Physical existance of Heaven and Hell?

[GEddie]

I think that if physical teeth can be gnashed, then it’s a good possibility something physical must be causing the anguish.

Haven’t you ever gnashed your teeth, or heard somebody gnash theirs, over anguish that was purely in the mind?

ICXC NIKA

 

[Back2Church]

Thanks for your reply. I thought we were getting somewhere; it explains what happens and will happen to us, but then the question still remains… where Did Jesus and Mary’s glorified bodies go?

Also, what does it mean when they say heaven is “a state of being?”

Consider that God is not limited to time, like we are. Perhaps their glorified bodies went straight to the new heaven and new earth (which is in the future from our limited perspective). God can do anything, so who knows?

It’s not an answer, but something to ponder.

Also, the idea that God is outside of time means that the new heaven and new earth already exist for him, which means (from his perspective) it’s already populated. So perhaps those who have recieved visions of heaven and hell as physical places are receiving visions of that future place that has yet to be made from our perspective in time.

Ah, time. That limiting, physical perspective. Just trying to imagine a perspective that sees all time as present is mind boggling. It does raise a lot of questions and ideas, though.

 

[Faith1960]

Consider that God is not limited to time, like we are. Perhaps their glorified bodies went straight to the new heaven and new earth (which is in the future from our limited perspective). God can do anything, so who knows?

It’s not an answer, but something to ponder.

Also, the idea that God is outside of time means that the new heaven and new earth already exist for him, which means (from his perspective) it’s already populated. So perhaps those who have recieved visions of heaven and hell as physical places are receiving visions of that future place that has yet to be made from our perspective in time.

Ah, time. That limiting, physical perspective. Just trying to imagine a perspective that sees all time as present is mind boggling. It does raise a lot of questions and ideas, though.

So then would Jesus and Mary be in some other universe, dimension or galaxy we can never reach until our resurrection?

 

[Faith1960]

I wanted to edit my post but the editing option was no longer available, but I wanted to add this to my laast post, what St. Thomas Aquinus and Pope JPII said:

<<<<<< Is heaven a place? In the General Audience of 21 July 1999, Pope John Paul II stated that heaven “is neither an abstraction nor a physical place in the clouds, but a living, personal relationship with the Holy Trinity.”

In this statement, as (almost) always, the great Holy Father was in perfect accord with St. Thomas Aquinas – “Incorporeal things are not in place after a manner known and familiar to us, in which way we say that bodies are properly in place; but they are in place after a manner befitting spiritual substances, a manner that cannot be fully manifest to us”.

What John Paul II wished to stress, and what is especially important to consider today, is that heaven is not to be understood in terrestrial terms.

Heaven is primarily a state of being and is certainly not a ‘place’ in the worldly sense of the term. >>>>>>>

 

[Linux]

I wanted to edit my post but the editing option was no longer available, but I wanted to add this to my laast post, what St. Thomas Aquinus and Pope JPII said:

<<<<<< Is heaven a place? In the General Audience of 21 July 1999, Pope John Paul II stated that heaven “is neither an abstraction nor a physical place in the clouds, but a living, personal relationship with the Holy Trinity.”

In this statement, as (almost) always, the great Holy Father was in perfect accord with St. Thomas Aquinas – “Incorporeal things are not in place after a manner known and familiar to us, in which way we say that bodies are properly in place; but they are in place after a manner befitting spiritual substances, a manner that cannot be fully manifest to us”.

What John Paul II wished to stress, and what is especially important to consider today, is that heaven is not to be understood in terrestrial terms.

Heaven is primarily a state of being and is certainly not a ‘place’ in the worldly sense of the term. >>>>>>>

 

[Linusthe2nd]

Hell is not a place, so that is wrong, regardless of whether or not we will have bodies.

I think it is all about how " place " is defined. Remember the story of the poor man Lazarus and the rich man. Remember the rich man died and cried to abraham to send Lazarus with a few drops of water on his finger to cool his tongue? That seems like some kind of physicality to me. ( Luke 16: 19-31 )

And why would our bodies be resurrected if heaven and hell did not have some kind of physicality? And why will the bodies of the just be resurrected at the perfection of their possible beauty while the resurrected bodies of the damned will reflect the decadance of their profligacy? No, I don’t think John Paul ll has the perfect answer here. Certainly the Beatific Vision will be the essential aspect of Heaven, but I feel confident that there is a kind of physical complement as well. Otherwise why would Paul speak of a new heaven and a new earth? Linus2nd

 

[Faith1960]

Are Jesus and Mary in the spiritual realm and if so is that made possible because they’re in glorified bodies?