Please help me understand the Intercession of the Saints

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I would like to help you on the intercession of saints. However it would take a very long reply. I would like to send you a CD that would answer your question but I guess that would not be possible. The next best thing would be to give you a link to go to.
The speaker is John Martinogni. The link is:
www.biblechristiansociety.com
When you get to the page click on the title "Apologetics-Free Audio Downloads.
When you get there scroll down to the title “Communion Of Saints.”
 
Eire said:
I would like to help you on the intercession of saints. However it would take a very long reply. I would like to send you a CD that would answer your question but I guess that would not be possible. The next best thing would be to give you a link to go to.
The speaker is John Martinogni. The link is:
www.biblechristiansociety.com
When you get to the page click on the title "Apologetics-Free Audio Downloads.
When you get there scroll down to the title “Communion Of Saints.”
Click to expand...
I second this advice - his talks are fantastic!

firstmode, the other thing I would add is regarding the Body of Christ which someone else covered -

1 Corinthians 12:20-21
As it is, there are many parts, but one body. The eye cannot say to the hand, “I don’t need you!” And the head cannot say to the feet, “I don’t need you!”

You see, there are many parts of the Body of Christ, those of us here on earth, those in purgatory, those in Heaven, the saints, the angels, the archangels, the Holy Trinity! We all need each other, this is the communion of saints.

We also know from 1 Corinthians 12:26 “If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.”

We also know from Luke 15 that “there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent.” - so surely those in heaven are aware of what is happening here on earth don’t you think?

The final thing I will offer is **Hebrews 12:**1 “Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles, and let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us.”

Who is the cloud of witnesses?

For Catholic belief, it is a great comfort for us in this wicked world to have all the angels and saints in Heaven praying for us to continue in perseverance. If we can ask other Christians on earth to pray for us, then there is no reason we can’t ask Christians in Heaven to pray for us too since we are all, through our baptism, members of the body of Christ - and the body of Christ is made up of many parts and cannot be separated or divided.

There is also a Catholic Answers radio talk that you should listen to as well - it’s from about a year ago but I still have it on my ipod as it explains things quite nicely catholic.com/radio/event.php?calendar=1&category=&event=5773&date=2009-07-10

I hope this helps
 
firstmode, here are quotes from the Early Church Fathers on the intercession of Saints:

catholic.com/library/Intercession_of_the_Saints.asp

Another thing to keep in mind is the word ‘pray’ meaning ‘to ask’ so when I pray to the Saints, I am asking them the pray for me, to join my prayer, to pray for others. We are all asking GOD to answer the prayer. Saints do not have the power to answer prayers, only GOD can do this - it is their INTERCESSION that we ask for since they have been perfected and made righteous in Heaven and we know from James 5:16 “Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man is powerful and effective.”

I like to think that instead of just me knocking on God’s door - I have a dozen others knocking on the door also - this also comes from Matthew 18:20 “For where two or three come together in my name, there am I with them.”
 
Firstmode,

I understand your struggle, as I have navigated it myself. One of the things you must understand is that prayer is not a competition. There are no trump cards. We all have direct access to God through Christ and his mediation. We also have access to this mystical body of which all who call on Christ are a part, whether here or in in heaven. There is no competition or “trumping” when asking a saint or for Our Lady to pray for us, any more than it is a trump for me to ask you to pray for my dad (pray for my dad). I hope that you can overcome this. We are truly surrounded by a great cloud of witnesses and they are ever so heartily cheering us on, and praying for us.

Rumpelstilltskin… you are flirting very heavily with a heresy. It is called Nestorianism. Look it up.
 
There is good and evil in this world.God is the essence of goodness and there are people who are in the same or similar wavelenth as God by virtue of the good life they lead on earth.Some were living saints for example Padre Pio of Italy is one such person.We need not go that far there are people in everyday life who are close to God and when they pray God will certainly listen to them.There are also Sunday Catholics or Christians who fulfil their obligations but lack the faith of a Christian,Will God listen to their pleas?They may ask for material bebefits while the Christian close to God looks for eternal Glory.Think of prayer as the sending of waves.Why do we have mass prayers.When people are deceased we assemble together and have a mass or Christians have a Thanksgiving service.Why mass prayers because there is efficacy and strength in numbers.The waves going up to the Lord is strong.What if we get the waves from heaven.We know of good people who have gone there before us and why cannot we get their help.These are the Saints.
 
To that insightful post I would add these teachings of our Church

The doctrines of the Church are very scriptural
And the Holy Scriptures clearly present a unified Church and says that it should not accept division, dissension, and two mindedness But be one minded and surrender to One Authority system ruled by Christ as “we” are inheritors of the redemption from Judaism and by His blood we count ourselves among the redeemed when he rose from the dead so that those who pass away in Christ might NEVER die.
Judaism from which are Faith is based and then fulfilled in the New Testament was and is over 1/3 based on oral tradition. Most of it wasn’t written down by the Jewish people on purpose. Because as the multiple versions of the bible can attest written word is corrupted more easily than an international oral tradition that can be verified in it’s continuity over time across continents

Christianity was instituted as the world’s salvation system based on “The Word Of God” Only the Word of God is not only the written Word but The spoken oral tradition as well.
Christianity is + Sacred Scripture AND Sacred Tradition It is a like a woman’s braided hair that cannot be separated without damaging it.
There are several scriptures that substantiate this and clearly dilineate when the Holy Writers were talking about the written word and the heard or spoken word.
No where in either Catholic or Protestant version of the Holy Bible does it say that the Christian Faith is based only on the scripture.

The 2 Thes scripture that comes to mind is here for you AND there are several others if anyone is interested we can go over them !
2 Thes - 2:15
Therefore, brethren, stand fast; and hold the traditions which you have learned, whether by word, or by our epistle.

Furthermore I would remind that Sacred Tradition has as one of it’s greatest components
Sacred Art work
I would say that the doctrines that are most contested by Protestants such as these can be easily refuted by examining both these scriptures against the 1st and 2nd century scientific dating of the fresco murals venerating Christian Martyred Saints and The Holy Eucharist

Then at that point when opponents would still hold out dissension the only place left to turn is by asking by what authority do you base YOUR beliefs
We as Catholics would turn back to Sacred Scriptures to discuss the scriptural substantiation of the apostolic succession of Bishops via the laying on of hands through the generations of which there are also many scriptures

Remember what Cardinal Newman said to go deep in scripture and deep in history is to become Catholic -

Let us study our Faith as a community for by study the scriptures you will be told by God not by men what the Truth is
 
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