Peter and the Wife

[Maccabees]

Xavier:

Early church tradition holds that Peters wife was martyred at Rome.
Peters confession is the rock (alas another lifetime of arguement)
My point is how ironic that Peter was chosen by Christ as an apostle and who you clainma as the first pope was married. Peter in todays Catholic Church could not even be a deacon much less a priest.

Your wrong on both accounts deacons can be married I know many deacons and they are all married. The pope can be married.
The pope need not be a bishop so he could be could be taken from a pool of eastern rite priests who are married or married latin rite priest who converted from protestantism or he can be chosen from the deacons who can be married techiniqually the pope could be a layperson who is married though that is highly unlikely. There are many ways a married person could be pope if the holy spirit guided the church into that direction. Obviously the norm has been to choose a pope from the better known and more qualified bishops who are celibate. And have bene celibate for 1700 years. Like we keep saying this could change if the holy spirit guided the church in that direction. ANd the church has left open the current possiblity that a married priest or married deacon be our next Pope if the holy spirit guided such a person to be chosen to be our next Pope. Your assumptions are wrong,

 

[katherine2]

JimG:

.My only point was that the work of evangelization may have made for difficult marriages, since the apostles were commanded to “go, therefore and make disciples of all the nations.”

Frank Sheed and Maise Ward had a beautiful marriage.

 

[Fiat]

Xavier:

Early church tradition holds that Peters wife was martyred at Rome.
Peters confession is the rock (alas another lifetime of arguement)
My point is how ironic that Peter was chosen by Christ as an apostle and who you clainma as the first pope was married. Peter in todays Catholic Church could not even be a deacon much less a priest.

Hi Xavier:
It’s clear from your comment that you don’t know very much about the Holy Catholic Church. I recommend you do some reading about the various rites within the Church before you make too many criticisms. A good place to start is catholicanswers.com.

Fiat

 

[Xavier]

Maccabees:

Your wrong on both accounts deacons can be married I know many deacons and they are all married. The pope can be married.
The pope need not be a bishop so he could be could be taken from a pool of eastern rite priests who are married or married latin rite priest who converted from protestantism or he can be chosen from the deacons who can be married techiniqually the pope could be a layperson who is married though that is highly unlikely. There are many ways a married person could be pope if the holy spirit guided the church into that direction. Obviously the norm has been to choose a pope from the better known and more qualified bishops who are celibate. And have bene celibate for 1700 years. Like we keep saying this could change if the holy spirit guided the church in that direction. ANd the church has left open the current possiblity that a married priest or married deacon be our next Pope if the holy spirit guided such a person to be chosen to be our next Pope. Your assumptions are wrong,

I stand corrected on the deacon issue.
However you do not think it ironic that peter was married and now your denomination forbids it?

 

[MaggieOH]

Xavier:

Peters wife travel to Rome with him and wwas martyred before he.
This is one of the many errors the RCC maintains. Peter who is called the first pope was married and had a daughter yet priests today are forbidden to marry.

then I will have to correct your own error regarding Peter. First I agree that it is probable that Peter’s wife was martyred before Peter. However, there is no mention of a daughter. Since you love to insist upon believing Scripture can you give a Scriptural reference that Peter had a daughter?

Also you are in error in your understanding of the priestly vow of celibacy. It is not that priests are forbidden to marry as you state. This is where those who make this kind of claim always fall down in logic and lack of understanding of the Catholic Church.

The vow of celibacy is a discipline in precisely the way that is mentioned by St. Paul. By taking this vow the priests are able to concentrate on being with God alone. Since it is a discipline there is no reason to believe that there could be a new ruling on the matter in the near future. The Catholic Church has some married priests, so your argument is truly hot air.

MaggieOH

 

[Xavier]

MaggieOH:

then I will have to correct your own error regarding Peter. First I agree that it is probable that Peter’s wife was martyred before Peter. However, there is no mention of a daughter. Since you love to insist upon believing Scripture can you give a Scriptural reference that Peter had a daughter?

Also you are in error in your understanding of the priestly vow of celibacy. It is not that priests are forbidden to marry as you state. This is where those who make this kind of claim always fall down in logic and lack of understanding of the Catholic Church.

The vow of celibacy is a discipline in precisely the way that is mentioned by St. Paul. By taking this vow the priests are able to concentrate on being with God alone. Since it is a discipline there is no reason to believe that there could be a new ruling on the matter in the near future. The Catholic Church has some married priests, so your argument is truly hot air.

MaggieOH

I find no reference to Peters wife being marytred in Rome in Scripture. If you assert as much then why do you need a biblical reference for his daughter?

Yes there are a few married priests but this exception proves the rule. Peter who was married was chosen by jesus to be an apostle. Jesus found no need to chose only unmarried apostles. The question is how can the church reason more wisdom than Jesus?

 

[Exporter]

Xavier:

I stand corrected on the deacon issue.
However you do not think it ironic that peter was married and now your denomination forbids it?

---

Xavier, In your quote above, you say that the Roman Catholic Church is a …“DENOMINATION”. Denominations occur in Protestantism NOT in the Catholic Church. There are NO denominations in the Catholic Church.

The Catholic Church is the One Holy and Apostolic Church with Jesus Christ as it’s head. Holy Mother Church was started by Jesus. (Matt16:18 & 19). Wheather Peter had a daughter or not has no bearing on the Holy Mother Church.

 

[otm]

JLove:

I am aware that the “discipline” does not go all the way back (but was defined by A.D. 300), however, I would set forth that celibacy was the norm and marriage the exception. And even within marriage there was no sexual interactions. As Maccabees hints at this can be concluded from a proper translation of 1 Cor. 9:15, as well as from quotes of the fathers.

I don’t know when the discipline came in, but there were abuses long after 300 AD. As to no sexual interactions, that, too, is debateable, as one of the problems the Church struggled with was the issue of inheritance, one that would not occur without sexual intercourse.

Furthermore, you are confusing the Chruch with the Roman rite. They are not identical.

 

[otm]

Maccabees:

Your wrong on both accounts deacons can be married I know many deacons and they are all married. The pope can be married.
The pope need not be a bishop so he could be could be taken from a pool of eastern rite priests who are married or married latin rite priest who converted from protestantism or he can be chosen from the deacons who can be married techiniqually the pope could be a layperson who is married though that is highly unlikely. There are many ways a married person could be pope if the holy spirit guided the church into that direction. Obviously the norm has been to choose a pope from the better known and more qualified bishops who are celibate. And have bene celibate for 1700 years. Like we keep saying this could change if the holy spirit guided the church in that direction. ANd the church has left open the current possiblity that a married priest or married deacon be our next Pope if the holy spirit guided such a person to be chosen to be our next Pope. Your assumptions are wrong,

The Pope need not be a bishop when he is chosen, but then he must be ordained a bishop, as the Pope is the bishop of Rome.

 

[otm]

MaggieOH:

The vow of celibacy is a discipline in precisely the way that is mentioned by St. Paul. By taking this vow the priests are able to concentrate on being with God alone. Since it is a discipline there is no reason to believe that there could be a new ruling on the matter in the near future. The Catholic Church has some married priests, so your argument is truly hot air.

MaggieOH

The fact that it is a discipine in and of itself is not reason to believe that it will or won’t be changed. The fact that it is a discipline is the reason that it could be changed, but the likelyhood that it will be changed is very low, but for reasons other than the fact that it is a discipline.

 

[JKirkLVNV]

Xavier:

I stand corrected on the deacon issue.
However you do not think it ironic that peter was married and now your denomination forbids it?

No, we don’t. And we’re not a denomination. We are the Church Jesus founded upon the rock, St. Peter.

 

[Maccabees]

otm:

The Pope need not be a bishop when he is chosen, but then he must be ordained a bishop, as the Pope is the bishop of Rome.

Of course. I was addressing on the possibilites on how the Pope could be chosen. He ultimately becomes the Bishop of Rome in the end.

 

[Maccabees]

Xavier:

I stand corrected on the deacon issue.
However you do not think it ironic that peter was married and now your denomination forbids it?

I already told you marriage for the postion of Pope is not necessarily forbidden their are deacons and priests who are married and elgible for the postion.
On the filp side Jesus and Paul talks about celibacy and the religious life as being preferred yet protestantism does not teach this nor does it encourage celibacy for the relgious although Jesus and Paul do.
WHere are your nun, munks, that devote their life to God?
Also consider the other 11 men Jesus choose did not have a wife in the Bible nor does Paul encourage such a state it is merely permitted and is clearly the second option to celibacy.
Furhtermore their are only two possibilites for Peter’s wife that we know of that he was widowed by the time he was a disciple as the Bible is not clear if his wife is alive or not and the second tradition has only mentioned by one church writer has PEter’s wife dying at the early part of his ministry. Meaning he preached most of his apostleship single and never remarried.
His role as apostle was to preach the gospel to all nations not to live the domesticated life.

 

[JimG]

katherine2:

Frank Sheed and Maise Ward had a beautiful marriage.

Yes they did, as well as a great publishing company.

 

[Xavier]

******************************************************************************
Xavier, In your quote above, you say that the Roman Catholic Church is a …“DENOMINATION”. Denominations occur in Protestantism NOT in the Catholic Church. There are NO denominations in the Catholic Church.

The Catholic Church is the One Holy and Apostolic Church with Jesus Christ as it’s head. Holy Mother Church was started by Jesus. (Matt16:18 & 19). Wheather Peter had a daughter or not has no bearing on the Holy Mother Church.

The Roman Catholic Church is one denomination among Christian Churchs although i guess there qre some that would say it is a cult.
What was good enough for Jesus is not good enough for your church?

 

[Xavier]

JKirkLVNV:

No, we don’t. And we’re not a denomination. We are the Church Jesus founded upon the rock, St. Peter.

Like it or not I am part of the Church Christ founded.

 

[JKirkLVNV]

Xavier:

The Roman Catholic Church is one denomination among Christian Churchs although i guess there qre some that would say it is a cult.
What was good enough for Jesus is not good enough for your church?

You seriously need to read A) your Bible and B) history. And you really shouldn’t come onto a Catholic site giving off attitude.

 

[Xavier]

Maccabees:

I already told you marriage for the postion of Pope is not necessarily forbidden their are deacons and priests who are married and elgible for the postion.
On the filp side Jesus and Paul talks about celibacy and the religious life as being preferred yet protestantism does not teach this nor does it encourage celibacy for the relgious although Jesus and Paul do.
WHere are your nun, munks, that devote their life to God?
Also consider the other 11 men Jesus choose did not have a wife in the Bible nor does Paul encourage such a state it is merely permitted and is clearly the second option to celibacy.
Furhtermore their are only two possibilites for Peter’s wife that we know of that he was widowed by the time he was a disciple as the Bible is not clear if his wife is alive or not and the second tradition has only mentioned by one church writer has PEter’s wife dying at the early part of his ministry. Meaning he preached most of his apostleship single and never remarried.
His role as apostle was to preach the gospel to all nations not to live the domesticated life.

http://www.biblepath.com/peter.html

After being imprisoned several times in Jerusalem because of his faith, Peter left with his wife and possibly others. It is believed that he ministered in Babylon to the Jewish colonists there and it is, also, believed to be his location when he wrote his first epistle (1 Peter).

…

According to church tradition, the Roman Emperor Nero, publicly announcing himself the chief enemy of God, was led in his fury to slaughter the Apostles. Because of the persecution, Peter was crucified upside down while in Rome. Concerning the last hours of his life, it is said that when Peter saw his own wife led out to die, he rejoiced because of her summons and her return home, and called to her very encouragingly and comfortingly addressing her by name, and saying, “O thou, remember the Lord.”

http://pub119.ezboard.com/faccboardsfrm1

And when Jesus was come into Peter’s house, he saw his wife’s mother laid, and sick of a fever. - MATTHEW 8:14

Have we not power to lead about a sister, a wife, as well as other apostles, and as the brethren of the Lord, and Cephas? - 1 CORINTHIANS 9:5

http://www.hope-of-israel.org/petrome.htm

 

[serendipity]

The Catholic Church as a whole is the only Chruch the was founded by Jesus. The people who say Catholciism is a cult, are either misinformed of the beliefs of Catholicism or the definition of a cult, or both.

Soem people believe that the term denomination refers to a group that split away, which is not an accurate or modern definition for the word, but accordingly they take offense when the original Church is referred to as a denomination, because in their opinion denominations began with the Protestant Reformation.

 

[Xavier]

http://www.catholicwomen.com/kitchen36.htm

**His Family - **It was said that his wife’s name was Perpetua. Some say she traveled with him and was actively involved in his evangelical work. Another source says she was martyred and that on the way to her death Peter called her by name and offered words of encouragement.

**There is also mention of a daughter named Petronilla **who at the age of ten became ill and after that was permanently crippled. At one time, so the story goes, his disciples said that since he had been given the ability to cure others, he should cure his daughter. Peter did cure her, but only temporarily because he believed that there was a reason why she was crippled. (The good news is that she herself prayed for a cure and later she did regain full use of her limbs.)

newadvent.org/cathen/11744a.htm

Capharnaum

Simon settled in “http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03309a.htm”, where he was living with his mother-in-law in his own house (Matthew 8:14; Luke 4:38) at the beginning of “http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08374c.htm” public ministry (about A.D. 26-28). Simon was thus married, and, according to Clement of Alexandria (Stromata, III, vi, ed. Dindorf, II, 276), had children. The same writer relates the tradition that Peter’s wife suffered martyrdom (ibid., VII, xi ed. cit., III, 306). Concerning these facts, adopted by “http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05617b.htm” (Hist. Eccl., III, xxxi) from “http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04045a.htm”, the ancient “http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03712a.htm” literature which has come down to us is silent. Simon pursued in “http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03309a.htm” the profitable occupation of fisherman in “http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14716b.htm”, possessing his own boat (Luke 5:3).

http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/perpetua.html

After being imprisoned several times in Jerusalem because of his faith, Peter left with his wife and possibly others. It is believed that he ministered in Babylon to the Jewish colonists there and it is, also, believed to be his location when he wrote his first epistle