"People shouldn't force their belief on others"

[yellowbicycle]

I hear this alot.
And I don’t get it.
If a person really and truly thinks that my actions will ETERNALLY separate me from all that is good and beautiful, and that person really and truly loves me, then they SHOULD be trying to convert me, right?
I certainly wouldn’t want any of my loved ones to end up in eternal damnation.
Furthermore, how is a JW knocking at my door, or my Aunt Sally telling me that if I don’t go to Mass she won’t bake me a pumpkin pie ‘forcing’?
So, why do people get all uppity when someone ‘forces’ their beliefs on them?

 

[fhansen]

Belief really can’t be forced. Any belief that’s forced couldn’t be true belief anyway-it’s a contradiction in terms, in fact. And the Church teaches this: a persons’ conscience has primacy and coercion is never to be employed. We have the right to be wrong, IOW.

 

[JimG]

Belief really can’t be forced. Any belief that’s forced couldn’t be true belief anyway-it’s a contradiction in terms, in fact. And the Church teaches this: a persons’ conscience has primacy and coercion is never to be employed. We have the right to be wrong, IOW.

This is quite true. One must keep in mind though, that conscience is not something that springs forth fully formed at a particular point in one’s life. Conscience must be properly formed, for it consists in the ability to make a correct moral judgment. Conscience must first know what is right in order to properly judge. Then conscience can make a judgment that some particular action is immoral even though it is what I want to do. Sometimes, I think, people confuse conscience with “what seems right to me at the time,” which boils down to “what I felt like doing.” But that’s just emotion, not conscience.

 

[skallal]

Hey yellow,

What a great question! Isn’t it frustrating when you think you’re trying to help someone and they respond by saying “Don’t force your beliefs on me!”? Who wouldn’t hate that? On the other hand, who wouldn’t hate being manipulated or forced to something that they really don’t want to do? Could it be possible that this objection is a great piece of feedback, a gift given to us by the person we’re trying to help? If so, what could it mean?

Well, it could mean that the person already knows what they’re SUPPOSED to do, but doesn’t understand WHY they’re supposed to do it, or what’s so GREAT about it. What if we showed them how awesome living the faith could be? What condititions would we have to create in the other person and in their environment so that they could love the faith as much as we do? Would it be enough to give them a chance to volunteer, or help out with some dimension of the liturgy? Would it be enough to simply explain some of the basics of the faith with great catechists like CWest, Fulton Sheen, or Fr. Corapi? Maybe it’d be enough to give some great models of Christian joy like Francis or Mother Teresa… Whatever it is, something in our presentation of the faith can always improve…

One thing I like to do when I see an objection coming is to get there first by saying something like, “You know, some morons think that just talking about the truth of their religion is forcing their beliefs on someone” or “I’ve heard some hypocrites say that they don’t want anyone to force their beliefs on them when really they mean that they don’t want to accept the truth about sin, isn’t that absurd?” Statements like this can stop the objection from ever coming up because nobody wants to be “one of those people.”

Yellow, continue to spread the Gospel with joy and may God lead you ever closer to himself and our blessed mother.

In Christ,

Brother Scott
Apostle of the Interior Life, Rome

 

[Palm_Tree]

I hear this alot.
And I don’t get it.
If a person really and truly thinks that my actions will ETERNALLY separate me from all that is good and beautiful, and that person really and truly loves me, then they SHOULD be trying to convert me, right?
I certainly wouldn’t want any of my loved ones to end up in eternal damnation.
Furthermore, how is a JW knocking at my door, or my Aunt Sally telling me that if I don’t go to Mass she won’t bake me a pumpkin pie ‘forcing’?
So, why do people get all uppity when someone ‘forces’ their beliefs on them?

People shouldn’t try to force their beliefs on others. From the Vatican:

The witness to the truth does not seek to impose anything by force

vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20071203_nota-evangelizzazione_en.html

But yes, it comes down to what is “forcing.”

Is a Mormon knocking on my door ‘forcing’? I don’t think so, but others hate it when Mormom’s or anybody else knock on their door trying to sell something.

Is Aunt Sally telling me that if I don’t go to Mass she won’t bake me a pumpkin pie ‘forcing’? Yeah, I could see how one could think so. She’s being coercive. But what if Aunt Sally just invited someone to go to Mass with her? That wouldn’t forcing.

I think what it comes down to is that if you are irritating somebody to the point that are you are being told not to force your belief on others, chances are you are going about it the wrong way.

 

[phoage]

There are two questions here; What is force? and What is right (as in correct)?

Aunt Sally not making me a pie is not force. She has no obligation to make me a pie and I loose nothing by missing it except a few calories. Force is " Go to Church or go to jail." Force is “Hello. I am from the Inquisition and I am here to help you. We have this lovely stake for you.” Force is exiling all the infidels.

What is right? Now you apparently have Faith that you know the will of God and that will requires you to share that knowledge with others. This is good. But consider for a moment that someone else may have just as much Faith that you are wrong. Certainly you should share your knowledge with them but keep in mind that it is possible that you may have not been vouchsafed the final answer. Equally, they may believe that they have the final answer.

When I get that statement, I put the subject on my list of discussions not to have with that person unless they bring it up first. I have done the best I can do and if they are not ready or receptive, then it becomes God’s business and all I can do is pray for them.

 

[Paul1961]

No one should force their beliefs on others. This applies way beyond religion. The result is always conflict. Sometimes to the point of war and death.

What if Catholicism became the official U.S. religion. Then we outlaw other religions. Then we burn down their churches. Send dissidents to “re-education” camps. … And on and on.

Jesus wants us follow him because we believe and love him. He does not want us to push others toward him at the tip of a sword.

 

[Newbie2]

Methinks the word we’re looking for is “share”. As has been stated, one cannot force a belief on others, unless it’s through brainwashing.

One can attempt to force a belief on another by repeated attempts where none are welcome…I agree this is a most unlikely technique to succeed.

 

[Palm_Tree]

consider for a moment that someone else may have just as much Faith that you are wrong. Certainly you should share your knowledge with them but keep in mind that it is possible that you may have not been vouchsafed the final answer. Equally, they may believe that they have the final answer.

When I get that statement, I put the subject on my list of discussions not to have with that person **unless they bring it up first. I have done the best I can do **and if they are not ready or receptive, then it becomes God’s business and all I can do is pray for them.

But have you really done the best you can do? And when they bring it up first, what do you do?

 

[Alisa]

No one should force their beliefs on others. This applies way beyond religion. The result is always conflict. Sometimes to the point of war and death.

What if Catholicism became the official U.S. religion. Then we outlaw other religions. Then we burn down their churches. Send dissidents to “re-education” camps. … And on and on.

Jesus wants us follow him because we believe and love him. He does not want us to push others toward him at the tip of a sword.

Paul, I absolutely agree with you.

Of course, during our child-rearing years, we need to see to it that the kids get proper education about God, attend Mass regularly, etc. But once they join the ranks of adults, our Christian leadership should take the form, in my opinion, of setting the best example possible of generosity, kindness, and also being there for them and their own children. I know a number of families in which the parents refuse to accept the choices of their offspring if they differ even slightly from what they would have chosen for their children.

If another person asks me something about my Catholic faith or shows interest in why I am happy in my faith, I am delighted to discuss it with them. Otherwise, I don’t proselytize. Instead, I believe in setting an example in the way I conduct my Catholic life.

Thanks for your post!

Alisa

 

[phoage]

But have you really done the best you can do? And when they bring it up first, what do you do?

If someone is accusing you of forcing your beliefs on them, you have done the most you can do, wether or not you have done the best you can do.

If they bring it up first, then they are obviously not accusing you of forcing your beliefs on them and of course, you should answer.

 

[Sarabande]

I hear this alot.
And I don’t get it.
If a person really and truly thinks that my actions will ETERNALLY separate me from all that is good and beautiful, and that person really and truly loves me, then they SHOULD be trying to convert me, right?
I certainly wouldn’t want any of my loved ones to end up in eternal damnation.
Furthermore, how is a JW knocking at my door, or my Aunt Sally telling me that if I don’t go to Mass she won’t bake me a pumpkin pie ‘forcing’?
So, why do people get all uppity when someone ‘forces’ their beliefs on them?

These are good questions. Like others say, trying to force people to accept your belief isn’t right. When a JW is knocking at my door or an aunt is trying to coerce me into attending Mass by threatening to not back me a pie, I find the first one intrusive at first until they get pushy with it, then I find that as trying to force me. I find the second scenario as being manipulative and forceful. Neither way will induce me to love God the way they want me to.

I have an aunt and uncle who are fundamentalist born-again Christians. They worked really hard to try to convince my parents and everyone else in the family that being Catholic was sinful. They used scare tactics by saying we would go to hell because we “worshipped” Mary and the Saints, among other things. Basically, they tried to force us to convert from Catholicism and they were very vitriolic about it. We also used to have these soap box non-denominational Christians in our college campus being very verbally abusive towards the college students. Calling women out as whores (and they didn’t even know them), that Mother Teresa was burning in Hell because she followed a false religion (to which one person replied “Well, if she’s in your version of Hell, I’d rather be there with her and the rest of the Saints.”) That whole experience during my childhood, teen and college years left a very bad taste in my mouth. It let me see how wrong it was to try to get people to believe in your faith in that way.

For me, the best way of witnessing my faith is through my actions. I believe converts or people who were lackluster in their faith, who started their journey by seeing the actions of others come with the right kind of attitude. They aren’t doing it out of fear or coersion. They are doing it out of love and complete acceptance. When people ask me why I believe what I do, I just tell them sincerely. I don’t say that if they don’t believe what I believe their souls are in jeopardy. I focus on how I, myself, would be affected if I didn’t believe. I have a former boyfriend who has thanked me many times for bringing him back to his faith. I did nothing more than be what I was. I didn’t force anything on him. After our relationship ended, he started going back to church, eventually met and married a wonderful woman, and now has a couple beautiful kids. He always thanks me for being the first to help him find God and his faith again. I had no idea at the time that my actions did that for him.

Anyway, it’s what I call “quiet” witnessing and I think it is the best in terms of witnessing to adults.

 

[mary1173]

As stated by others, belief cannot truly be forced upon anyone. the non believer may become annoyed and run the other direction in fact. Try to be patient with the JW’s tell them you are a Catholic and have no interest in becoming a JW. And as for your Aunt who won’t bake you a pie, it’s your moral OBLIGATION to attend mass. To willingly skip mass is a mortal sin upon your soul…if I was taught correctly. So that you do not lose the promise of Paradise you should go to mass. I hope this helped.
mary1173:thumbsup:

 

[Alisa]

When people with other beliefs come to me proselytizing (like various groups coming to the door,) it’s an uncomfortable feeling. If the people are friends, I try to be polite and hear them out, but if they persist I feel antipathy.

So – I try to “do unto others”. If they ask about my faith, fine. If not, I try to demonstrate my faith by my actions and words.

Alisa

 

[Salonika]

yellowbicyle:

If a person really and truly thinks that my actions will ETERNALLY separate me from all that is good and beautiful, and that person really and truly loves me, then they SHOULD be trying to convert me, right?

As some else has said – a good question

A couple of observations - think while there are some situations in which nearly everyone would feel forced to change their religious views, politics, preferences we need to keep personalities and ways of thinking in mind as this can help explain why one person feels forced and another does not even when the approach is the same.

Also we all have triggers to feeling forced – one of mine is an assumption by the other person that I have not accepted a belief/view because I am ignorant of it (I maybe but please check first). A couple of others are if you knew as much as me you would accept my views and if you loved me you would change your views.

yellowbicycle:

So, why do people get all uppity when someone ‘forces’ their beliefs on them?

Can’t talk for others but for me I react as soon as someone makes it clear that they consider their view is the ONLY view and that this will not be a conversation with an open end but one with the purpose of changing my views. I react much better to a comment such as “I would like to tell you about/share my beliefs …”

phoage:

There are two questions here; What is force? and What is right (as in correct)?

Aunt Sally not making me a pie is not force. She has no obligation to make me a pie and I loose nothing by missing it except a few calories. Force is " Go to Church or go to jail." Force is “Hello. I am from the Inquisition and I am here to help you. We have this lovely stake for you.” Force is exiling all the infidels.

If we are fond of the person who says they will not do something they usually do for us unless we do what they want then there is likely to an element of psychological force (“blackmail”) involved. Also there can be psychological force when people day “If you love me you would agree with me, change your religion, how you express your religion.

phoage:

What is right? Now you apparently have Faith that you know the will of God and that will requires you to share that knowledge with others. This is good. But consider for a moment that someone else may have just as much Faith that you are wrong. Certainly you should share your knowledge with them but keep in mind that it is possible that you may have not been vouchsafed the final answer. Equally, they may believe that they have the final answer.

When I get that statement, I put the subject on my list of discussions not to have with that person unless they bring it up first. I have done the best I can do and if they are not ready or receptive, then it becomes God’s business and all I can do is pray for them.

Agree with this approach as it leaves communications open – you can’t influence someone’s views if they are so angry that they are avoiding you or will not speak to you.

Also how we talk with people about our basic beliefs influences how people see these beliefs. If people think we are forcing our views on them they may reject our beliefs because they may think that being coerced is part of the deal if they take on our views.

 

[phoenix3212]

Isn’t that kind of self-defeating? I mean, anyone who says that is forcing their belief that “people shouldn’t force their beliefs on others.”

 

[Monica4316]

I think we should share our faith with others (through both actions and words) and pray for them, and God will change their hearts

we can’t really change people’s hearts…

we can tell them about our faith, but we can’t make them believe.

And if we try really hard, it might actually damage the person.

I initially looked into Catholicism cause my Catholic friends were accepting of me and treated me as a friend and a sister in Christ… if they had tried to force me to believe, I might not have become Catholic.

However, we should care. Yes… it is very important to care… and above all, we should pray. and offer little sacrifices

 

[Dismas2004]

We live in confused times. People often say “Don’t force your beliefs on me” when what they mean to say is “Please don’t challenge my beliefs!”

You are quite correct - if we believe we have the true means of salvation and if we truly love our neighbor we not only should but have a duty to share the love of Christ with others!

If more people, especially parents would do that with their own children, then we wouldn’t have 85% of our college students stop practicing their faith each year.

 

[Strategery]

I hear this alot.
And I don’t get it.
If a person really and truly thinks that my actions will ETERNALLY separate me from all that is good and beautiful, and that person really and truly loves me, then they SHOULD be trying to convert me, right?
I certainly wouldn’t want any of my loved ones to end up in eternal damnation.
Furthermore, how is a JW knocking at my door, or my Aunt Sally telling me that if I don’t go to Mass she won’t bake me a pumpkin pie ‘forcing’?
So, why do people get all uppity when someone ‘forces’ their beliefs on them?

Ya know, I’ve come to understand that when people raise this objection, what’s really going on is that they are uncomfortable discussing faith. There can be a lot of reasons for that. It could be that they are unsure, or that they feel like they don’t want to be embarrassed, or anything else … including that they believe some crazy stuff that they want to keep secret.

IMO this is one of Satan’s great lies that has taken complete root in our culture. Satan whispers to us that beliefs are personal, they are ours, they are nobody else’s business. This is completely counter to Christ sending us to be disciples of all nations.

My perception is that the more violently a person reacts with this, the more conflicted they are.

FWIW, I agree with the poster above that when someone says that and holds to it, there isn’t anything more you can do, at least at that time. They aren’t ready for the truth. You did what you could at that time.

 

[Chrisy58]

I don’t think we should force our beliefs on others. If people are anything like me, they will just become more hard headed. I tend to pray for them and allow the Lord to touch their hearts. I have people who I pray for. I have one person who was born a Catholic and raised a Catholic but left the church. Only God can touch his heart and bring him to the place where he will see that the path he is on is only leading to his ruin. With man it is impossible but with God it is possible. I have given it over the the Lord and know that He will work it out in his own way and in his own time.

The only thing that I can do is to live my life in such a way that people will hopefully see the love of Christ in me. Not easy and I have failed so many times. But each time we fail we must go to confession and try again. Jesus understands our human weakness.

We are living in confusing times. At least for me they are confusing. There are so many issues that the state wants to make into Law that the church opposes. The issue I am talking about right now is same sex marriage. As Americans we do believe in seperation of church and state. Yet, at the same time don’t we have a duty as Catholic Americans to decide for ourselves what we believe about this issue and other issues? I am still making up my mind. I did pick up a little pamplet at church and read it, but their defination of marriage made it sound like if the couple couldn’t have children than it was not a real marriage. I can’t have children so that little pamplet made it sound like I a Catholic could never get married in the Catholic Church because I can’t have children. I also thought about senior citizens who find another mate in their golden years because their first mate died, because they couldn’t have children as a product of that marriage so in the eyes of the church they wouldn’t be married either. Yet, at the same time, I read about this so called prom in Boston that had young middle age students being sexually indoctranated into sexual perversion with gay BDSM men being hosts and transgender sexual perversion too. It is like mankind has become animals and we have taken the freedom God gave us to the extreem. Is that the product of allowing same sex marriage in a state? I used to live in MA and it shocks me that this kind of prom would go on. What parent would agree to allow their child to attend such an event.

I am still deciding how I feel about this issue. If I come to the conclusion that I as a Catholic must fight it, I will say why I think it is wrong, but I won’t force my beliefs on others. I will continue to pray that God will work in touching people’s hearts that this nation is heading down a dangerous road.

Prayer, is the most effective way I believe to touch people’s hearts.