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TheLittleLady
Guest
But that does not fit into the nice soundbyte world.
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Tis_Bearself
Patron
Barring some giant revolution, coup or apocalyptic event, Muslims are likely to get Sharia law in the United States about as much as Catholics are likely to get the United States placed under control of the Pope.
Furthermore, even those Muslims who support “sharia law” have widely divergent ideas about what that actually means.
“Sharia law” at this time in the USA is a buzzword designed to scare people. It’s highly likely that the more Muslims live in a society like USA, the less interested many of them will be in Sharia law. I might give your argument more credence if we lived in a small homogeneous country where a large influx of immigrants could change the makeup of society significantly; we don’t. Or if we lived in a country prone to regular and possibly violent legal upheavals. We don’t.
When I was 15 years old, I walked home in a Catholic school uniform. It was what I wore to school. Period. Anybody who wanted to paint pictures about what that meant, symbolically, was free to do so and probably did do so, but the picture is in their own head.
Furthermore, even those Muslims who support “sharia law” have widely divergent ideas about what that actually means.
“Sharia law” at this time in the USA is a buzzword designed to scare people. It’s highly likely that the more Muslims live in a society like USA, the less interested many of them will be in Sharia law. I might give your argument more credence if we lived in a small homogeneous country where a large influx of immigrants could change the makeup of society significantly; we don’t. Or if we lived in a country prone to regular and possibly violent legal upheavals. We don’t.
When I was 15 years old, I walked home in a Catholic school uniform. It was what I wore to school. Period. Anybody who wanted to paint pictures about what that meant, symbolically, was free to do so and probably did do so, but the picture is in their own head.
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angel12
Guest
Not that they had a pre-determined agenda or anything.
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angel12
Guest
Nonetheless,the headline is very misleading. The poll does not bear out your claims against Muslims.
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Orion1963
Guest
In Islam Jesus is referred to in the Koran asʿĪsā ibn Maryam (‘Jesus, son of Mary’), or as Jesus. To them, it is understood, to be the penultimate prophet and messenger of God and al-Masih, the Arabic term for Messiah (Christ), sent to guide the Children of Israel with a new revelation - does that sound familiar, “the Gospel”. Jesus is believed to be a prophet who neither married nor had any children and is reflected as a significant figure, being found in the Quran in 93 verses with various titles attached, such as “Son of Mary” and other relational terms, mentioned directly and indirectly, over 187 times. Jesus is the most mentioned person in the Koran by reference; 25 times by the name Isa, third-person 48 times, first-person 35 times, and the rest as titles and attributes.
The Koran mentions Jesus to have been born a “pure boy” (without sin) to Mary as the result of virginal conception, similar to the event of the Annunciation in Christianity, sound familiar? In Islamic theology, Jesus is believed to have performed many miracles, several being mentioned in the Koran such as speaking as an infant, healing various ailments such as blindness, raising the dead to life, and making birds out of clay and breathing life into them, some of them sound familiar to us Catholics. Over the centuries, Islamic writers have referenced other miracles like casting out demons, having borrowed from pre-Islamic sources, some heretical, and from canonical sources as legends about Jesus were expanded. Like all prophets in Islamic thought, Jesus is also called a Muslim (one who submits to the will of God), as he preached that his followers should adopt the “straight path”. Jesus is written about by some Muslim scholars as the perfect man.
And for the above reasons and some much more he is revere by the Muslims.
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Spyridon
Guest
I see nothing wrong with this.
And you’re free to believe we worship different gods, but that is not what the Church teaches.
And you’re free to believe we worship different gods, but that is not what the Church teaches.
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phil19034
Guest
But with all fairness, a Catholic school uniform isn’t the same thing. Most people know that non-Catholics go to Catholic School. So just because a kid goes to Catholic school doesn’t mean they are a “Papist.”
And what you write about Sharia Law is fair. However, my whole point is that the fear of Sharia Law and the fear of Muslim invasion (bloodless or bloody) has people fearful.
Fearful people react sometimes in unChristian ways.
Finally, some people resent how they feel that we must constantly apologize for being Christian while our kids are taught about other faiths in school but not about Christianity. For example: at a local YMCA preschool, the kids have a Hanukkah Party a Kwanzaa Party and a Ramadan Party where they learn all about the customs and history of each. But the only thing they do from Christmas is focus on Santa Clause (no Christ). And this is at the YMCA - the Young Men’s Christian Association.
So this is why people are angry.
AGAIN - there is NO excuse for assaulting anyone, spiting on anyone, or hatred. But this is why (warranted or not) people fear Muslims. We cannot solve problems when we ignore or discount the reasons.
God bless
And what you write about Sharia Law is fair. However, my whole point is that the fear of Sharia Law and the fear of Muslim invasion (bloodless or bloody) has people fearful.
Fearful people react sometimes in unChristian ways.
Finally, some people resent how they feel that we must constantly apologize for being Christian while our kids are taught about other faiths in school but not about Christianity. For example: at a local YMCA preschool, the kids have a Hanukkah Party a Kwanzaa Party and a Ramadan Party where they learn all about the customs and history of each. But the only thing they do from Christmas is focus on Santa Clause (no Christ). And this is at the YMCA - the Young Men’s Christian Association.
So this is why people are angry.
AGAIN - there is NO excuse for assaulting anyone, spiting on anyone, or hatred. But this is why (warranted or not) people fear Muslims. We cannot solve problems when we ignore or discount the reasons.
God bless
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Spyridon
Guest
There ARE serious problems with Islam on an ideological, political, and theological level.
But to be up in arms because we say a prayer with a group of Muslims, or because we admit to worship the same God (even if they have wrong ideas about him), or to go around bragging and trying to justify how you don’t trust Muslims because you see an AK-47 behind them all…
These are all examples of plain old bigotry and Islamophobia.
But to be up in arms because we say a prayer with a group of Muslims, or because we admit to worship the same God (even if they have wrong ideas about him), or to go around bragging and trying to justify how you don’t trust Muslims because you see an AK-47 behind them all…
These are all examples of plain old bigotry and Islamophobia.
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anon65111186
Guest
Obviously the Muslims have a different understanding of Jesus and Mary, and general love of both of them is good.
The problem is you can’t love what you don’t know, if they know another Jesus or Mary, a Jesus who is not God, or Mary who is not immaculately conceived, they cannot claim to love them.
It can’t be common if it is not the same. I can’t say that America and Syria have a government in common because both countries just happen to have governments.
Perhaps some Muslims who attend will hear what Catholics believe and be convinced of the true Jesus and Mary. That is one possible outcome.
Another possible though perhaps unlikely outcome is that Catholics weak in their faith consider becoming Muslim.
The problem is you can’t love what you don’t know, if they know another Jesus or Mary, a Jesus who is not God, or Mary who is not immaculately conceived, they cannot claim to love them.
It can’t be common if it is not the same. I can’t say that America and Syria have a government in common because both countries just happen to have governments.
Perhaps some Muslims who attend will hear what Catholics believe and be convinced of the true Jesus and Mary. That is one possible outcome.
Another possible though perhaps unlikely outcome is that Catholics weak in their faith consider becoming Muslim.
Tis_Bearself
Patron
This may be more true today, but in my day, Catholic school was 95 percent Catholics. I lived in a very Catholic area.
That doesn’t make it okay, and we are supposed to actively work towards behaving in more Christian ways and letting go of the fear that gets in the way of love. It looks like this parish church is trying to take a step in that direction, including helping the Muslims to get over the fears that some of them very likely have about Christians.
I didn’t see any apology or suggestion of one in the announcement of an ecumenical prayer service. I’m pretty sure St. Philip Neri will have Masses and what not as usual all week long. This to me doesn’t look like anyone acting sorry for being Catholic. So if people want to sit around being angry then their anger in this case is misplaced, un-Christian, and makes CAF look like a giant group of bigots, which is frankly embarrassing.
People are so anxious on this board to offer “fraternal correction” if somebody misses Mass.
How about a big fat “fraternal correction” for reacting with fear and bigotry towards another church that a Pastor has invited over as guests? And for accusing those of us of “virtue signaling” who choose not to be fearful or bigoted, but to try to make a reasonable effort to reach out to our brothers and sisters of another faith? And for making posts trying to justify the hatred of others?
Whatever happened to “C’mon people now, smile on your brother, everybody get together, try to love one another right now?” I used to see that PSA on TV every Saturday morning when I was 5.
I’m also fully aware that a lot of people in the United States who have had a bad experience with someone from another race or culture or religion, or who have never been out of their own backyards, can be regular Archie Bunkers, I know all the reasons why, but that doesn’t mean I’m going to stand there and say it is OK to do.
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phil19034
Guest
I agree with you 100%
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phil19034
Guest
I do not diagree with a single thing you said here. I’m not condoning the behavior you are discussing. And I’m not defending it. I’m simply trying to explain why it exists (warranted or not warranted).phil19034:
This may be more true today, but in my day, Catholic school was 95 percent Catholics. I lived in a very Catholic area.
That doesn’t make it okay, and we are supposed to actively work towards behaving in more Christian ways and letting go of the fear that gets in the way of love. It looks like this parish church is trying to take a step in that direction, including helping the Muslims to get over the fears that some of them very likely have about Christians.
I didn’t see any apology or suggestion of one in the announcement of an ecumenical prayer service. I’m pretty sure St. Philip Neri will have Masses and what not as usual all week long. This to me doesn’t look like anyone acting sorry for being Catholic. So if people want to sit around being angry then their anger in this case is misplaced, un-Christian, and makes CAF look like a giant group of bigots, which is frankly embarrassing.
People are so anxious on this board to offer “fraternal correction” if somebody misses Mass.
How about a big fat “fraternal correction” for reacting with fear and bigotry towards another church that a Pastor has invited over as guests? And for accusing those of us of “virtue signaling” who choose not to be fearful or bigoted, but to try to make a reasonable effort to reach out to our brothers and sisters of another faith? And for making posts trying to justify the hatred of others?
Whatever happened to “C’mon people now, smile on your brother, everybody get together, try to love one another right now?” I used to see that PSA on TV every Saturday morning when I was 5.
I’m also fully aware that a lot of people in the United States who have had a bad experience with someone from another race or culture or religion, or who have never been out of their own backyards, can be regular Archie Bunkers, I know all the reasons why, but that doesn’t mean I’m going to stand there and say it is OK to do.
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phil19034
Guest
BTW - I never implied that what St. Philip Neri Parish was doing was wrong. The only thing I ever said about it was that I’m not a fan of most ecumenical prayer services because I feel that they unintentionally send a message that all religions are equal.
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Teek
Guest
Catholic Study Bible
2 John 1:7-11
7 For many deceivers have gone out into the world, men who will not acknowledge the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh; such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist.
8 Look to yourselves, that you may not lose what you have worked for, but may win a full reward.
9 Any one who goes ahead and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God; he who abides in the doctrine has both the Father and the Son.
10 If any one comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into the house or give him any greeting;
11 for he who greets him shares his wicked work.
2 John 1:7-11
7 For many deceivers have gone out into the world, men who will not acknowledge the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh; such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist.
8 Look to yourselves, that you may not lose what you have worked for, but may win a full reward.
9 Any one who goes ahead and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God; he who abides in the doctrine has both the Father and the Son.
10 If any one comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into the house or give him any greeting;
11 for he who greets him shares his wicked work.
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obvious_ron
Guest
This is part of my skepticism as well. Even if that is not the intent of the parties who arranged and prepared the prayer service.
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SuperLuigi
Guest
If you think hatred of Muslims is epidemic because of a few isolated incidents, I can’t wait to hear what you’re going to say is happening to straight, white men.
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SuperLuigi
Guest
That’s easy to do when Islam is on the receiving end. What about it’s just your average white guy in a MAGA hat?
Would you be so willing and eager to talk about all of the violence against Trump supporters? Because I don’t see you or anyone else on here who cries for Chrisitan charity when it comes to Islam policing your own side when it comes to US politics. In fact, these accounts avoid such conversations like the plague.
My issues isn’t with this event or with Islam. My issue is with how people respond to both.
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0Scarlett_nidiyilii
Guest
I’d prolly go and check it out.
I enjoy hearing people’s stories.
If I don’t like what I’m hearing or the direction it’s heading, I can always leave.
I enjoy hearing people’s stories.
If I don’t like what I’m hearing or the direction it’s heading, I can always leave.
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Isca
Guest
That would be a criminal offence in the UK, I’m glad to say (in reply to your post about people speaking abusively to a woman wearing a hijab).
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Tis_Bearself
Patron
I can understand being wary of ecumenism. I think there’s a point beyond which it goes too far, which was shown in that video that went around a couple weeks ago that had some lady doing a free-form dance on a Catholic cathedral altar while men praying the Rosary were sworn at and thrown out of the church.
A moderate amount of ecumenism is good though. I can say that especially since I am in no danger of leaving the Church any time soon and do not have to worry about my kids being influenced to think all religions are equal as I don’t have kids. I’m pretty sure my mother felt the same way as you do. It’s a point on which she and I differed.
A moderate amount of ecumenism is good though. I can say that especially since I am in no danger of leaving the Church any time soon and do not have to worry about my kids being influenced to think all religions are equal as I don’t have kids. I’m pretty sure my mother felt the same way as you do. It’s a point on which she and I differed.
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