholics are a lot smaller minority than they are where you’re at. In Pittsburgh, (and apparently Portland) , the diocese has set up a separate parish for Spanish speakers and that is what was referred to.

 

[Spiller]

Some times there is a line to be drawn. You need to stop bashing the SSPX. They didn’t want this situation they were in; they were founded on Catholic principles with full approval before some possesed hierarchs faught tooth and nail to lie about Archbishop Lefebvre and the SSPX. You think they wanted it? You think the priests of Campos wanted Bishop Navarro to throw long serving priests out of their parishes by use of police force and the courts? Or to have Novus Ordo priests lie about holy priests and bishops to the point that a sickly priest broke down during a homily and passed off to his eternal reward as a result of all the pain that they put him through? That is nuts. It is like our Lord being spat upon and crucified once again. I know the insults won’t stop, but ultimately the more times they will be bashed I know for sure the more I know our Lord is telling us to pray for holy priests so that this crisis may be over and that He may reign in the hearts of all men, women, and children.

SSPX is off-limits right now!

 

[Spiller]

The Bishop of this diocese should be excommunicated. That’s the only way to handle people like this. We can’t just slap them on the wrist, and say don’t do that again. We must allow them to no do it again, aka excommunication.

:hypno:

 

[Harmony1988]

I think the bishop needs to intervene in this matter, if not, the Vatican themselves directly.
$72,000 a year is ridiculous.

 

[planter654]

It doesn’t sound that terrible at all.

The Latin Mass Community is a separate entity and they are using another parish’s facility. Cleaning , lights, gas, wear and tear, plowing the church parking lot, all cost money.

Its a cost sharing proposal and the $72,000 is for the whole year.

Could this be the beginning and be a wave of the future for other churches?

God Bless

 

[Spiller]

I think the bishop needs to intervene in this matter, if not, the Vatican themselves directly.
$72,000 a year is ridiculous.

Specifically who should pay the $72K? And if you think that $72K is “ridiculous”, why and how much should it be?

 

[Spiller]

Could this be the beginning and be a wave of the future for other churches?

God Bless

What’s new about it?

 

[cecilia97]

In some parts of the country, Spanish speaking Catholics are a lot smaller minority than they are where you’re at. In Pittsburgh, (and apparently Portland) , the diocese has set up a separate parish for Spanish speakers and that is what was referred to.

But surely most dioceses have something like the DSF, no matter what language a parish speaks. This “fee” for the TLM sure sounds like that…because DSF is on top of all the regular expenses associated with land, buildings, and personnel.

 

[lovesMary]

Wow, it sounds as if a lot of Catholics expect the Church to be like the Welfare State, with someone else footing the bill.

That’s why the Evangelicals are making inroads in gathering followers. They put their money where their mouths are. We can learn from our Protestant Brethren.

 

[holdencaulfield]

Ton of Money? $6,000 a month. If 125 attend they would have to contibute about $13 a week to cover the exenses.

Ok fine, I guess I wasn’t really paying attention. It just seemed like a lot when I first posted. You guys win it’s not a lot of money.

 

[tcraig]

This TLM community has been in place for years, and has been refused an (ostensibly free of charge) FSSP priest when they indicated they could provide one willing and able.

I’m not sure when FSSP priests became free of charge.

I used to attend a TLM with FSSP priests, and saw the financial statements that were provided every year. There was a mortgage payment for the priests’ housing, utility costs, priest salaries, health insurance costs, cable TV bill, telephone bills, housekeepers’ salaries for both priestly residence and the church, groundskeeper salary for the church, church supplies and church secretary salary … I could go on, but it all added up and it was all paid for by parishioner donations. And it was a LOT more than $72,000/year.

They eventually got their own church (which added in church mortgage to the costs) but prior to that had to pay an “upkeep” fee for the borrowed facilities. The article describes it as a rental fee. However you want to describe it, it covers the expenses for lights, water, heating/cooling … those costs are much more than people realize. And if a group of Catholics wants/needs to share church facilities on a permanent/semi-permanent basis, then it only makes sense that they also share church expenses.

From the article, it appears that a priest is being assigned exclusively to the TLM community. And really, this sounds no different from a parish mission growing and proving that they have the people and can absorb the costs of becoming a full-fledged parish church. The TLM community is just being required to “prove” itself a little quicker.

 

[Spiller]

Wow, it sounds as if a lot of Catholics expect the Church to be like the Welfare State, with someone else footing the bill.

That’s why the Evangelicals are making inroads in gathering followers. They put their money where their mouths are. We can learn from our Protestant Brethren.

True! The difference is ASTOUNDING!!!

Let’s say someone makes $50K/year. Not a huge paycheck by any means. If they are Protestant, many will actually tithe 10% or $5K/year. That’s just about $100.00/week.

Just think about how much you give at Sunday Mass. A buck? Ten? Maybe twenty? At $20.00/week the ratio is still 5:1 which is astounding. Even at $50.00/week, my tithing Protestant counterpart gives TWICE what I give.

It adds up…