Patriarch of Moscow Cyril - There is only One Church!

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You did not refute any of the points though. He would get rid of all Catholics in Russia too if he could. Don’t be fooled.

This particular patriarch is meddling in the politics of war which is never a good idea. Even encouraging war.

Not the province of a religious leader or someone to admire in my humble opinion. Why the other EO patriarchs don’t pull him into line I don’t know, hopefully they have and he will tone down the rhetoric.
Why would any EO Patriarch put Moscow Patriarch in line. ROC is the biggest donor and helper of the Orthodox Churches. For example, they gave 30 millions euros donation to the Serbian Church to finish building it’s main cathedral. The Churches of Jerusalem, Antioch, Alexandria were literally saved in 19th century because of the donations made by the Russian Emperors and the Russian Church.
Plus, what Moscow Patriarch does in his own jurisdiction is not the concern of other Patriarchs. At least he did not call for crusade 😛
 
Hi Starwarsfan2. Interesting that you should appear at this particular time, because I was just thinking what one of your fellow Lutherans said: Is there anyway I can excommunicate myself from this conversation?

But I digress …

That’s propaganda. See ewtn.com/v/experts/showmessage.asp?number=329700
There was the reason why I said temporarily, I was just making the point that they tried to implement the council , but eventually failed , poor wording on my part .

Keep the faith Peter , Starwars 🙂
 
Interesting way of putting it. :cool: I was thinking that it was “open season on Orthodoxy” once more, but this time with more arrows flying in the opposite direction as well.

Anyhow, I’m personally not very interested in either (see my preceding quote from lutheransatire) … maybe I should go see what’s on Headbook.
 
Plus, what Moscow Patriarch does in his own jurisdiction is not the concern of other Patriarchs. At least he did not call for crusade 😛
Depends who you ask aoiusa.org/russia-fights-for-christianity-in-syria-the-us-fights-against-it/:
Vsevolod Chaplin, head of the Church’s Public Affairs Department,

The fight with terrorism is a holy battle and today our country is perhaps the most active force in the world fighting it. The Russian Federation has made a responsible decision on the use of armed forces to defend the People of Syria from the sorrows caused by the arbitrariness of terrorists. Christians are suffering in the region with the kidnapping of clerics and the destruction of churches. Muslims are suffering no less.
 
Depends who you ask aoiusa.org/russia-fights-for-christianity-in-syria-the-us-fights-against-it/:
Vsevolod Chaplin, head of the Church’s Public Affairs Department,

The fight with terrorism is a holy battle and today our country is perhaps the most active force in the world fighting it. The Russian Federation has made a responsible decision on the use of armed forces to defend the People of Syria from the sorrows caused by the arbitrariness of terrorists. Christians are suffering in the region with the kidnapping of clerics and the destruction of churches. Muslims are suffering no less.
Let’s hope they don’t sack Constantinople 😛 Or Fanar to be more precise. lol
 
Lol Unitatis Redintegratio did not break with tradition.
Says you. Unitatis Redintegratio specifically breaks with the Augustinian tradition of regarding baptisms outside of the church as valid but ineffectual which was predominant in the West. Indeed, if you read the words of the theologians who drafted it, it’s quite clear that this was their intention.
What you call bullocks is true a the sky is blue. Flip flop is what the Byzantines
What is a Byzantine?
have been known for. Even when we see in communion. How many compromises did the Greeks make with heretics that caused controversy.
Indeed, they often made compromises, and those who did found themselves condemned, just as Pope Honorius found himself condemned.
That never changed after the schism but only got worse. Sadly…
The irony of such words. I would agree, yes, that some tried compromising with heretics after the schism. One very famous incident occurred under the reign of Michael VIII, and another under the reign of John VIII. Thankfully, God preserved them from the monstrous heresies to which those two emperors submitted.
 
Let’s hope they don’t sack Constantinople 😛 Or Fanar to be more precise. lol
Or Ukraine, Georgia, Latvia, Finland, Bulgaria, Armenia, Denmark, the Syriac Patriarchate, the Assyrian or Chaldean Patriarchate, the Melkite Patriarchate, the Maronite Patriarchate or any other area where these terrorists aren’t.
 
Not just countryside, jurisdiction over Italy. Nations such as France, Austria, Germany, Spain… are more than mature to have their own Patriarchates.
But the bishop of Rome would be first among equal among all Patriarchs.
There may be differences of opinion among Orthodox about residual jurisdiction of the “Patriarch of Rome”. Some very knowledgeable Orthodox have said the “Patriarch of Rome” would have jurisdiction over the city of Rome and some portion of the surrounding countryside only. But in any event, and whatever his jurisdiction might be, he would be Orthodox, not Catholic.

The Orthodox position really is not reunion but the disappearance of the Catholic Church entirely. The likelihood of Catholicism volunteering for that is zero, of course, meaning reunion is not agreeable to Orthodoxy at all.

I’m not totally sure all of the churchmen subject to the Patriarchate of Constantinople would be adamant about the disappearance of the Catholic Church. But again, that’s a very small number of people.
 
The Russian Federation has made a responsible decision on the use of armed forces to defend the People of Syria from the sorrows caused by the arbitrariness of terrorists. Christians are suffering in the region with the kidnapping of clerics and the destruction of churches. Muslims are suffering no less.
I am not sure I would credit Russia with being the saving Crusader yet. We don’t know yet what Putin’s plan is. Suffice it to say he could have gone to the Christians’ defense back when they were not all killed or gone, but didn’t. Right now, his alliance is with Iran in defense of an Iranian agent, Assad.

I don’t think any of us know how the fight over there is going to turn out. Quite possibly neither Putin nor the Iranian Mullahs do either.

Don’t get the wrong impression from this post. Obama did nothing to help Christians either at the time when it could have helped. Neither Putin nor Obama care a thing about them, and Iran certainly doesn’t. Ultimately, I believe Syrian Christians will all end up as citizens of Europe, the U.S., Turkey or a quasi-independent Kurdistan.
 
I am not sure I would credit Russia with being the saving Crusader yet. We don’t know yet what Putin’s plan is. Suffice it to say he could have gone to the Christians’ defense back when they were not all killed or gone, but didn’t. Right now, his alliance is with Iran in defense of an Iranian agent, Assad.

I don’t think any of us know how the fight over there is going to turn out. Quite possibly neither Putin nor the Iranian Mullahs do either.

Don’t get the wrong impression from this post. Obama did nothing to help Christians either at the time when it could have helped. Neither Putin nor Obama care a thing about them, and Iran certainly doesn’t. Ultimately, I believe Syrian Christians will all end up as citizens of Europe, the U.S., Turkey or a quasi-independent Kurdistan.
The Orthodox Patriarchate of Antioch praised Russian intervention. So i praise it too. They know their situation better than us. Especially his holiness Patriarch John X, who’s brother was kidnapped at the beginning of the war, before the Islamic State emerged, but those “moderate” opposition did it. He was/is metropolitan of Allepo, where “revolution” against Assad’s “tyranny” started.
 
Lol Unitatis Redintegratio did not break with tradition. What you call bullocks is true a the sky is blue. Flip flop is what the Byzantines have been known for. Even when we see in communion. How many compromises did the Greeks make with heretics that caused controversy. That never changed after the schism but only got worse. Sadly…
What exactly are you referring to?
 
Let’s hope they don’t sack Constantinople…this happened hundreds of years ago by rogue Crusaders.

What about the thousands of Latins killed for their commercial success in years prior?

What about the pope who called on the Western kings to help fight the Muslims attacking Constantinople??

I don’t live in any schism.
 
I am not sure I would credit Russia with being the saving Crusader yet. We don’t know yet what Putin’s plan is. Suffice it to say he could have gone to the Christians’ defense back when they were not all killed or gone, but didn’t. Right now, his alliance is with Iran in defense of an Iranian agent, Assad.

I don’t think any of us know how the fight over there is going to turn out. Quite possibly neither Putin nor the Iranian Mullahs do either.

Don’t get the wrong impression from this post. Obama did nothing to help Christians either at the time when it could have helped. Neither Putin nor Obama care a thing about them, and Iran certainly doesn’t. Ultimately, I believe Syrian Christians will all end up as citizens of Europe, the U.S., Turkey or a quasi-independent Kurdistan.
👍
 
I have great esteem now for Putin. And it is an answer to prayer he and the Russian Orthodox have offered to return the Hagia Sophia back to its rightful place as a great and magnificent holy place for the Christians.

Putin is also bearing truth to the reality of Turkey and its Islamic plans to invade Europe through ‘refugees’. It has been happening on our southern border but more from South American Marxism and evil drug cartels.

I would rather say we are witnessing the effects of so many prayers and rosaries for the conversion of atheists in Russia, and our prayers supporting the Orthodox believers who have suffered so much under communism.

I don’t think Russia is the true church because it came around 1,000 years after Christ and when people say it is the true church, it sounds like 1800’s American restorationists who say there was no true church until they came along.
 
I have great esteem now for Putin. And it is an answer to prayer he and the Russian Orthodox have offered to return the Hagia Sophia back to its rightful place as a great and magnificent holy place for the Christians.

Putin is also bearing truth to the reality of Turkey and its Islamic plans to invade Europe through ‘refugees’. It has been happening on our southern border but more from South American Marxism and evil drug cartels.

I would rather say we are witnessing the effects of so many prayers and rosaries for the conversion of atheists in Russia, and our prayers supporting the Orthodox believers who have suffered so much under communism.

I don’t think Russia is the true church because it came around 1,000 years after Christ and when people say it is the true church, it sounds like 1800’s American restorationists who say there was no true church until they came along.
Russian Orthodox Church was blessed and received Apostolic Succession from all 4 Ancient Orthodox Patriarchates.
 
Yes…and Russia came after. And Rome was founded by SS Peter and Paul, both sealing their title as founders by their martyrdom by Emperor Nero between 64 to 67 AD…so Rome has been around a long time.

The Roman Church is most universal because it has the papacy.

I have great respect for the Russian Orthodox and as a child suffered for them hearing what happened to them by the communists. Terrible. Pope Pius XII was more fearful of communism than he was of Naziism.

There are events in council history where some times the pope would have the last say and other times the Eastern bishops.

Do you know what papal infallibility is? It was only defined at Vatican I in the 1850’s. Infallibility is the first dogma. The other two are Mary’s Immaculate Conception and the Orthodox believe she is sinless. And then the other, Mary’s Assumption into heaven. Mary did not sin. The wages of sin are death. We assume…assumption…she was gloriously taken up to heaven but we do not know how. That is all.

Papal infallibility is when the pope looks at the faith of the common people and how they have had certain points of faith not found in the bible, more in the ‘sense’ of the bible. Mary was held as perpetual virgin by ancient Christians.

So in papal infallibility, the pope then goes back and consults with all the bishops. And if they give their full consent to the pope, then the pope can declare a dogma of faith.

No pope can declare a dogma of faith without it lived out in the common people and with full consent by the local bishops.

As it is now, there is nothing else to define canonically. So how the pope speaks formally is through pastoral letters, or, encyclicals.

Many Catholics themselves do not understand papal infallibility.

And going back to the Council of Florence, the pope was seeking to be head, so he could have the authority by all to keep Christianity together as one.

You come to America you go up and down any neighborhood, you see so many Christian churches where they cannot tolerate worshipping with each other. The whittling down of Christianity to personal opinion as brought a death to Western culture.

The Roman Church HAS to define our beliefs and practices because it is universal, it is going out constantly to reach and evangelize new people, as well as deal with the 44,000 derivatives of Protestantism. How close are they to us or how far away? in terms of their converting and becoming Catholic.
 
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