Poem of the Man-God

[BVXI]

Stick To Maria Valtorta, you won’t be led astray, you will find the True Jesus you’ve been longing for.

Peace and good will

 

[Eliza10]

I just want to jump in here as I am reading this thread. I do not want respond to any person here who wrote months ago. But I want to say, someone here wrote comparing Valtorta to Luisia Piccarretta! Please! There is no comparison whatsoever! There is no new gospel with Valtorta. Eminent theologians, priests, bishops and a Pope tell us that NOTHING in Valtorta has error, there is no new revelation init, and nothing goes against the Gospels or any Catholic theology.

Piccaretta, on the otherhand, oh, my. Read this from the “Divine Will” website:

To be on the right track in understanding the Doctrine of the Divine Will, three things are most important. Number one, in all our acts, in all our rounds, we must be one with Luisa; we must echo Luisa; we must go to Luisa; we must plead with Luisa; we must pray to Luisa. This will prove to Jesus that we have an understanding of the beautiful diary of the Divine Will. Otherwise, one does not understand the diary of Luisa. As one continues to read, study, and put into practice the “Truths” of the Volumes, one begins to realize that next to Jesus, Mary, and Adam before the Fall is Luisa, who is the only one born of original sin, who possesses the fullness of the Divine Will. As Jesus through Our Lady brought about the Kingdom of Redemption 2000 years ago, Jesus and Mary now through Luisa will bring the Kingdom of Sanctification, which is the Kingdom of God on earth as it is in Heaven, the fulfillment of the prayer of the Our Father.
The second important point to understand is that the first one, next to Luisa, to possess this “Gift” of gifts, this “Prodigy” of prodigies, to “Live in” Its fullness, will be the Holy Father.

What a mess! Who can believe that stuff?

There is no comparison. It is like saying Pope John Paull II is comparable to Bill Clinton. Yes. They are both men.
Sorry this is a bit off topic but it was mentioned in this thread and not responded to.

 

[Eliza10]

All this private revelation stuff freaks me out…how fitting that the random name i chose for myself here is “revelations”. When i read these sorts of literature, unapproved literature, i get uneasy.

You cannot link all private revelations into one category - “these sorts of things”. There is the work of God, and the work of the imitator of the works of God. They all fall into one or the other.

But really some people shoudl be more humble, and less rash about sitting as Judge, calling a work they haven’t read or studied a work of the evil imitator. Shouldn’t they be concerned about their embarassment before God someday when it turns out to be His - and they wasted time on earth ignorantly battling His work?

If i don’t read it, i feel like i might be truly missing out on something from God, and when i do read it i feel like i am wasting time that i could be spending with Jesus. For a while, i was seriously messed up and very confused.

Well if you were reading Luisa Piccarerreta, that would mess you up.

If you feel messed up and unsure about a private revelation, then don’t read it. If there is no peace there, maybe God doesn’t want it for you now (or ever). Maybe what He wants for you is to learn how to listen and discern truth before you read any private revelations.

If you never read any you’ll be fine. You’re Catholic, and therefore swimming in available Graces. More than you’d need in any lifetime.

…
I look at these Valtorta things the same way i look at the piccaretta things…

This was the statement that prompted my above post.

…, and the same way i would have looked at the Divine Mercy things before she was canonized. They are all fallible, and potentially contain some tidbits of good revelation.

Divine Mercy has more than tidbits. Its a rich feast of the teaching of God. Divine Mercy is now read at Mass! Yes thats the Divine Mercy that was put on Forbidden Index at the same time as The Poem of the Man-God.

And, remember!! (in case you haven’t read it many times in this thread already by those who like to repost things over and over again) – *the Index of Forbidden Books still retains its moral force! :tsktsk: *

For every page of private revelation you read, read 5 of the bible. Or 10 of any other approved literature. -revelations

Ugh. Sorry, but I hate that advice. Not the source of the advice - he is great. But this advice? Its oft repeated, and always in the manner and spirit that people fling Bible verses at others in order to avoid real communication or human connection. But can you really picture anyone actually following this advice? C’mon!

 

[Eliza10]

I wrote this before Ash Wednesday:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eliza10 forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif

Except only I can say that the books have truly, truly blessed me. They are a gift of the God. He is my Shephard, and I know His voice.

And while I was offline during Lent, adrift wrote:

Quote:
But people claim that never have they understood Scripture as when they have read “Poem.” Understood in a certain way, as explained by Maria Valtorta! But this way the Church has said is not according to its mind. Catholics do well to follow the Holy See in this.

The person adrift quoted doesn’t know me, but I am one of those “people” who has had so much new understanding of scripture from the “Poem”. Valtorta doesn’t explain any of it. I simply see the gospels in their settings, I see the expressions on the faces, I see the towns, the clothing, the time of day and year, the smells, the emotions. I observe the delightfully distinct personalities of the Apostles, and I am wowed when I see how Jesus uniquely addresses them, in His love and knowledge of them as individuals. And I feel like I’m there, with them. And I understand.

Eminent theologians of the Church study the Poem of the man-God - in fac they read it over and over again, in delight, as well! And they say it perfectly adherent to theology of Holy Mother Church.

So, its a safe place to get new understanding of scripture!

The esteemed writer of this quote apparently doesn’t know that. But its the truth. As I have stated before, I do not see any evidence that the writer of this quote has ever read the books he is criticizing. But, God Bless him - he is trying to be a good shepherd and probably feels its best to err on the side of caution.

 

[Eliza10]

During Lent, in post #59, Bear06 wrote:

Eliza10:

They are a gift of the God. He is my Shephard, and I know His voice.
Except that the Magisterium has said otherwise regarding the former. And as for the latter, many people have thought the same thing only to be wrong.

What Bearo6 should have said is this: “It is my informed and sincere opinion that the Magisterium has said otherwise…”

And my sincere and informed opinion is opposite yours, Bear06.

Because if the magisterum had in fact ruled as you say, then I would be disobeying Holy Mother Church and so would all the many eminent Priests and Bishops who also read and embrace Poem of the ManGod.

If you don’t want to believe its of God, then you are free to believe that. No harm done. But don’t you think that you risk harming others by battling as an authority on this when you are not? What if you are wrong?

 

[Eliza10]

In post no. 67, adrift responds to adriancombe’s post no. 62:

…
I went to your website and found it unconvincing. However, it did add to my disbelief. .

Wow! Really, adrift?? What in the world did you find unconvicing about this website?? I can’t imagine! Is there one little piece of illogic you could share here, to help us have an inkling about what in it you adrain’s website that was “unconvincing”???

I went to that website and I was amazed! I was so glad to find a cogent and informative response to good Fr. Pacwa’s misinformed oft-quoted words on Poem of the Man-God.

Thanks so much for this great, great link, adriancombe!

…Every time I read something from this it is so obviously not to be believed. Jesus was not blond.

Wow, adrift, you are really stuck on this blond thing. How do you know He wasn’t blond? Shropud experts say he was blond or white haired. So, what if it turns out He was blond? Do you not like blonds? Would you be disappointed??

…Jehovah is an anachronism…

Maria Valtorta heard everything in Italian, and wrote it down as she heard it. The publishing later assigned English translaters. They used the word Jehovah.

Does that make sense now?

…Mary was poor as evident of her sacrifice of doves. She would not have had a donkey. .

I have read all of the volumes and it never says she had a donkey. She road one on one or two occasions. But I do not beleive it was hers. Why do you think she had a donkey?

…One years old? More proof of how bad a fiction this is.

There are one year old prodigies in every era who can talk quite well. Why would not one Full of Grace be able to talk early? This would be a grace withheld from her? So yes, its surprising, but not inconcievable that she could talk at one.

Also, Mary Agreda in City of God, (which is not on the Forbidden Index) says that Our Lady was born with the ability to speak and reason like and adult and could have bugun speaking at once. That she did not was only out of humility only. Thats what Mary Agreda says! Wow, try to wrap your mind around that one.

 

[BVXI]

Who care’s what Color His Hair is?
In Heaven those things-- the petty stuff doesn’t matter.
It only matters to nit picky people, who nit pick at everything
and find life a pick- a- nit- a- miniute.

Faith says Jesus can have any color hair He so desires, He’s God! He made You and You and You and Me.

In fact in Revelations or Apocalypse lets read what it says:
St.Johns Apocalypse says His hairs were white as wool. I guess
Brunette, Brown hair is out of the question!?

1:14 And his head and his hairs were white, as white wool, and as snow, and his eyes were as a flame of fire, 15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as in a burning furnace. And his voice as the sound of many waters

Peace and good will

 

[Insight]

Maria Valtorta is the only visionary who describes Jesus as having blonde hair and blue eyes. The Three uncovered eyewitness descriptions in synergy with the latest Shroud analysis verify the authenticity of Maria Valtorta’s description. Aside from that, I agree with you, I don’t think there is any other value.

 

[BVXI]

2 Corinthians 12
1 If I must glory (it is not expedient indeed), but I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord. 2 I know a man in Christ above fourteen years ago (whether in the body, I know not, or out of the body, I know not; God knoweth), such a one caught up to the third heaven. 3 And I know such a man (whether in the body, or out of the body, I know not: God knoweth), 4 That he was caught up into paradise, and heard secret words, which it is not granted to man to utter.

These kinds of things were happening all the time it seems to the faithful. Visions and Revelations.

Acts of the Apostles tons of Supernatural.

Today TV, Movies, Shopping Malls, Movie theatres, night clubs, Internet. All things spell Idolatry items that cause the mind to say huh? to God and glory.

Peace

 

[adrift]

Discernment is very important. You must learn to tell what is true and what is not. I note an objection

Ronald L. Conte. Jr. claims to be a Theologian. A Theologian is in most cases is a Priest, and is educated in Sacred Theology, (Doctor of Sacred Theology - STD). The bio on his site falls far short of the rudimentary qualifications.

None of the web sites provided in defense meets this qualification either. Very few of them even have any Id to them and when there is there is no statement of qualifications. So unlike Conte’s site you can’t check them out. You don’t know who is behind them. This makes those sites very unreliable. As you can note in the proof below.

There is a three-step process of telling the truth.

1. Is the person in a position to know? Not you or me qualify on this point. The three priests do. EWTN Catholic Answers and Fr. Pacawa does. We fail but they all pass on this one.
2. Would they tell you the truth? You and I pass on this one but Fr. Berti does not. He made a promise not to print the book and no matter how you say he was obeying a higher superior the fact is he lied when he signed it. It seems unreasonable to me that the Pope would disregard protocol. The Imprimatur isn’t first. The nihil obstat is. I doubt if the Pope would ignore it. We have another way to know that there was neither an Imprimatur or nihil obat and it comes from a supporter of the book Bishop Roman Danylak

The Poem of the Man-God was placed on the index of forbidden books, not because of doctrinal errors, but because it was printed without the required nihil obstat and imprimatur.

People who desire things will see it no matter what the truth is.

“Publish this work as it is. There is no need to give an opinion on its origin,
if it be extraordinary or not. Whoever reads it will understand.”
— Pope Pius XII
Is this really an endorsement or something else Who ever reads it will understand? Perhaps the Pope could not fathom anyone taking it seriously. Perhaps he thought that Catholic would see the rantings of a sick person. Nor does he give an opinion if it is supernatural and the statement is ambiguous at best.

1. The third is can you check it out. You really can’t as is obvious between our exchange. So the truth of this fails. I have checked out the supposed letters there is nothing to support that they are real. I could not find anything for the Archko Volume before 1880’s. The only thing I found is that it was written by Rev. W. D. Mahan, a Boonville, Missouri minister, published in 1887.
   The Church has said this Poem is fiction and as long as you read it as fiction you will be following the Church’s guidelines.
   There is also to be considered if there is any demonic activity going on as well. So much disobedience is connected with this. Jesus called us to the highest commandment of love and yet promoters say horrible things about those who condemned this work. The fruits have not been good.
   I wonder if there isn’t some using “sock puppet” identities?

 

[adrift]

There are one year old prodigies in every era who can talk quite well. Why would not one Full of Grace be able to talk early? This would be a grace withheld from her? So yes, its surprising, but not inconcievable that she could talk at one.

Also, Mary Agreda in City of God, (which is not on the Forbidden Index) says that Our Lady was born with the ability to speak and reason like and adult and could have bugun speaking at once. That she did not was only out of humility only. Thats what Mary Agreda says! Wow, try to wrap your mind around that one.

There are? Show me.

12
Months Uses one or more words with meaning (this may be a fragment of a word)
Understands simple instructions, especially if vocal or physical cues are given
Practices inflection
Is aware of the social value of speech

I have seen children who could say words at seven months but not have a theological discussion with an adult. Actually I thought you would come back and say you had made a mistake on her age. At one year old, not even a prodigy, would be able to do that. It is unbelievable.

How do you know He wasn’t blond?

By the same way that a claim that Chinese are white with blue eyes would be discredited.

 

[Insight]

Two sites are run by Monks in two separate Monasteries, both have permission from their Valtorta friendly Superiors, but were asked to refrain from implicating their Monasteries, because of the hullabaloo. I have had email communications with both.

A site is run by Bishop Roman, one was started by the late and famous Father Vernard Poslusney (he was part of Bishop Fulton Sheen’s clan & had a very large following), it is being continued by flock. SaveOurChurch is by Dave Webster. And of coarse, there is David Murray of the Maria Valtorta Reader’s group in Australia (around 14,000 members strong). Steve Jost runs Valtorta.org. Just to name a few.

Pope Pius XII ordered the three Priests: “Publish this work as it is”. Again; “So, then, if anyone says that the Roman Pontiff has merely an office of supervision and guidance, and not the full and supreme power of jurisdiction over the whole Church, and this not only in matters of faith and morals, but also in those which concern the discipline and government of the Church dispersed throughout the whole world; or that he has only the principal part, but not the absolute fullness, of this supreme power; or that this power of his is not ordinary and immediate both over all and each of the Churches and over all and each of the pastors and faithful: let him be anathema.” - Catechism of the Catholic Church, 883 - "The college or body of bishops has no authority unless united with the Roman Pontiff, Peter’s successor, as its head.”

The Official Vatican recorder Cardinal Edouard Gagnon, inscribed that Pope Pius XII’s action as: “The kind of official Imprimatur granted before witnesses by the Holy Father in 1948. An “Official Imprimatur” of the Supreme Authority of the Church”.

Father Berti was directly ordered to sign. But clearly, as detailed above, the Holy Pontiff is the supreme authority. He had no choice but to obey the Pope.

Eliza made a slight mistake, in the Poem, Mary was three years old in the Poem when she made that statement.

No one was saying horrible things, just calling a spade a spade. I’m presuming that your are referring to Cardinal Alfredo Ottaviani, the one who was responsible for placing the Poem and Saint Faustina’s writings on the index. If there is any demonic activity, it is his secret directive to silence poor child victims, which many cite as being the heart of the scandal that nearly shattered the whole Catholic Church.

advancedchristianity.com/Pages/CBS/CBS.htm

One of the blue links at the top of that page shows the actual secret document. The article on the page explains where the key sentences are in that document.

Mark 9:42 – “And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.”

 

[BVXI]

Adrift,

you haven’t traveled much? Experienced other cultures at length?

There are black men who marry asian women who have carmel colored skinned children with no afro! go figure,

there are black men who marry asian women and their children have red hair.

There are white men who marry NA’s who’s children are blonde.
Endless.

If God Who became Incarnate became incarnate, He most certainly can Do Anything. And He has countless times. How many times we may not have been around to see?

You still have not put forth argument concerning Jesus’s hair with what’s written below:

Apocalypse 1:14 And his head and his hairs were white, as white wool, and as snow, and his eyes were as a flame of fire, 15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as in a burning furnace. And his voice as the sound of many waters.

If you claim Jesus had brown hair, how come His hair is seen as white as wool snow white by His very own Disciple whom He loved? Obviously, John saw Jesus almost everyday for 3 years.
So He did recognize Him and was able to Desribe Him.

@ No Pope since Paul VI has trumped Pope Pius XII decsicion.
None, Zero, Boro, Nill.

The Popes say it all:

[1948] Pope Pius XII: Granted permission to publish
[1959] Pope John XXIII: Signed the decree placing the Poem on the Index
[1966] Pope Paul VI: Abolishes the Index, thus nullifying John XXIII’s action
[1966] Pope Paul VI: Abrogated the Canon (1385) that was the legal principle for the inclusion on the Index
[1974] Pope Paul VI: Expresses his appreciation of a commentary to Maria Valtorta’s writings
[1992] Pope John Paul II: Beatifies an outspoken supporter of Maria Valtorta
-------] Pope Benedict XVI: pending

Religious books do not require Nihil Obstat or an imprimatur to read. IS what the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith have
said repeatedly since the Index was abolished. Unless of course
there is Heresies and doctrinal errors then they will make it known.

To have these states a great deal of confidence towards the reader.

latest breaking news which is not set in stone but will happen.
BVM.

March 23, 2008
POPE ANNOUNCES A REFORM; Congregation of the Index Abolished as Separate Congregation.

Link:query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9D06E6DB143AE433A25750C2A9659C946696D6CF

Link to PDF: query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?_r=1&res=9D06E6DB143AE433A25750C2A9659C946696D6CF&oref=slogin

Anyway Maria Valtorta will be approved by the Highest Power and the detractors will still be detractors not willingly but because of false information or misleading information depends on your mind set. Detractors were in a round about way mislead.

That’s the way the cookie crumbles: When you stand by God, God is higher than Man. This is stated over and over in the Holy Scriptures. It’s more or less personified, throughout the whole Bible.

Isaiah 55:8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts: nor your ways my ways, saith the Lord. 9 For as the heavens are exalted above the earth, so are my ways exalted above your ways, and my thoughts above your thoughts.

This is one of my favorite passages from St. Paul in the 1st letter to the Cornithians.

6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among the perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, neither of the princes of this world that come to nought. 7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, a wisdom which is hidden, which God ordained before the world, unto our glory: 8 Which none of the princes of this world knew. For if they had known it, they would never have crucified the Lord of glory. 9 But, as it is written: That eye hath not seen, nor ear heard: neither hath it entered into the heart of man, what things God hath prepared for them that love him. 10 But to us God hath revealed them by his Spirit. For the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, but the spirit of a man that is in him? So the things also that are of God, no man knoweth, but the Spirit of God. 12 Now, we have received not the spirit of this world, but the Spirit that is of God: that we may know the things that are given us from God. 13 Which things also we speak: not in the learned words of human wisdom, but in the doctrine of the Spirit, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the sensual man perceiveth not these things that are of the Spirit of God. For it is foolishness to him: and he cannot understand, because it is spiritually examined. 15 But the spiritual man judgeth all things: and he himself is judged of no man. 16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

Peace and good will always in the Name Of Jesus Christ, Redeemer, King, Judge of the whole world.

 

[adrift]

TNo one was saying horrible things, just calling a spade a spade. I’m presuming that your are referring to Cardinal Alfredo Ottaviani, the one who was responsible for placing the Poem and Saint Faustina’s writings on the index. If there is any demonic activity, it is his secret directive to silence poor child victims, which many cite as being the heart of the scandal that nearly shattered the whole Catholic Church.
"

Nothing like proving my point

From the catechism

2477
Respect for the reputation of persons forbids every attitude and word likely to cause them unjust injury.278 He becomes guilty:

    * of rash judgment who, even tacitly, assumes as true, without sufficient foundation, the moral fault of a neighbor;

    * of detraction who, without objectively valid reason, discloses another's faults and failings to persons who did not know them;279

    * of calumny who, by remarks contrary to the truth, harms the reputation of others and gives occasion for false judgments concerning them.

There is no valid reason that you revealed this. Further more the web page you cited is not exactly one that love the Church. I remember that there was another side to this story. It is very wrong and what he may have done or not done really has no bearing why do you have to drag someone through the mud and no I didn’t know about this until it was posted in a thread. Calling a spade a spade is rather a judgment call and you could be very wrong.

No one knows for certain what the Pope actually said.

Cardinal Edouard Gagnon

was teaching from 1945 to 1954 1954.
No mention in his biography of being The Official Vatican recorder.

So, then, if anyone says that the Roman Pontiff has merely an office of supervision and guidance, and not the full and supreme power of jurisdiction over the whole Church, and this not only in matters of faith and morals, but also in those which concern the discipline and government of the Church dispersed throughout the whole world; or that he has only the principal part, but not the absolute fullness, of this supreme power; or that this power of his is not ordinary and immediate both over all and each of the Churches and over all and each of the pastors and faithful: let him be anathema." - Catechism of the Catholic Church, 883 - "The college or body of bishops has no authority unless united with the Roman Pontiff, Peter’s successor, as its head.”

I know that you really think this means something but it doesn’t for two reasons.

1. The Pope did not give an imprimatur for the reasons I listed and confirmed by Bishop Roman Danylak
2. The actions of one pope does not preclude another pope making contrary rulings. In other words, Pope Pius had given an imprimatur it would not prevent Pope John XXIII from condemning it. It does not fall under infallibility.

 

[BVXI]

Nullified means, cancelled as in doesn’t go forth from that time.

Which is what Pope Paul VI accomplished.

He Nullified Pope John XXIII’s Indexing, which Pope John all he did was hear what Cardinal Ottiviani suggested. This same Cardinal put St. Faustina’s Divine Mercy “Prayers” on Index.

Her work was released as well the same day. There’s Divine Mercy Pictures allover the world.

Ever heard the word Monumental?

That’s what Maria’s dictations are Monumental. The Popes are overwhelmed!! They do not know what to do! That is why it’s taking so long. They put her works out to see if how well they would be received! You look at the little dots, making sure the t’ have their crossses in them but you fail to see the Higher implications, what’s going on behind the scenes of the “dots” the “t’s” . Lawyers scrutinze. Believers Ask God. Faith.

Learn to see with spiritual eyes not your human eyes.

Peace

 

[adrift]

Adrift,

you haven’t traveled much? Experienced other cultures at length?
Here is your problem we are not talking about today. We are talking about 2000 years ago. We are talking about a culture that was specifically chosen by God. If you read the bible you will see that they did not marry outsiders so what is done today has little to do with then.

You still have not put forth argument concerning Jesus’s hair with what’s written below:

Apocalypse 1:14 And his head and his hairs were white, as white wool, and as snow, and his eyes were as a flame of fire, 15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as in a burning furnace. And his voice as the sound of many waters.

If you claim Jesus had brown hair, how come His hair is seen as white as wool snow white by His very own Disciple whom He loved? Obviously, John saw Jesus almost everyday for 3 years.
So He did recognize Him and was able to Desribe Him.
Revelation is written in symbols and cannot be taken literally.

The Popes say it all:

[1948] Pope Pius XII: Granted permission to publish
No proof exist and Bishop Roman Danylak confirms it had no imprimatur
[1959] Pope John XXIII: Signed the decree placing the Poem on the IndexIt was condemned before this and in the lifetime of Pius XII
[1966] Pope Paul VI: Abolishes the Index, thus nullifying John XXIII’s action nope nothing was nullified
[1966] Pope Paul VI: Abrogated the Canon (1385) that was the legal principle for the inclusion on the Index
[1974] Pope Paul VI: Expresses his appreciation of a commentary to Maria Valtorta’s writingsunsubstanitated
[1992] Pope John Paul II: Beatifies an outspoken supporter of Maria Valtorta vague claim
-------] Pope Benedict XVI: pending

Religious books do not require Nihil Obstat or an imprimatur to read. IS what the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith have
said repeatedly since the Index was abolished. Unless of course
there is Heresies and doctrinal errors then they will make it known. Has nothing to do with the index. They still must have both to be used as teaching material. Nothing you have stated but the Church has that this is fiction.

March 23, 2008
POPE ANNOUNCES A REFORM; Congregation of the Index Abolished as Separate Congregation.
March 23, 2008Your date is wrong this was an article from March 23, 1917
And the Pope they are referring to is Pope Benedict XV

.

 

[adrift]

Nullified means, cancelled as in doesn’t go forth from that time.

Which is what Pope Paul VI accomplished.

He Nullified Pope John XXIII’s Indexing, which Pope John all he did was hear what Cardinal Ottiviani suggested. This same Cardinal put St. Faustina’s Divine Mercy “Prayers” on Index.

Her work was released as well the same day. There’s Divine Mercy Pictures allover the world.

In 1966 when the Index was abolished many thought this meant the works listed on it could be read. Cardinal Ratzinger addressed this issue with respect to the “Poem of the Man-God,” in the aforementioned Letter saying,

"After the dissolution of the Index, when some people thought the printing and distribution of the work was permitted, people were reminded again in 'LOsservatore Romano' (June 15, 1966) that, as was published in the 'Acta Apostolicae Sedis' (1966), the I**ndex retains its moral force despite its dissolution**. A decision against distributing and recommending a work, which has not beeen condemned lightly, may be reversed, but only after profound changes that neutralize the harm which such a publication could bring forth among the ordinary faithful."

1. Regarding the circulation of texts of alleged private revelations, the Congregation states:

1. The Interpretation given by some individuals to a Decision approved by Paul VI on 14 October 1966 and promulgated on 15 November of that year, in virtue of which writings and messages resulting from alleged revelations could be freely circulated in the Church, is absolutely groundless. This decision actually referred to the “abolition of the Index of Forbidden Books” and determined that — after the relevant censures were lifted — the moral obligation still remained of not circulating or reading those writings which endanger faith and morals.
2. In should be recalled however that with regard to the circulation of texts of alleged private revelations, canon 623 #1 of the current Code remains in force: “the Pastors of the Church have the … right to demand that writings to be published by the Christian faithful which touch upon faith or morals be submitted to their judgement”.
3. Alleged supernatural revelations and writings concerning them are submitted in first instance to the judgement of the diocesan Bishop, and , in particular cases, to the judgement of the Episcopal Conference and the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.

 

[Insight]

Well as far as Papal Authority, I’ll stick with Canon Law: Canon Law - Book II, Part II, Section I, Chapter I, Article I - gives the Pope full and supreme power over all levels of the Church and free use to exercise this power. The Papal order came first. Canon law prohibits this Papal order from being reversed by subordinate levels of Church authority. Canon law clearly requires that this Papal order be embraced with unconditional acceptance and submission.

As far as the Cardinal Ottaviani Directive, I’ll stick with God: Mark 9:42 – “And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.”

And if you fail to consider that document demonic, and it didn’t make your blood boil, it means one of three things; you do not have children, you didn’t read it, or you’re part of the problem.

 

[BVXI]

adrift,

Apocalypse 1:14 And his head and his hairs were white, as white wool, and as snow, and his eyes were as a flame of fire, 15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as in a burning furnace. And his voice as the sound of many waters.

*If you claim Jesus had brown hair, how come His hair is seen as white as wool snow white by His very own Disciple whom He loved? Obviously, John saw Jesus almost everyday for 3 years.
So He did recognize Him and was able to Desribe Him.
Revelation is written in symbols and cannot be taken literally.
*

Than Adrift, “The Bible cannot be taken literally” Our faith is in vain. Do you realize what you said?

Apocalypse is in the Bible.

22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from these things that are written in this book.

Becareful what you say adrift.

Because you just took away from the Description of Jesus saying His appearance cannot be taken literally. This description of Jesus is taken literally. Most do not realize this but in Rome they do. That’s where it counts. In Rome the Seat of The Churches Authority. Jesus is not Brown haired.

The date is not incorrect, that’s how it was posted online. You didn’t read the posted date correctly, You read into it what you are looking for anything to condemn.

Lawyers= Pharisees, Scribes, Sadducees in Jesus day. They scrutinized Him and condemned Him

Believers= Seek God and ask Him, Faith.

Read below it says nothing about imprimatur it just lists the Highest Authority Given to These Books!
You read into it precisely what you want to see because quite simply you are a detractor; And you completely missed the point entirely. You do what most detractors do, that is keep a blind eye to what is presented and add to it what you want, to prove your point. And that’s all it is “Your Point” Not the Universal Point which is what Truly Counts.

No matter how “you” slice it, Maria’s works are not condemned but in hearts of detractors. May God grant you true peace.

Catholic means “Universal” of which you show no universal sentiment nor pity. But a mono-versal stand.

This list is the Popes stand. His words are enough. You quite simply do not comprehend nor understand. An imprimatur or nihil obstat is no longer required. Do you comprehend this? No!

[1948] Pope Pius XII: Granted permission to publish
[1959] Pope John XXIII: Signed the decree placing the Poem on the Index
[1966] Pope Paul VI: Abolishes the Index, thus nullifying John XXIII’s action
[1966] Pope Paul VI: Abrogated the Canon (1385) that was the legal principle for the inclusion on the Index
[1974] Pope Paul VI: Expresses his appreciation of a commentary to Maria Valtorta’s writings
[1992] Pope John Paul II: Beatifies an outspoken supporter of Maria Valtorta
-------] Pope Benedict XVI: pending

You are a detractor, You have not followed the things put forth but to detract, “just what you want to see and add.” What is given to you is what has transpired and the proof’s.
You choose to follow what other detractors in their minds and thinking follow, anything against, which, Jesus went through the samething, with His fellow countrymen, whom received the Word
into the land but not into their hearts.

You discern words but do not discern the spirit with spiritual eyes, for if you did, you would see the “pearl” beneath the shell.
For something to be born, it has to endure, objections, negative
assaults, and the like, this is called stand by the test of time in short. Whatever is of God, eventually stands and the more people go against the more it gains popularity.

Do you know the story of how the Bible came into being?
it’s taken some 2000 years to be finalized. Remember the Dead Sea scrolls found last century? They were buried for so long.

Faith, when you follow God in faith, you see God, and He gives to you what you require and need when you cry I need more this is not enough to see you clearer, He gives you more. And He certainly does. but, a detractor is part of the enemies plan and you fell into his trap and snare. Quite simply you’re not free from hate. God is our Protecion, provider and He is Bounty.

You should ask yourself, what has God given concerning spiritual gifts to me?

Has your knowlegde and understanding of Him expanded beyond what you know from Mass sermons, and homilies? Or do you take the time to learn on your own? In the guidance of the Holy Spirit. If you belong to the Church the Holy Spirit is it’s earnest gift. And you will be guided when you know He’s your spiritual guide. Otherwise He the Holy Spirit will guide you unbeknowlingly thinking it’s human intervention. But it was Him all along. He just waits for you to acknowledge your higher calling
the Spirit.

If seek Me you will find Me when you search for Me with all your heart. Jeremaiah 29:13

To know Jesus means to continually advance in the knowledge and understanding of Him. Deeper truths about Christ.
That’s what God wants from all of us who go to Church and believe on His Name. To love God with all our being.

To understand what Love really is, not what human idea of what love is. In this world, there is no true Love, it is in Heaven. And Heaven gave us gifts to specific people to start.

What God leaves us in the Eucharist is His Love, what God leaves us the Church is His love, what God leaves us His Word the Bible is His love, what God gives to us His saints is His love,
what God gives to us each day the sun, and food and clothing is His love. I can go on. But in the world, is no love.

Peace

 

[Insight]

After Pope Paul VI abolished the Index, He went on to endorse a book that endorses Maria Valtorta’s writings, an action which clearly demonstrated that that the Index is truly null and void. Again, the Papal action is of more significance than a private letter by a Cardinal.

Another example would be how Saint Faustina’s writings were placed on the Forbidden Book List by the Holy Office under Cardinal Ottaviani, which now are read at Divine Mercy Sunday Mass. If the Index retained its moral force, this would not be possible.