Paul VI, nuns and contraception: did Pope Francis get it right?

[_Abyssinia]

Vatican City, Feb 24, 2016 / 05:09 pm (CNA/EWTN News).- If Vatican watcher Sandro Magister is right, Pope Francis cited an urban legend about Blessed Paul VI’s alleged approval of contraception for nuns in exceptional wartime circumstances in the Congo.

“No one has ever been able to cite a single word of his in this regard. Yet this urban legend has been kept alive for decades, and sure enough even Francis and his spokesman have fallen for it,” Magister wrote Sept. 22 at Settimo Cielo; the text appeared in English at Chiesa two days later.

The story dates back to 1961, when St. John XXIII was Pope. Moral theologians considered whether it was licit for nuns facing direct threat of rape to use contraception. The question arose from situations such as a brutal war that was then underway in the Congo.

catholicnewsagency.com/news/paul-vi-nuns-and-contraception-did-pope-francis-get-it-right-84195/

 

[Lormar]

Fr. Z, on February 20th, wrote about this and gives the background. “It’s not an urban legend, it’s a LIE: Paul VI did NOT give permission to nuns to use contraceptives” is the name of the article in case anyone wants to read it.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Fr. Z, on February 20th, wrote about this and gives the background. “It’s not an urban legend, it’s a LIE: Paul VI did NOT give permission to nuns to use contraceptives” is the name of the article in case anyone wants to read it.

Perhaps the pope has more visibility and knowlege by his very position to know what happened than even fr. Z. Though these days I wish it was holy father Z…

 

[jinglebelle]

Francis,is the Pope,get over it

 

[Rau]

Fr. Z, on February 20th, wrote about this and gives the background. “It’s not an urban legend, it’s a LIE: Paul VI did NOT give permission to nuns to use contraceptives” is the name of the article in case anyone wants to read it.

It would be more productive had Fr. Z responded along these lines:

1. I don’t know what Pope Paul VI (or other Church authority) did or did not do on this matter all those years ago;
2. And frankly, I don’t know whether Francis knew for a fact what Paul/Church authority did or did not do, or merely believes it to be so;
3. More importantly - I do know that Pope Paul VI would not knowingly authorise any immoral act;
4. And most important of all - Authorising the taking of a pill with contraceptive effect (and - as far as he knew - no abortive effect) would not be to authorise the moral ill of contraception or any other moral ill. It would be to confirm that such act is a licit act of defence against potential rape - which is itself an evil act, with no redeeming qualities - and an act which continues after the rapist has withdrawn. [The progress of semen post a rape is not deserving of any respect or non-interference.]

That response would have helped set the ship on an even keel.

 

[PatrickC]

Why do grey areas challenge the faith of zealots so often?

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Why do grey areas challenge the faith of zealots so often?

What do you mean?

 

[twf]

Francis,is the Pope,get over it

That doesn’t necessarily mean that everything he says is beyond reproach. St. Paul felt obliged to challenge St. Peter when he was in the wrong. I’m not saying the Pope is wrong in this case, but the material I’ve read makes a pretty convincing case that Pope Paul never did grant the permission the currently Holy Father thinks he did.
Even popes make mistakes. Even popes have fallible, human minds.

 

[deaconjohnO]

Francis,is the Pope,get over it

I don’t think that is the problem. The problem is the fact that it is VERY unlikely Pope Paul VI made any comments regarding contraceptives in the Congo. The fact that there isn’s a sliver of evidence Paul VI said such a thing coupled with the fact it is contrary to Humanae Vitae indicates it’s a myth.

If this is the Case it might be in order to apologize out of respect for Blessed Paul VI that the inaccurate information was presented publicly by the Vicar of Christ.

In another month we all will know more about this Pope, provided he releases a post synod document.

 

[JPUSC]

After becoming confused from Pope Francis’ comments, I did some investigation and “Humanae Vitae” is not a document of the infallible magisterium? The teaching contained therein does not bear the highest guarantee of certitude? (ewtn.com/library/Theology/AUTHUMVT.HTM)

No pope since 1870 has designated an encyclical as an exercise of papal infallibility, which requires three conditions: 1) the subject is a matter of faith or morals, 2) the pope must be teaching as supreme pastor, and 3) the pope must indicate that the teaching is infallible.

stanthonymessenger.org/AskAFranciscan/Question.aspx?Question=176

The Catechism of the Catholic Church itself isn’t infallible either.

What infallible document(s) exists on the teaching of contraception? Are these teachings based solely on interpretations of the Bible?

Catholic Answers Tract:

Ignoring the mountain of evidence, some maintain that the Church considers the use of contraception a matter for each married couple to decide according to their “individual conscience.” Yet, nothing could be further from the truth. The Church has always maintained the historic Christian teaching that deliberate acts of contraception are always gravely sinful, which means that it is mortally sinful if done with full knowledge and deliberate consent (CCC 1857). This teaching cannot be changed and has been taught by the Church infallibly.

There is no way to deny the fact that the Church has always and everywhere condemned artificial contraception. The matter has already been infallibly decided. The so-called “individual conscience” argument amounts to “individual disobedience.”

catholic.com/tracts/birth-control

Maybe Catholic Answers needs update their literature in light of recent developments? The church leaders below suggest it’s a matter of “individual conscience.”

“The contraceptive or condom, in particular cases of emergency or gravity, could be the object of discernment in a serious case of conscience. This is what the Pope said.”

Father Federico Lombardi, Papal Spokesman

[Pope Francis] however usefully called attention to two important moral precepts: First, there may be circumstances that invite a re-evaluation of the judgment on artificial means of contraception; second, the prodding of conscience should always be heeded, as long as every effort is made to form conscience properly.

These positions are not in any way new. They have always formed part of Catholic moral theology and belong to the treasury of the Church’s heritage in health-care ethics.

Catholic Bishops’ Conference of the Philippines

 

[SyroMalankara]

After becoming confused from Pope Francis’ comments, I did some investigation and “Humanae Vitae” is not a document of the infallible magisterium? The teaching contained therein does not bear the highest guarantee of certitude? (ewtn.com/library/Theology/AUTHUMVT.HTM)

HV is a document of the ordinary magisterium, not an exercise of extraordinary papal infallibility. Both bear the highest guarantee of certitude.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church itself isn’t infallible either.

Not sure what you mean, but I think you are confusing extraordinary exercises in infallibilty with the ordinary teaching authority of the Church which is also infallible and of moral certitude.

What infallible document(s) exists on the teaching of contraception? Are these teachings based solely on interpretations of the Bible?

The Bible, the teachings of the Fathers, etc.

Maybe Catholic Answers needs update their literature in light of recent developments? The church leaders below suggest it’s a matter of “individual conscience.”

It’s not so they shouldn’t.

 

[loumeland]

Pope Francis is in the best position to know what his predecessors did, or did not do, regarding this matter. He is possibly the most Christlike person on the face of this earth, and I’ve noticed that several people react to his “off the cuff” comments in the same way the conservative Pharisees reacted to Jesus’ revolutionary teachings.

The Pope is not “confusing,” “too old for this,” or “anti-intellectual.” He is truly a genius and God’s man for our times. If his encyclicals are tough for a certain type of people to accept, it’s just that: a tough pill to swallow. After all, HH Francis tends to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comforted!

 

[Cider]

You mean like people that actually believe and follow church teaching

 

[ProVobis]

Maybe Catholic Answers needs update their literature in light of recent developments? The church leaders below suggest it’s a matter of “individual conscience.”

The word “conscience” appears in Paul VI’s document Populorum Progressio. Perhaps this is the most misapplied principle in all his documents.

 

[Rau]

I don’t think that is the problem. The problem is the fact that it is VERY unlikely Pope Paul VI made any comments regarding contraceptives in the Congo. The fact that there isn’s a sliver of evidence Paul VI said such a thing coupled with the fact it is contrary to Humanae Vitae indicates it’s a myth.

If this is the Case it might be in order to apologize out of respect for Blessed Paul VI that the inaccurate information was presented publicly by the Vicar of Christ.

In another month we all will know more about this Pope, provided he releases a post synod document.

Have you not read the explanation on this thread and others explaining how contraception is not possible in rape? Are you not aware of the post-rape practices approved by US bishops for catholic hospitals?

 

[SyroMalankara]

Pope Francis is in the best position to know what his predecessors did, or did not do, regarding this matter.

why would that be, was he there?

He is possibly the most Christlike person on the face of this earth

oh gimme a break… I love the Pope but this is beyond ultramontanism and almost idolatry… there are monks in the Egyptian desert that spend 20hrs a day in prayer and fasting… just maybe they are a little more ‘Christlike’, there are spouses living their faith and handing it on to their children every day, perhaps they are most Christlike…

, and I’ve noticed that several people react to his “off the cuff” comments in the same way the conservative Pharisees reacted to Jesus’ revolutionary teachings.

perhaps because of other reasons

 

[loumeland]

perhaps because of other reasons

Like which ones? And if we can’t trust Pope Francis on climate change, why trust Pope Paul VI on the pill?

 

[Rau]

Like which ones? And if we can’t trust Pope Francis on climate change, why trust Pope Paul VI on the pill?

Why would you think Paul VI’s trustworthiness is being questioned?

 

[Brendan_64]

And if we can’t trust Pope Francis on climate change, why trust Pope Paul VI on the pill?

Pope Francis’s views on climate change are his own personal views (which he is of course allowed to put forward) but they do not represent magisterial teaching. We may agree with him, we may not, we are not bound by these. It’s a bit like Benedict XVI’s ‘Jesus of Nazareth’ books. Excellent writings, but they do not form part of magisterial teaching and we are not bound by them.

Humanae Vitae on the other hand is magisterial teaching and part of the Deposit of Faith, we are bound by it. That is the difference.

 

[JPUSC]

Pope Francis’s views on climate change are his own personal views (which he is of course allowed to put forward) but they do not represent magisterial teaching. We may agree with him, we may not, we are not bound by these. It’s a bit like Benedict XVI’s ‘Jesus of Nazareth’ books. Excellent writings, but they do not form part of magisterial teaching and we are not bound by them.

Humanae Vitae on the other hand is magisterial teaching and part of the Deposit of Faith, we are bound by it. That is the difference.

Are not “Humanae Vitae” and “Laudato Si” both papal encyclicals?

Encylicals remain very important teaching documents. No pope since 1870 has designated an encyclical as an exercise of papal infallibility, which requires three conditions: 1) the subject is a matter of faith or morals, 2) the pope must be teaching as supreme pastor, and 3) the pope must indicate that the teaching is infallible.

stanthonymessenger.org/AskAFranciscan/Question.aspx?Question=176