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Scott_Lafrance
Guest
Which one causes more scandal? The abusive priest, who revulses everyone with his actions, or the disobedient politician who influences great many people to think it is acceptable to sin?
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SwissGuard25
Guest
O yeah he is very courageous. Meets with President of the Diocese of Kalamazoo says he doesn’t have to worry about the Abortion problem. Couple months later President calls the Diocese up and starts up with a friendly chat and then “O by the way, you have a year to decide rather to go against your Doctrine Teachings or be charged heavy fines and still be forced to go against your teachings.”
The Man is anti-Catholic and if Pelosi is a true Catholic she wouldn’t stand for this!
I don’t want to sound mean and I know it is not my call to make but she be allowed to receive communion.
The Man is anti-Catholic and if Pelosi is a true Catholic she wouldn’t stand for this!
I don’t want to sound mean and I know it is not my call to make but she be allowed to receive communion.
J
JimR-OCDS
Guest
Of course the abusive priest and Bishop who continued to keep him in ministry.
No one looks to the politician as a role model Catholic, but they do look at priests and Bishops as role models on how Catholics are suppose to order their lives.
Jim
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Scott_Lafrance
Guest
I’ll let someone else point out how blatantly wrong you are.
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Nimzovik
Guest
Nimzovik Responds:
Methinks a diversion is occuring here. The subject is Pelosi. If we are to discuss Priest sexual abuse - or rather IMHO-the Sexual Predators masquerading as Priests that successfully inserted themselves into the Catholic Church to ply their -for the most part - practicing homosexual and perverted activities, if I am not mistaken, - it should be it’s own thread - yes?
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JimR-OCDS
Guest
.
The priest sex abuse issue came up because no priest who commited sex abuse was excommunicated, and sexual abuseof children is an intrinsic evil just as abortion is.
Don’t excommunicate Pelosi but not the priest who abuse children flies in the face of hypocracy
And the discusion has to with whether Nancy Pelosi’s Bishop should publically excommunicate her or not.
The priest sex abuse issue came up because no priest who commited sex abuse was excommunicated, and sexual abuseof children is an intrinsic evil just as abortion is.
Don’t excommunicate Pelosi but not the priest who abuse children flies in the face of hypocracy
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Scott_Lafrance
Guest
Nancy Pelosi is the one causing ongoing scandal. Whether or not the priests should be excommunicated is a red herring and you know it. It is a blatant attempt to divert attention from the topic. The topic is not about sexually abusive priests. It is about Nancy Pelosi.
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PTL
Guest
The key point that Nancy Pelosi should be excommunicated is: she, as a Catholic public servant of the government, constantly created scandal by presenting a false Catholic position, confuses the ignorant public , mislead the ignorant public to think Catholics support abortion. And she constantly uses her political power to enhance the scandal.
The sex abuse is indeed a scandal, but it is condemned by the church and it did not mislead the public that Catholics support abortion or sex abuse.
See the major difference why Pelosi should be excommunicated?
The sex abuse is indeed a scandal, but it is condemned by the church and it did not mislead the public that Catholics support abortion or sex abuse.
See the major difference why Pelosi should be excommunicated?
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Nimzovik
Guest
Precisely. Well said.
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JimR-OCDS
Guest
I’m not saying Pelosi shouldn’t be excommunicated, but that it’s her Bishop who will handle it, and he’ll probably meet with her privately first, if that is possible.
Either way, the point would be to try and bring her back to the truth.
The other point is that in the public eye, it would be viewed as inconsistent on how the Church handles evil committed by lay people verses evil committed by clergy. They would see the latter as getting a free pass and it’s why so many Catholics just ignore what the Church teaches about birth control and how they should vote.
Again, Nancy Pelosi isn’t looked up to as a role model Catholic. How she ignores Church teaching doesn’t cause scandal, because she’s not viewed as a very good Catholic anyway.
Her support for abortion isn’t viewed by Catholics as anything other than her not following what the Church teaches.
Jim
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saveusfromhell
Guest
this is wrong on many levels.
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PTL
Guest
I don’t think the public is so wise to compare notes and feel the inconsistency. Plus, like I explained in earlier post, the sex abuse scandal and Polesi’s abortion position are two things on different levels. Even if it is inconsistent, it is not the reason not to excommunicate her. We cannot say just because we did not deal with the first criminal with justice, so we should not deal with the second criminal with justice either.
And, yes, I got your point that you are not saying not to excommunicate her. I am just explaining my point.
The reason many Catholics ignore Church’s teaching on birth control and how they vote has nothing to do with “see the latter getting a free pass”.
The reason many Catholics ignore the teaching on birth control is because of this death culture and the influence of the liberals.
The reason so many Catholics vote for Obama is due to lack of Church guidance on how to vote. When did you hear a clergy tell the congregation how to vote? Although, even some clergy tell the congregation to vote for pro-life candidate, the liberal Catholics may just ignore. But, to teach is necessary, regardless. There are multiple problems here.
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JimR-OCDS
Guest
Well we’ll just have to disagree.
I know many Catholics who say they no longer accept Church doctrine on birth control and abortion, because of the sex abuse scandal where they did nothing.
The reality is, they should’ve reacted quickly on that issue, but also should’ve excommunicated Catholic Politicians like Nancy Pelosi, who publicly defy Church teaching.
The fact that they did neither, made for the bad PR the Church now faces with the general public and many Catholics.
Jim
I know many Catholics who say they no longer accept Church doctrine on birth control and abortion, because of the sex abuse scandal where they did nothing.
The reality is, they should’ve reacted quickly on that issue, but also should’ve excommunicated Catholic Politicians like Nancy Pelosi, who publicly defy Church teaching.
The fact that they did neither, made for the bad PR the Church now faces with the general public and many Catholics.
Jim
M
MichaelTDoyle
Guest
/offtopic
Many did something about the scandal. Years ago it was seen not as a criminal issue but as a psychological issue. Many tried to do right; many did not. No one claims that Child abuse is not sinful.
People are claiming that supporting “a woman’s right to choose [to have a medical professional kill her unborn child]” is not sinful.
This claim when publically upheld is fought through the use of excommunication as a tool to ensure that highly public figures do not lead people to sin.
Those who support the euphemism that a woman has a right to choose are in grave danger.
Public shame is better than sin.
Many did something about the scandal. Years ago it was seen not as a criminal issue but as a psychological issue. Many tried to do right; many did not. No one claims that Child abuse is not sinful.
People are claiming that supporting “a woman’s right to choose [to have a medical professional kill her unborn child]” is not sinful.
This claim when publically upheld is fought through the use of excommunication as a tool to ensure that highly public figures do not lead people to sin.
Those who support the euphemism that a woman has a right to choose are in grave danger.
Public shame is better than sin.
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PTL
Guest
I am sure there are Catholics as you described. Their thinking is like: “My parents did not punish my misbehaved brother quick enough, so I will not obey my parents any more.”
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Ridgerunner
Guest
Nancy Pelosi is a symptom. She isn’t the disease.
She is a symptom of an American Church that thought somehow it could reconcile itself with secular philosophies which, themselves, descended increasingly into evil, pulling a lot of churchmen downward in its train. None of it has worked out. The “Great Trickster” had a surprise for churchmen at nearly every turn.
The secular philosophy said pedophilia and homosexual hebephilia could be “cured” by psychotherapy. Well, churchmen bought into it instead of simply recognizing that evil was not an inescapable compulsion for which one was not responsible, but a choice for which one is, indeed, responsible.
The secular philosophy sold the notion that “good intentions” sufficed for personal morality as long as they are expressed politically. Never mind chastity or charity so long as I vote for those who want to take money from Peter and give it to Paul. Churchmen went along with that, being tempted by a few of the crumbs from Peter’s table and, indeed, it was helpful to them superficially, because their “good acts” were supplemented by federal grants. Many churchmen followed the temptation down the rabbit hole of Obamacare, and now we have the Obama Doctrine regarding Catholic institutions. Tricked again by the Trickster; the liar and father of liars.
And 54% of American Catholics voted for a man who promised to promote abortion. Why? Well, we have seen the rationale here on CAF frequently enough. “We’re supposed to help the sick”. “We’re supposed to help the poor”. Obama’s pronouncement that he instituted Obamacare for Jesus is as good an expression of the subordination of religion to political secularism as one could ask for. (Did Jesus call for the slaughter of innocents?) And, of course, when we think of “help for the sick” in terms of “free healthcare for myself”, a belief mightily encouraged by Obama, we are again tricked. We are tricked because we want to be tricked.
Pelsoi, of course, represents a very large concentration of homosexual activists. She marches in obscene “Gay Pride” parades herself. Hers is a very morally libertarian constituency in every way. Does anyone not remember how repeal of DADT was promoted even in here in the interests of “fairness”. Now and then homosexual “marriage” is touted with the very same underpinnings. After all, homosexual relationships can be just like heterosexual ones in terms of companionship, or so we’re told, anyway. Entirely secular. Repeal of DADT is precisely the secular political elite’s promotion of homosexuality as equivalent to heterosexuality…the first time in American history that the government has endorsed homosexuality in this way. Such an endorsement of an institution often revered by the young is scandalous, but an increasingly degraded secular society says it’s “fair”, and we buy it. Tricked again.
Pelosi is a more visible symptom of the disease than most. But she is by no means the only one. Without many, many more who support her way of thinking to one degree or another, she would just be one more otherwise unemployed millionairess sipping her vintages on her estate and wondering what entertainment she will provide for herself tomorrow.
She is a symptom of an American Church that thought somehow it could reconcile itself with secular philosophies which, themselves, descended increasingly into evil, pulling a lot of churchmen downward in its train. None of it has worked out. The “Great Trickster” had a surprise for churchmen at nearly every turn.
The secular philosophy said pedophilia and homosexual hebephilia could be “cured” by psychotherapy. Well, churchmen bought into it instead of simply recognizing that evil was not an inescapable compulsion for which one was not responsible, but a choice for which one is, indeed, responsible.
The secular philosophy sold the notion that “good intentions” sufficed for personal morality as long as they are expressed politically. Never mind chastity or charity so long as I vote for those who want to take money from Peter and give it to Paul. Churchmen went along with that, being tempted by a few of the crumbs from Peter’s table and, indeed, it was helpful to them superficially, because their “good acts” were supplemented by federal grants. Many churchmen followed the temptation down the rabbit hole of Obamacare, and now we have the Obama Doctrine regarding Catholic institutions. Tricked again by the Trickster; the liar and father of liars.
And 54% of American Catholics voted for a man who promised to promote abortion. Why? Well, we have seen the rationale here on CAF frequently enough. “We’re supposed to help the sick”. “We’re supposed to help the poor”. Obama’s pronouncement that he instituted Obamacare for Jesus is as good an expression of the subordination of religion to political secularism as one could ask for. (Did Jesus call for the slaughter of innocents?) And, of course, when we think of “help for the sick” in terms of “free healthcare for myself”, a belief mightily encouraged by Obama, we are again tricked. We are tricked because we want to be tricked.
Pelsoi, of course, represents a very large concentration of homosexual activists. She marches in obscene “Gay Pride” parades herself. Hers is a very morally libertarian constituency in every way. Does anyone not remember how repeal of DADT was promoted even in here in the interests of “fairness”. Now and then homosexual “marriage” is touted with the very same underpinnings. After all, homosexual relationships can be just like heterosexual ones in terms of companionship, or so we’re told, anyway. Entirely secular. Repeal of DADT is precisely the secular political elite’s promotion of homosexuality as equivalent to heterosexuality…the first time in American history that the government has endorsed homosexuality in this way. Such an endorsement of an institution often revered by the young is scandalous, but an increasingly degraded secular society says it’s “fair”, and we buy it. Tricked again.
Pelosi is a more visible symptom of the disease than most. But she is by no means the only one. Without many, many more who support her way of thinking to one degree or another, she would just be one more otherwise unemployed millionairess sipping her vintages on her estate and wondering what entertainment she will provide for herself tomorrow.
D
Dirt
Guest
Quote from Ms. Pelosi:
“I’m going to stand with my fellow Catholics in supporting the administration on this. I think it was a very courageous decision that they made and I support it.”
From someone who claims to be Catholic, this statement has no defense.
And then there is this quote from Ms. Pelosi in an interview prior to the HHS ruling:
" I’m a devout Catholic and I honor my faith and love it .?.?. but they have this conscience thing’’
Devout? Devout to whom? We need Bishops who are not afraid to use the Canon Law to which ALL Catholics are held accountable to. This is a difining moment folks. Either we will continue to adhere to the Precepts of the Church, or we will disintergrate into just another fallen denomination of pick and choose psuedo-believers. I pray for the former.
“I’m going to stand with my fellow Catholics in supporting the administration on this. I think it was a very courageous decision that they made and I support it.”
From someone who claims to be Catholic, this statement has no defense.
And then there is this quote from Ms. Pelosi in an interview prior to the HHS ruling:
" I’m a devout Catholic and I honor my faith and love it .?.?. but they have this conscience thing’’
Devout? Devout to whom? We need Bishops who are not afraid to use the Canon Law to which ALL Catholics are held accountable to. This is a difining moment folks. Either we will continue to adhere to the Precepts of the Church, or we will disintergrate into just another fallen denomination of pick and choose psuedo-believers. I pray for the former.
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domandcarols
Guest
Wow. This woman needs lots of prayers.
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Scott_Lafrance
Guest
Pelosi appears to be devoted to her own vision of Catholicism, which, unfortunately for her, bears little to no resemblance to that which is upheld by the Magisterium.
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