Peters Keys to the Kingdom

[Gabriel_of_12]

When exactly did Peter receive the keys?

Gabriel of 12;


Matthew 16:17
Jesus said to him in reply, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah. For flesh and blood 12 has not revealed this to you, but my heavenly Father.
18
And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, 13 and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.
19
I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. 14 Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”

I would give you a date and time factor but confused about which calender to go by, Jewish or Gregorian?

 

[SemperReformada]

Gabriel of 12;


Matthew 16:17
Jesus said to him in reply, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah. For flesh and blood 12 has not revealed this to you, but my heavenly Father.
18
And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, 13 and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.
19
I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. 14 Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”

I would give you a date and time factor but confused about which calender to go by, Jewish or Gregorian?

I prefer Gregorian but if you feel more comfortable using another calendar such a “stardate…” I’m okay with that too. Anyway, Jesus uses future tense…hence the event happens in the future.

Do we have a scripture that you can provide that fulfills Jesus handing/giving only Peter the keys? I don’t know of any scripture that shows Jesus giving only Peter the keys.

 

[onenow1]

The church is the people of Christ. your the church and Im the church.
sure put words in my mouth like “oh hes questioning Jesus”. NO get real man. Im saying your misinterpreting this scripture and as Tertullian put it best…
“If, because the Lord has said to Peter, ‘Upon this rock I will build My Church,’ ‘to thee have I given the keys of the heavenly kingdom;’ or, ‘Whatsoever thou shalt have bound or loosed in earth, shall be bound or loosed in the heavens,’ you therefore presume that the power of binding and loosing has derived to you, that is, to every Church akin to Peter, what sort of man are you, subverting and wholly changing the manifest intention of the Lord, conferring (as that intention did) this (gift) personally upon Peter? ‘On thee,’ He says, ‘will I build My church;’ and, ‘I will give thee the keys’…and, ‘Whatsoever thou shalt have loosed or bound’…In (Peter) himself the Church was reared; that is, through (Peter) himself; (Peter) himself essayed the key; you see what key: ‘Men of Israel, let what I say sink into your ears: Jesus the Nazarene, a man destined by God for you,’ and so forth. (Peter) himself, therefore, was the first to unbar, in Christ’s baptism, the entrance to the heavenly kingdom, in which kingdom are ‘loosed’ the sins that were beforetime ‘bound;’ and those which have not been ‘loosed’ are ‘bound,’ in accordance with true salvation…(Alexander Roberts and James Donaldson, The Ante-Nicene Fathers (Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1951), Volume IV, Tertullian, On Modesty 21, p. 99).”

Quote = onenow1 Hi, Ibet. Could you be so kind as to tell us, which ecclesial community has the fullness of truth?

The Baptists
The Methodists etc. etc. etc. I’m sure you know they all have different winds of doctrine.

A message from Bishop Fulton J. Sheen…
“If I were not a Catholic, and were looking for the true Church in the world today, I would look for the one Church which did not get along well with the world; in other words, I would look for the Church which the world hates. My reason for doing this would be, that if Christ is in any one of the churches in the world today, He must still be hated as He was when He was on earth in the flesh. If you would find Christ today, then find the Church that does not get along with the world. Look for the Church which is hated by the world, as Christ was hated by the world. Look for the Church which is accused of being behind the times, as Our Lord was accused of being ignorant and of never having learned. Look for the Church which men sneer at as socially inferior, as they sneered at Our Lord because He came from Nazareth. Look for the Church which is accused of having a devil, as Our Lord was accused of being possessed by Beelzebub, the Prince of Devils. Look for the Church which, in seasons of bigotry, men say must be destroyed in the name of GOD as men crucified Christ and thought they had done a service to GOD. Look for the Church which the world rejects because it claims it is infallible, as Pilate rejected Christ because He called Himself The Truth. Look for the Church which is rejected by the world as Our Lord was rejected by men. Look for the Church which amid the confusion of conflicting opinions, its members love as they love Christ, and respect its Voice as the very voice of its Founder, and the suspicion will grow, that if the Church is unpopular with the spirit of the world, then it is unworldly, and if it is unworldly, it is other-worldly. Since it is other-worldly it is infinitely loved and infinitely hated as was Christ Himself. But only that which is Divine can be infinitely hated and infinitely loved. Therefore the Church is Divine.”

Msgr Fulton J. Sheen D.D…

Peace,onenow1opcorn:

 

[Bob_Crowley]

Ok clearly and let me know if im the only one that thinks this or…? but it seems to me that the major dif between the Catholics and protestants is clearly Peter and his keys to the kingdom which i would argue has been horribly taken out of context and personally would go as far to say Peter never intentioned any succession of a “seat” also that there are no other scriptures you can dig up to support that idea.
your thoughts?

Christ was setting up an authorative office, beginning with Peter. There was hardly any point in giving Peter permanent personal keys, if he himself was going to be dead in around forty years. Wha’t’s the use of having a church if you’re not going to give it any authority? The result in Protestantism for example is a divided house, where 30,000 denonimations and sects can’t even agree amongst themselves.

It also needs to be read in conjunction with “What you bind on earth will be bound in heaven; and what you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.” Once again, there was hardly any point in giving this sort of authority to a man who’s going to be dead in 40 years. Christ is God remember, and His Word reverberates throughout eternity. This was all to do with setting up His Church. This wasn’t all being done just for Peter’s personal benefit.

That Peter had authority to “bind” was seen in his death sentence on Ananias and Sapphira. They just dropped dead.

The early church fathers pretty much unaminously agreed that the Pope, Bishop of Rome, was the inheritor of Peter’s authority. In fact this was the case right up to the Reformation, when the princes and politicians of Western Europe wanted to get their hands on church property, and negate the authority of the Pope for their own POLITICAL purposes. Luther gave them the excuse they needed. Europe was rocked by wars which killed millions, because man had divided Christ’s Church.

There’s also Peter’s Primacy, and if you go through the NT, you will find Peter easily outstrips the other 11 disciples in just about every measure, from the number of times he’s mentioned, his first place in every list of disciples, it was from his boat that Christ preached, it was Peter who addressed the Sanhedrin at his trial, he spoke tot the crowd at Pentecost, he spoke authoritively at the first council, he sentenced Ananias and Sapphira to death; Christ told him to “confirm your brothers”, “feed my lambs” etc. etc.

 

[Louie1983]

I prefer Gregorian but if you feel more comfortable using another calendar such a “stardate…” I’m okay with that too. Anyway, Jesus uses future tense…hence the event happens in the future.

Do we have a scripture that you can provide that fulfills Jesus handing/giving only Peter the keys? I don’t know of any scripture that shows Jesus giving only Peter the keys.

um i thought gabriel just did that???

This is where Jesus hands his authority to Peter, but Peter does not assume this role fully until Jesus ascends into heaven. Until after pentecost to be more precise.

 

[onenow1]

Ok clearly and let me know if im the only one that thinks this or…? but it seems to me that the major dif between the Catholics and protestants is clearly Peter and his keys to the kingdom which i would argue has been horribly taken out of context and personally would go as far to say Peter never intentioned any succession of a “seat” also that there are no other scriptures you can dig up to support that idea.
your thoughts?

Quote =onenow1. Looks like Peter’s in charge here.

Acts 1​

15 In those days Peter stood up among the brethren (the company of persons was in all about a hundred and twenty), and said,
16 "Brethren, the scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit spoke beforehand by the mouth of David, concerning Judas who was guide to those who arrested Jesus.
17 For he was numbered among us, and was allotted his share in this ministry.
18 (Now this man bought a field with the reward of his wickedness; and falling headlong he burst open in the middle and all his bowels gushed out.
19 And it became known to all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the field was called in their language Akel’dama, that is, Field of Blood.)
20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation become desolate, and let there be no one to live in it'; and His office let another take.’

Peace, onenow1opcorn:

 

[YADA]

I couldnt let this go lollllllllllllll
your good at taking things even my own words out of context… wow nit pick!
Tertullian is also known as the “Father of Latin Christianity” just fyi
You must have a hard time swallowing Ephesians 2:20
Peace

Ephesians 2:20 does not bother me in the least … why should it? …
“So then you are no longer strangers and sojourners, but you are fellow citizens with the holy ones and members of the household of God, built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the capstone.” …

FYI: there is nothing in this passage that any Christian [Catholic specifically] would have a problem with … Jesus is the Source and Summit of my life as a Christian, I am a member of the Church he founded, a member of the Chruch that is grounded in the apostles and the Church, which is the foundation oof Truth, entrusted with safe guarding that Truth and spreading the Good News [Gospel] of Salvation in Christ Jesus. I am an heir to the promises of Christ, a Child of the Light, a priest, prophet and king by virtue of my baptism in the “Name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit” …

You have not addressed any of my questions … Why was Peter - alone of all the apostles- renamed? What significance does being renamed by God have in the Scriptures?

Why did Jesus quote Isaiah alost word for word? … If the king appoints a representative, does that mean he has given away his own power or authority and possesses that aautority no longer? …

And from your own choice of scripture … why are not all believers the ‘foundation’ … what is the difference between the foundational rock and the capstone?

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

I prefer Gregorian but if you feel more comfortable using another calendar such a “stardate…” I’m okay with that too. Anyway, Jesus uses future tense…hence the event happens in the future.

Do we have a scripture that you can provide that fulfills Jesus handing/giving only Peter the keys? I don’t know of any scripture that shows Jesus giving only Peter the keys.

Sure;

From Matthews Gospel Jesus gives Peter the Keys (authority) while on earth. Jesus then commands Peter after his resurrection before his ascension into heaven to tend and feed his flock.
See John 21:14-17. This fulfills Jesus after handing the keys over to Peter before his passion and death, then commands Peter to excercise them over his flock that he died for until he returns. Pentecost is when Peter awakens to authoritatively proclaim the Gospel before all the World. So we have a presence tense before Jesus death, and again a command after Jesus resurrection directed to Peter alone. Although Peter objects to little John who is following Jesus and Peter on the beach, and Jesus again rebukes Peter, talk about a “Rock” Jesus made a good choice to build his church upon.

 

[Worthy5]

Peter is not the first actually, its John the Baptist. I suppose if you want to be technical you can say Peter is the first but also is his brother.
2nd the church is not a structure and the rock is clearly Christ. so im not really sure why you cited that one. The church has stood against the gates of hell many times.
and thats nice that Jesus told that to peter but honestly I dont think that has anything to do with a succession system of a physical church…

How do you know? Have you read the original Greek? How do you expect to get a definite divine revelation from written language which is always subject to multiple interpretations and context.

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

Christ was setting up an authorative office, beginning with Peter. There was hardly any point in giving Peter permanent personal keys, if he himself was going to be dead in around forty years. Wha’t’s the use of having a church if you’re not going to give it any authority? The result in Protestantism for example is a divided house, where 30,000 denonimations and sects can’t even agree amongst themselves.

It also needs to be read in conjunction with “What you bind on earth will be bound in heaven; and what you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.” Once again, there was hardly any point in giving this sort of authority to a man who’s going to be dead in 40 years. Christ is God remember, and His Word reverberates throughout eternity. This was all to do with setting up His Church. This wasn’t all being done just for Peter’s personal benefit.

That Peter had authority to “bind” was seen in his death sentence on Ananias and Sapphira. They just dropped dead.

Gabrie of 12;

Peter was also the first recorded apostle to “Raise a dead person” Tabitha from the book of Acts also. Not to mention Jesus gave Peter alone the vision to accept “Gentiles” into his body which is the Catholic Church. Sure Paul evangelized the Gentiles after first addressing the Jews who rejected him. But Jesus gave Peter the vision and message from a vision to accept all Peoples, tongues and nations followed by his command to “Baptise” them.

Your ex protestant enthusiasm brings life to the body of Jesus Christ, God bless you brother and peace be with you:thumbsup:

 

[ParkerD]

The succession of Peter being all of the Catholic popes t date is very problematic to me for the simple reason that the Bible doesn’t support the notion as the Catholic church has chosen to define it.

First of all, Jesus was the stone that the builders rejected and ultimately became the Cornerstone. The Church is founded upon Christ with Peter being given a leadership role. Being given the keys to the Kingdom is not being put in charge of creating and inventing truths.

Secondly, all of the Apostles were given the power to bind and loose. This is shown throughout the Book of Acts.

Sellers1 and IBTrippin,
Hooray for your thoughts and your bravery in expressing them here! I think you’ve been right on target with your understanding of the Bible on this topic.

 

[Louie1983]

Sellers1 and IBTrippin,
Hooray for your thoughts and your bravery in expressing them here! I think you’ve been right on target with your understanding of the Bible on this topic.

Oh Dear.

 

[adstrinity]

I too am enjoying this post! I didn’t realize just how much Peter is prominent in all of Christ’s Early Earthly Church!

And, I would like to share something: Yes, in one passage of the Bible, Jesus IS the corner stone that the buiders rejected, however, in the annalogy in the verse given here, Peter is the Rock upon which Jesus will build His Church; Jesus is the Builder in that annalogy.

 

[ufamtobie]

Ok clearly and let me know if im the only one that thinks this or…? but it seems to me that the major dif between the Catholics and protestants is clearly Peter and his keys to the kingdom which i would argue has been horribly taken out of context and personally would go as far to say Peter never intentioned any succession of a “seat” also that there are no other scriptures you can dig up to support that idea.

your thoughts?

Ibetrippin,

Fisrt of all, did Jesus Christ Build a bible or a Church?

Jesus Christ did not say The gates of Hell can not prevail against the Bible.

Ibetrripin, you say that “There are no other Scripture you can dig up to support that Idea” Again you can not finD everything in scripture. why? because Jesus Christ did not build a Bible but Jesus Christ built a CHURCH.

Ibetrripin, do you believe that George Washington was the first President? Of course you do, because you have read history even though you can not dig up the name of George Washington in the bible. My point is look at the Catholic Church’s HISTORY and believe for it is documented that Peter was the first Pope though you can not find the word Pope in the Bible. No other Protestant Church can claim this truth.

Ibetrripin, Here is a Church that has the History, has the Proof, has the Facts, has the documentaion and yet you still don’t want to believe. Why?

Ufamtobie

 

[Selene]

Ok clearly and let me know if im the only one that thinks this or…? but it seems to me that the major dif between the Catholics and protestants is clearly Peter and his keys to the kingdom which i would argue has been horribly taken out of context and personally would go as far to say Peter never intentioned any succession of a “seat” also that there are no other scriptures you can dig up to support that idea.
your thoughts?

Hello Ibetrippin,

I do not think that the Catholics took the verse out of context. St. Peter is the Leader of the Apostles. Jesus chose 12 apostles, and the selection of the Twelve is recorded in all the Gospels except John and also in the Acts of the Apostles (Matthew 10:2-4, Mark 3:16-19, Luke 6:14-16, Acts 1:13). In these four places, the names of the Twelve are given, but not in the same order. St. Peter is at the head of all four lists, although he was not the first follower of our Lord (John 1:40), nor the oldest (Andrew was older, according to tradition), nor the most beloved one (John 21:7, 20).

When St. Peter acknowledged Christ as the Son of God, our Lord declared that such knowledge was a revelation from God, and on account of his open confession of the truth, Christ promised to build His Church upon him, the Rock, and to entrust to him His entire followers. This is the symbolism of the keys (Matthew 16:18-19). The key that Christ gave to St. Peter symbolized “authority.” It was only St. Peter whom Christ gave the keys to. He did not give it to any other apostles. It was also St. Peter that Christ told to take care of his followers, and He told St. Peter three times to take care of his followers. It was here that Jesus conferred St. Peter office of chief shepherd of the flock (John 21:15-17). After the Ascension, St. Peter exercised his office of chief shepherd by calling for a replacement for Judas (Acts 1:13-22). Filled with the Holy Spirit on Pentecost, he preached as spokesman of the apostles (Acts 2). St. Peter also presided at the meeting held to settle the question whether circumcision was to be imposed on the converted Gentiles (Acts 15; Gal. 2). From the Bible, it is clear that St. Peter was the leader of the Apostles.

Christ told his Apostles to go out and preach the good news to all the nations (Matthew 28:19). It is obvious that the Apostles themselves could not hand on the gospel to everyone in the entire world. There were not enough of them and they would not live forever. And so those who had received the gospel from the Apostles were commissioned to hand it on themselves to others. The Second Letter to Timothy speaks of this:

2 Timothy 2:2 …and what you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust [hand on (parathou)] to faithful men who will be able to teach others also"

Bold is my emphasis

The Apostles built churches and passed on the gospel to bishops, priests, and deacons. But St. Peter was still recognized as holding the office of chief shepherd because Christ gave him the keys and only him. It was also Christ who told St. Peter and only St. Peter to take care of His sheep three times. This was Christ installing St. Peter as leader of his entire flock and leader of the Apostles.

Peace be with you,
Selene

 

[josethomas2005]

It is a truth and basis of a true church that Jesus has built his church on Apostle Peter. A majority of the churches do not accept these facts. They say that jesus is the head of the church and some say that every bishop is in the seat of Peter. All these are done for their survival. Then there are doubts on the validity of Rome’s claim to the see of Peter. Look at the following thread.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=5408199&postcount=1

 

[Sellers1]

Ibetrippin,

Fisrt of all, did Jesus Christ Build a bible or a Church?

Jesus Christ did not say The gates of Hell can not prevail against the Bible.

Ibetrripin, you say that “There are no other Scripture you can dig up to support that Idea” Again you can not finD everything in scripture. why? because Jesus Christ did not build a Bible but Jesus Christ built a CHURCH.

Ibetrripin, do you believe that George Washington was the first President? Of course you do, because you have read history even though you can not dig up the name of George Washington in the bible. My point is look at the Catholic Church’s HISTORY and believe for it is documented that Peter was the first Pope though you can not find the word Pope in the Bible. No other Protestant Church can claim this truth.

Ibetrripin, Here is a Church that has the History, has the Proof, has the Facts, has the documentaion and yet you still don’t want to believe. Why?

Ufamtobie

History yes, proof and facts? Well that’s very debatable and even protestable.

 

[twopekinguys]

The Church is founded upon Christ with Peter being given a leadership role. Being given the keys to the Kingdom is not being put in charge of creating and inventing truths.

Secondly, all of the Apostles were given the power to bind and loose. This is shown throughout the Book of Acts.

Lets look at this in modern terms.

If I (the master of the house) go on vacation/holiday for an extended period of time, I give someone I trust the keys to my house to watch over things in my absence. I put him in charge of my holdings, and trust him to act properly in my behalf during that absence.

Jesus knew he was leaving his earthly kingdom for an extended period of time, and gave his keys to Peter to watch over his house (church).

The Pope is the Vicar of Christ (A vicar is one who represents another and acts as a steward, administering the position held in lieu of the true sovereign)

Yes, all of the Apostles were given the power to bind/loose on Earth, but Peter was clearly chosen as the leader of the 12

 

[Sellers1]

Lets look at this in modern terms.

If I (the master of the house) go on vacation/holiday for an extended period of time, I give someone I trust the keys to my house to watch over things in my absence. I put him in charge of my holdings, and trust him to act properly in my behalf during that absence.

Jesus knew he was leaving his earthly kingdom for an extended period of time, and gave his keys to Peter to watch over his house (church).

The Pope is the Vicar of Christ (A vicar is one who represents another and acts as a steward, administering the position held in lieu of the true sovereign)

Yes, all of the Apostles were given the power to bind/loose on Earth, but Peter was clearly chosen as the leader of the 12

I hardly think that your explanation and belief here is credible. Peter confessed that Jesus is the Christ and the son of God and almost immediately following that confession made a grave error in judgment and was told, ‘get behing me Satan’ by Jesus to signify that error. Peter was wrong just as much as he was correct and was even confronted by St. Paul on doctrinal issues. Leadership role, yes; because he understood much deeper and Jesus knew that. But to use all of this to appoint one denomination as God’s only Church and give it exclusivity is absurd. The Scriptures do not support this at all.

 

[twopekinguys]

I hardly think that your explanation and belief here is credible. Peter confessed that Jesus is the Christ and the son of God and almost immediately following that confession made a grave error in judgment and was told, ‘get behing me Satan’ by Jesus to signify that error. Peter was wrong just as much as he was correct and was even confronted by St. Paul on doctrinal issues. Leadership role, yes; because he understood much deeper and Jesus knew that. But to use all of this to appoint one denomination as God’s only Church and give it exclusivity is absurd. The Scriptures do not support this at all.

But yet, Jesus knew that Peter would deny him 3 times and still gave him the keys to the kingdom. Go figure.

• Matt. 16:16, Mark 8:29; John 6:69 - Peter is first among the apostles to confess the divinity of Christ.
• Matt. 16:18 - Jesus builds the Church only on Peter, the rock, with the other apostles as the foundation and Jesus as the Head.
• Matt. 16:19 - only Peter receives the keys, which represent authority over the Church and facilitate dynastic succession to his authority.
• Matt. 19:27 - Peter speaks on behalf of the apostles by telling Jesus that they have left everything to follow Him.
• John 21:15-17 - Jesus charges Peter to “feed my lambs,” “tend my sheep,” “feed my sheep.” Sheep means all people, even the apostles.

These quotes are taken from another thread, and I believe answer your statements.
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=354814

As far as the Get behind me Satan statement, if you read Matthew in context, you will see that Jesus revealed to them he knew he had to suffer and die for our sins. Peter was pleading with Jesus, hoping that it wouldn’t happen. Jesus’ statement was a way of rebuking him, and letting him know that it indeed must happen. He called Peter a stumbling block by not wanting him to fulfill his mission.

God didn’t create denominations. Man did. After Christ’s death and resurrection, there was only one “church”. It wasn’t until the schism, and reformation that denominations were created. A denomination is man’s way of setting themselves apart from one another.