Planned Parenthood all out assault on SD

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People want to obliterate it completely in a day. Education sounds like a awful lot of work.
looks like some pretty extensive EDUCATION has been going on for some time. Not they have OVERWHELMING Scientific evidence to back it up. and now 12 states might follow suite…i’d say this is not a waste of taxpayers money 🙂

If someone says “Lord, Lord” and is not against the murder of babies…well, we know what happens in that case 😉
 
I am really sorry to hear that you have come across these kind of people. They are really wolves in sheeps clothing. When I was pro-choice, it was the living testimony of those pro-life people that changed my mind. I came to realize that they are not only in the forfront of the pro-life debate but they also lived it, through charity. Mother Teresa always comes to mind. How can someone who saw so much saddnes be so pro life?
I encounter people all the time who are on the side of the kid until they are actually born. After that it’s not their problem. Wonderful, huh?
 
Sigh Liberalsaved, we’re not all like that…
I am aware. Unfortunately I get involved in too many discussions with people who are moral when it’s photogenic or popular to be so, and wouldn’t be caught dead ladeling soup at a shelter.
 
Orionthehunter wrote:

In all these cases, society has determined to take these actions to protect a member of society from the arbitrary and capricious acts of another.

I think–above–you’re confusing the intent of the law with the law itself. In the examples you enumerated, ‘arbitrary and capricious’ actions are prohibited along with sensible ones and all those in between. For example, perhaps someone somewhere wants to have methamphetamine on hand to use responsibly as a pain-killer in the event of severe disease. He/She is every bit as prohibited from procuring meth as the crack-ho on the corner.

I also somewhat object to the ‘society has determined’ formulation as it ascribes excessive rationality and fairness to a process which–even in a democratic country–is a by-guess-and-by-gosh, chewing-gum-and-chicken-wire affair.

Whenever we discuss American Catholicism, I think it is important to acknowledge the chasm between doctrine and practice. An obsessive rectitude favoring doctrine over practice–and hectoring practice to more resemble doctrine–is the ur-motivation for Mother Angelica Brigades. I think this is a silly cause, and ought to be discarded.

a) In a well-ordered world, what ought the legal punishment be for a woman voluntarily seeking and undergoing an abortion?

b) In a well-ordered world, what ought the legal punishment be for committing a first degree murder of an adult?

If your answer in any way diverges between ‘a’ and ‘b’–then you and I are in agreement that abortion most certainly does not equal murder.

Lovingly
 
I encounter people all the time who are on the side of the kid until they are actually born. After that it’s not their problem. Wonderful, huh?
I suppose you have never been to a womens crises center. Or how about a maternity home. The people who staff these places and volunteer are some of the most passionate people. They are not just saying don’t have an abortion and never helping. My daughter and I volunteered at materinty home where the mother and child, if she decided to keep the child, where welcomed to stay as long as they could. Many people in the community would come to help watch the children while the mother was at work. They brought food, clothing and toys for the mother and child. There was plenty of counseling avialble.

I truely believe that if you are truely incountering people who are not caring than you are not looking in the right places. I can honsestly tell you in all the years that I have been voluntering and supporting life I have never seen such acts as the ones you mentioned.
 
**Given the following, it does not likely that we will see radical change from the Supreme Court, even with its new members, relying on the reasoning that supports the SD legislation. Legislation that SD or any other state enacts that conflicts with current legal rulings on abortion are destined to be struck down: **

Tuesday, October 10, 2006

Court refuses to reopen 1973 abortion ruling


The Supreme Court, as expected, refused on Tuesday to allow an Atlanta woman to reopen the 1973 ruling that was a companion case to Roe v. Wade (complete orders list here). The case of Doe v. Bolton, also decided Jan. 22, 1973, added to Roe by restricting the medical requirements imposed on the abortion option. Sandra Cano of Atlanta, who was the “Mary Doe” of that case, asked the Court to reopen her case under federal court Rule 60 (b), which allows reconsideration of a prior judgment if its continued enforcement has become unjust.
Cano’s appeal was denied without comment, and with no indication of any dissent. Georgia officials had declined even to respond to the petition, and the Court did not seek one from them. (Doe v. Baker, docket 06-162). The Court had similarly denied the same effort by Norma McCorvey, the “Jane Roe” of the lead 1973 case establishing a right to seek an abortion. (*McCorvey v. Hll *was denied on Feb. 22 of last year). The addition of two new Justices to the Court since then made no difference in the Court’s response to the argument that medical science and the law had changed since 1973, so the issue should be reconsidered.
 
I suppose you have never been to a womens crises center. Or how about a maternity home. The people who staff these places and volunteer are some of the most passionate people. They are not just saying don’t have an abortion and never helping. My daughter and I volunteered at materinty home where the mother and child, if she decided to keep the child, where welcomed to stay as long as they could. Many people in the community would come to help watch the children while the mother was at work. They brought food, clothing and toys for the mother and child. There was plenty of counseling avialble.

I truely believe that if you are truely incountering people who are not caring than you are not looking in the right places. I can honsestly tell you in all the years that I have been voluntering and supporting life I have never seen such acts as the ones you mentioned.
sigh
I didn’t say everyone I encountered was like that.
 
I am aware. Unfortunately I get involved in too many discussions with people who are moral when it’s photogenic or popular to be so, and wouldn’t be caught dead ladeling soup at a shelter.
Help me see your point.

Are you saying that because you feel some people are hypocrites that abortion should just be permitted?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberalsaved forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
I am aware. Unfortunately I get involved in too many discussions with people who are moral when it’s photogenic or popular to be so, and wouldn’t be caught dead ladeling soup at a shelter.
Help me see your point.

Are you saying that because you feel some people are hypocrites that abortion should just be permitted?
and apparently because some people ALL people are hypocrites, cause were sinners, that negates accountablity for our actions as well.

Do you agree with this statement Liberlsaved:
“Reproduction is not a right, it is a responsibity by way of priviledge”
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberalsaved forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
I am aware. Unfortunately I get involved in too many discussions with people who are moral when it’s photogenic or popular to be so, and wouldn’t be caught dead ladeling soup at a shelter.

and apparently because some people ALL people are hypocrites, cause were sinners, that negates accountablity for our actions as well.

Do you agree with this statement Liberlsaved:
“Reproduction is not a right, it is a responsibity by way of priviledge”
Those of us who oppose capital punishment run into this all the time. I can recall the night they executed Gary Graham in Huntsville We had a huge crowd-Bianca Jagger, Jesse Jackson , all the usual suspects . and of course all the networks were there. A week later they executed a mexican alien who had murdered someone in a drug deal gone bad. there were maybe a dozen of us standing in silent prayer.

However Ill admit we were glad of the publicity as it helps the cause. just wish there were a little more consistency-especially on the part of the Networks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberalsaved forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
I am aware. Unfortunately I get involved in too many discussions with people who are moral when it’s photogenic or popular to be so, and wouldn’t be caught dead ladeling soup at a shelter.

and apparently because some people ALL people are hypocrites, cause were sinners, that negates accountablity for our actions as well.

Do you agree with this statement Liberlsaved:
“Reproduction is not a right, it is a responsibity by way of priviledge”
I agree you’re both putting words in my mouth. But it hardly fazes me any more.
 
… Legislation that SD or any other state enacts that conflicts with current legal rulings on abortion are destined to be struck down…
Hi Island Oak - I understand you have a legal background, and even though I don’t, my take on this - speaking ex cathedra (from my computer chair) 🙂 - is that it seems to me that Doe v Bolton will become irrelevant when Roe v Wade is struck down. And some pro-Life leaders I respect say that that is a realistic possibility if the South Dakota abortion ban is upheld by vote and challenged by Planned Parenthood.

I am one who feels that no U.S. legal construct which says it is ok to kill an unborn child at any stage of development can remain in force indefinitely without a sound reason - and there is none. So it is only a matter of time before Roe is overturned. But even so, the current unjust law will not change unless it is challenged repeatedly until every false excuse for its existence is demolished. Of course the timing is up to God, but step by step I see this happening even now.

Our job is to keep praying, and keep using the graces we receive through prayer to stay focused, keep fighting, and not give in to defeatism or confusion. While it’s true we need to be wise in this endeavor, respected pro-Life leaders like Judie Brown of the American Life League have said that the battle in South Dakota is crucially important. I believe them. And the #1 U.S. abortion provider, Planned Parenthood, seems to feel the same way, judging by the large amount of money and effort they are putting into South Dakota at this time.

Please contribute!, please pray!, fast!, exhort others to do the same!, pray some more!
VoteYesForLife.com/donate.asp

Abortion will end in this country.
And it will end sooner than most people think.

  • Father Frank Pavone of Priests for Life, June 2006, ‘Life Talk’, right after interviewing Leslee Unrue, an awesome pro-Life leader from South Dakota.
 
Listen to Barbara McGuigan (10-24-06) on EWTN radio interview Dr. Allen Unruh on a update on the fight for life in South Dakota. Listen Below…

voteyesforlife.com

**Program Name: **Open Line

http://www.ewtn.com/images/smallspeaker.gif Listen Nowhttp://www.ewtn.com/images/disk.gif [Download](http://www.ewtn.com/vondemand/audio...urce=frmselectseries.asp&seriesID=&T1=barbara mcguigan)

Series Name: Open Line

**Host: **Barbara McGuigan

**Date Produced: **10/24/2006

**Description: **Fast-paced call-in show, with a new host every day!
 
Sorry for the slow response PLAL - that show is very good! I enjoyed listening to Dr Unruh. I have heard his wife interviewed before, but have not heard him speak. They are both my heroes for all they are doing.

I would encourage everybody to listen to the EWTN audios linked above. 👍
 
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