Paul Ryan!!

[salusanimarum17]

“As a constituent of congressman Ryan and a Catholic priest, I am disappointed by his cruel budget plan and outraged that he defends it on moral grounds.”
-Father Thomas Kelly

Where did you find this quote? I’d like to see what Father has to say about the specifics of the plan. This comment, by itself, is basically useless.

 

[PJD1987]

Where did you find this quote? I’d like to see what Father has to say about the specifics of the plan. This comment, by itself, is basically useless.

Father Kelly, NETWORK, and the USCCB’s response has already been debunked earlier in this thread and will continue to be pointed out as in inaccurate as long as those who refuse to acknowledge the facts that have already pointed to the folly of this claim continue to bring it up.

God bless.

-Paul

 

[lonelypetunia]

“As a constituent of congressman Ryan and a Catholic priest, I am disappointed by his cruel budget plan and outraged that he defends it on moral grounds.”
-Father Thomas Kelly

Thank you!! I feel the same way about the budget plan being cruel.

 

[PJD1987]

Thank you!! I feel the same way about the budget plan being cruel.

Please see previous responses to this misunderstanding of Catholic Social Teaching. Mr. Ryan’s plan is in line with Catholic Social Teaching. Even if it is not perfect, it is a heck of a lot closer than the anti-religion, pro-abortion president we have in office now.

So, it’s essentially a moot point anyhow. As faithful Catholics we cannot vote for a pro-abortion candidate. It is very simple.

Not to mention, to believe that Mr. Ryan’s plan would be passed without any modifications is pure silliness, that is not going to happen.

God bless.

-Paul

 

[JoeBowen7]

As faithful Catholics we cannot vote for a pro-abortion candidate. It is very simple.

If we pass laws to ban abortion, or just in general, what should be the punishment for a woman who kills her child by abortion or by taking abortifacient birth control pills?

 

[rlg94086]

How Catholics vote really is not an issue for me. I do find it facinating though the difference of opinions among Catholics here on voting between Romney - Ryan and Obama - Biden. With some in both camps considering themselves practicing from what I gather. But I don’t say you have to believe as I believe. You’ve confused me though on one thing from your post. Are you saying Catholics can be practicing even if they don’t follow teaching?

It depends on your definition of “practicing Catholic.” I consider a “practicing Catholic” as one who is not only a baptized Catholic, but someone who attends Mass and Confession regularly and receives Communion. Some practicing Catholics are not faithful Catholics. Iow, they disagree with some teaching of the Church, even though they attend Mass and Confession regularly and receive Communion. They may or may not be receiving worthily, but that is between them, their pastor/confessor, and Our Lord.

 

[rlg94086]

No, I did not. You chose not to read this:

and this:

Not to mention many other posts on many threads in which I re-state Catholic priorities.

Thanks for not reading.

So I will repeat: it is immaterial whether or not abortion specifically is mentioned. All the rest of the Democratic Party platform also opposes the social teaching of the Roman Catholic Church, as LisaA mentioned earlier, as various bishops have also mentioned, etc. The argument that liberal Catholics like to bring up is that Democrats support Catholic social justice. Overall, they do not, even without the consideration of the intrinsic evil of abortion. That was the point of my post, Robert, not a diferent point, or your point.

Had you followed any of my posts over 3.5 years, you would be clear that I have shown that the so-called Democratic “social justice” platform supports abortion even indirectly, in related policies, not to mention their overt support. I refuse to cite and paste all of my posts here. The argument I was discussing was not an abortion-vote argument but a Catholic social justice argument, in which the Democrats come up short on all counts (vs. supporting social justice on all counts). The position of the “social justice” Catholics is that the Democrats support born life more than the Republicans. And I’ve shown repeatedly how that is flagrantly untrue.

I was referring to your comments in that post, not the totality of your posts in the thread and/or on CAF.

If you can find your mention of abortion in that post, where you were summarizing how neither of the major parties meet the teaching of Catholic social teaching, then I accept your criticism. If not, I stand by my comments regarding you omission of abortion in your summary. :tiphat:

 

[Havard]

It depends on your definition of “practicing Catholic.” I consider a “practicing Catholic” as one who is not only a baptized Catholic, but someone who attends Mass and Confession regularly and receives Communion. Some practicing Catholics are not faithful Catholics. Iow, they disagree with some teaching of the Church, even though they attend Mass and Confession regularly and receive Communion. They may or may not be receiving worthily, but that is between them, their pastor/confessor, and Our Lord.

This is the definition of “practicing” that most people I know use as well.

 

[jsmith354]

If we pass laws to ban abortion, or just in general, what should be the punishment for a woman who kills her child by abortion or by taking abortifacient birth control pills?

Jesus judges, not us. But we know His commandments. Thou Shall not Kill. I could never vote for anyone in any office that supported abortion or were against any other commandment or divine inspirations that Our Lord has given us throughout the years. Even His Saints have given us more information via the Doctors of the Church. But no, we do not judge, the Lord judges. We just have to follow the commandments and Thou Shall Not Kill covers abortion, murdering a baby, no that person running for any office does not get my vote ever!! We are Catholics and need to follow all Catholic rules, God’s commandments, you name it, to be Catholic is to live like a Catholic all the way. If you oppose any of God’s rules or the rules of the Catholic church, you are not a Catholic, that was what I was taught by the nuns and priests for many years.
jeannie

 

[PJD1987]

If we pass laws to ban abortion, or just in general, what should be the punishment for a woman who kills her child by abortion or by taking abortifacient birth control pills?

First of all, this is a red herring and not really related to the fact that we cannot vote for a pro-abortion candidate. Secondly, penalties pre-Roe v Wade typically were imposed on the abortionist not the women. The women need to be counseled and given alternative options and restored to believe in the dignity of human life before EVER making the horrible decision to get an abortion in the first place. That is what the ultimate goal is, to change hearts and minds and restore human dignity to every life, even those still in the womb.

Thus, the answer to abortion is a pre-emptive strike to essentially end it as an option all together before it even gets to that point.

But this is a distraction to the main issue, and putting the cart before the horse. The point is that the Church has been VERY clear on this, and we as Catholic’s cannot vote for a pro-abortion candidate. The rest is a non-issue. If a Catholic votes for a pro-abortion candidate they are committing a grave sin and elevating themselves above the judgment and authority of the Holy Father, Magisterium and Church of Jesus Christ.

I hope and pray you are not suggesting that a Catholic is free to vote for a pro-abortion candidate.

God bless.

-Paul

 

[PJD1987]

Jesus judges, not us. But we know His commandments. Thou Shall not Kill. I could never vote for anyone in any office that supported abortion or were against any other commandment or divine inspirations that Our Lord has given us throughout the years. Even His Saints have given us more information via the Doctors of the Church. But no, we do not judge, the Lord judges. We just have to follow the commandments and Thou Shall Not Kill covers abortion, murdering a baby, no that person running for any office does not get my vote ever!! We are Catholics and need to follow all Catholic rules, God’s commandments, you name it, to be Catholic is to live like a Catholic all the way. If you oppose any of God’s rules or the rules of the Catholic church, you are not a Catholic, that was what I was taught by the nuns and priests for many years.
jeannie

Amen.

 

[LisaA]

Father Kelly is a liberal priest that is tied up with NETWORK and Sr. Simone Campbell and other heterodox Catholics and Catholic groups that misrepresent misunderstand and distort the faith to further their agenda.

Fact.

I will take the opinion of Cardinal Dolan and the other Bishops over Father Thomas Kelly, with all due respect.

God bless.

-Paul

Oh mercy me, absolutely. Just saw Sr Campbell on TV trying to explain why she supports huge bloated government programs when poverty has INCREASED byt 4% since they were instituted. She of course obfuscated, changed the subject and never got back to Catholic Social Teaching which says nothing about sending your money to a large and impersonal bureacracy to distribute. There are no answers when you ask why after literally trillions of dollars have been spent on various programs to “help” the poor that we have generational poverty and dependence in increasing percentages.

I haven’t quite figured out why the Left is so enamoured of letting government take their money and pass it around. Why do they trust the government to effectively and efficiently address the problems our country is facing with debt, imploding programs and an aging population?

There is an entire sub-genre of clergy and religious that have taken the “Social Gospel” to heart and have apparently dispensed with the actual Gospel and its teachings. One thing about the Ryan nomination though, even his political enemies admit we have a sharp contrast between two opposite approaches to our country’s problems.

Lisa

 

[PJD1987]

Oh mercy me, absolutely. Just saw Sr Campbell on TV trying to explain why she supports huge bloated government programs when poverty has INCREASED byt 4% since they were instituted. She of course obfuscated, changed the subject and never got back to Catholic Social Teaching which says nothing about sending your money to a large and impersonal bureacracy to distribute. There are no answers when you ask why after literally trillions of dollars have been spent on various programs to “help” the poor that we have generational poverty and dependence in increasing percentages.

I haven’t quite figured out why the Left is so enamoured of letting government take their money and pass it around. Why do they trust the government to effectively and efficiently address the problems our country is facing with debt, imploding programs and an aging population?

There is an entire sub-genre of clergy and religious that have taken the “Social Gospel” to heart and have apparently dispensed with the actual Gospel and its teachings. One thing about the Ryan nomination though, even his political enemies admit we have a sharp contrast between two opposite approaches to our country’s problems.

Lisa

When I saw Simone Campbell on O’Reilly I nearly died. I did not expect that!

It was frustrating to sit through that interview knowing the misrepresentation of the faith she consistently provides and is given a national platform to preach it from.

What happened to faithful and obedient nuns/sisters in habits, praying for the Church and the souls of the faithful?!?!?!

When did nuns/sisters turn into PAC’s and social justice lobbyists?

I’m glad she did at least finally mention the name of Our Lord, albeit in the last throwaway sentence of the interview.

Anyway, way off topic I know…but I had to say it!!! sigh so disappointing…

God bless.

-Paul

 

[tarboy]

Here Abyssinia, since you like polls so much. Ryan pick less popular than Palin, Cheney, and Quayle.

washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/post/paul-ryan-pick-is-less-popular-than-palin-cheney-selections-poll-shows/2012/08/13/6577a26a-e557-11e1-8f62-58260e3940a0_blog.html

Looking at how most of those picks finished up, I wouldn’t be too concerned about he first blush. Given time he will prove to be an asset to the campaign

 

[PJD1987]

Looking at how most of those picks finished up, I wouldn’t be too concerned about he first blush. Given time he will prove to be an asset to the campaign

It is also a fatally flawed poll as discussed here:

breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/08/13/usa-today-produces-meaningless-poll-to-attack-ryan

God bless.

-Paul

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

Good idea, except I really don’t want to draw more attention to this, since it would perhaps makes some people actually carry out on the threat and kill the girl…which is why I didn’t mention the name of the climate scientist.

But I do think Obama should point out how pro-death Romney/Ryan are on environmental and other issues.

And I do think Obama should do a lot more to help reduce abortions in America. I suppose improved health care is one small step so that women will feel they can better afford to have their children. But a whole lot more needs to be done.

I think it would be easier to get Obama into reducing abortions than Romney/Ryan into reducing environmental harms to life on earth…esp since they are so heavily funded by people with opposite interests.

Pro death on environmental issues…

 

[followyourbliss]

George Will:

When Ryan said in Norfolk, “We won’t replace our Founding principles, we will reapply them,” he effectively challenged Obama to say what Obama believes, which is: Madison was an extremist in enunciating the principles of limited government — the enumeration and separation of powers. And Jefferson was an extremist in asserting that government exists not to grant rights but to “secure” natural rights that pre-exist government.

Romney’s selection of a running mate was, in method and outcome, presidential. It underscores how little in the last four years merits that adjective.

washingtonpost.com/opinions/george-will-romneys-presidential-pick/2012/08/12/9075c0e4-e48c-11e1-936a-b801f1abab19_story.html?wprss=rss_opinions

I guess he liked the pick.

Isn’t it quaint that in 2012 we’re still debating the Jefferson/Madison split. Also interesting how selective the GOP is on State’s Rights (support it for gun control, oppose it when Obama offers welfare waivers to states who want to innovate–Romney applied for one of those waivers from the Bush admin, but now whines about Obama offering the same program). It’s all so selective.

 

[jsmith354]

When I saw Simone Campbell on O’Reilly I nearly died. I did not expect that!

It was frustrating to sit through that interview knowing the misrepresentation of the faith she consistently provides and is given a national platform to preach it from.

What happened to faithful and obedient nuns/sisters in habits, praying for the Church and the souls of the faithful?!?!?!

When did nuns/sisters turn into PAC’s and social justice lobbyists?

I’m glad she did at least finally mention the name of Our Lord, albeit in the last throwaway sentence of the interview.

Anyway, way off topic I know…but I had to say it!!! sigh so disappointing…

God bless.

-Paul

 

[meltzerboy]

Pro death on environmental issues…

I don’t think it’s a laughing matter when the earth and its creatures, including the human species, are being slowly poisoned, either for the present or future generations. We, as a species, are often infuriatingly slow to react to impending disaster, whether it is energy depletion due to excessive consumption and dependence on foreign oil, climate change, the current debt crisis, corporate greed including the banking, insurance, and pharmaceutical industries, or the erosion of our civil and religious liberties. It’s all one package, and we need bold leaders, not partisans, who can provide at least partial solutions to the challenges confronting us all.

 

[jsmith354]

Paul,
I totally agree with you, I just saw the Nun on O’Reilly’s show and boy this nun is nothing like the nuns that taught me for several years. According to Jesus, they should be out helping the sick, the poor, and spreading the word of God. This Nun is an attorney/lobbyist who thinks that is the Federal Government’s job to feed the poor and clothe the naked. Perhaps that is why the Vatican admonished the largest organization of Nuns in the country that they don’t seem to be in their habits and out doing the Church’s business, but instead lobbying the Federal Government to do it for them.
jeannie