Poland sees rise in secularism [CWN]

  • Thread starter Thread starter CWN_News
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
C

CWN_News

Guest
Poland is seeing a rise in secularism, The New York Times reports, and the Sunday Mass attendance rate has fallen to 41% nationwide and 20% in Warsaw and Krakow. The Times …

More…
 
I guess the communists found a better way to subvert traditional values.
 
Neil_Anthony said:
I guess the communists found a better way to subvert traditional values.
Click to expand...
But, it’s not the communists who are behind the secularism. It is access to Western culture and values that are subverting it. Pornography, drugs, cohabitation, etc. pretty much arrived with the overthrow of communism.

The communists kept a tight lid on that, and the Church, as a bulwark against communism, saw to it that the people put their trust in the Church and not the Party.

When the gates were opened, however, it was Katy bar the door, regarding the inflow of things injurious to traditional values.
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
But, it’s not the communists who are behind the secularism. It is access to Western culture and values that are subverting it. Pornography, drugs, cohabitation, etc. pretty much arrived with the overthrow of communism.

The communists kept a tight lid on that, and the Church, as a bulwark against communism, saw to it that the people put their trust in the Church and not the Party.

When the gates were opened, however, it was Katy bar the door, regarding the inflow of things injurious to traditional values.
Click to expand...
it’s the communists behind all that too, only they do it more sneakily!
 
Send hundreds of thousands of Poles to the UK, they go back and look what happens! 😉
 
Not only that, but they’ve been stealing my CD cases for years and hiding them under the sofa. You watch, one of these days I’ll catch Gorbachev right in the act.
 
You’re forgetting the neo-Marxist ‘Republicans In Name Only’. 🙂
 
They just had terribly freezing weather in Poland a few weeks ago. If there was anything that had Partii Komunistycznej written all over it, it was all that snow and ice and low temperatures. Sly godless devils!
 
All Joking Aside--------

Blessed John Paul II (may His Prayers from Heaven Help Us and Sanctify us!) must be Crying Heavenly Tears over this. 😦
 
Fascism and nazism have almost nothing in common (other than nationalism).

Other than that, I do feel sorry for the Poles. An honorable people.

Pax,

Sebastiano
 
😃

I should explain myself a bit more:

I think the atheist secularists that were behind communism in eastern europe, and the failed attempts to install communism in various countries of western europe, are the same people who are behind the slower drift towards secularism that we have in the west. It’s the same ideology, just being advanced more slowly in some countries and more quickly in other countries.

My point is that even though communism fell, atheist secularism hasn’t gone away and is still a danger.
 
Neil_Anthony said:
😃

I should explain myself a bit more:

I think the atheist secularists that were behind communism in eastern europe, and the failed attempts to install communism in various countries of western europe, are the same people who are behind the slower drift towards secularism that we have in the west. It’s the same ideology, just being advanced more slowly in some countries and more quickly in other countries.

My point is that even though communism fell, atheist secularism hasn’t gone away and is still a danger.
Click to expand...
Secularism and communism are not one and the same. Most secularists are merely liberals (and some are even Ayn Rand-esque conservative anticommunists). You might notice that secularist liberals, far from sympathizing with communisats, try to distance themselves from communists as much as possible, even going so far as to use the cop out that communism is a religion. So to equate communism with typical secularism/atheism is a mistake. They are very different, mutually exclusive ideologies, even if they share a common antipathy toward religion. Communism and west European style liberal secularism attack religion from very different angles, and for rather different reasons.

For a peculiar example of a communist who isn’t a secularist, look up Terry Eagleton. Though he is a communist, even a conservative Christian might appreciate an essay he wrote in which he lambastes Richard Dawkins and his ilk.
 
It is amazing how quickly a tragic news report about Poland’s besieged Faith spun into a litany of anti-American bigotry, at the forefront of which are - not surprising - disaffested Americans (let’s call these the Green Day (of the MTV variety) posters) - and gauging from the orthodoxy of those posters (based on their long track record of antagonistic posting) - this is not surprising of the Green Day American Catholics (loyalties approximately in that order). Not surprisingly, a non-Catholic European had no qualms joining in and encouraging this elitist party.

As for the real causes of secularization, such as militant [censored-because-it’s-illegal-to-claim-it’s-real]-izing *, the sources of this are one and the same as the sources of communism, so it’s not surprising people would confuse intellectual relatives. The lack of charity coming from (at least the Catholic) posters towards other Catholics is, however, most surprising - but again, only if I didn’t already recognize a few posters for their typical antagonistic, elitist posting ; that is, the Green Day posters. No need to tell us guys ! We already know you “don’t want to be another American idiot.”
  • Includes but not limited to : Homosexualism, Pornography, Moral Relativism, lovingly inspired by an implacable anti-Christian animus, etc.
‘No-Pax-for-you!’ Today,
Tim
 
Raskolnikov said:
Secularism and communism are not one and the same. Most secularists are merely liberals (and some are even Ayn Rand-esque conservative anticommunists). You might notice that secularist liberals, far from sympathizing with communisats, try to distance themselves from communists as much as possible, even going so far as to use the cop out that communism is a religion. So to equate communism with typical secularism/atheism is a mistake. They are very different, mutually exclusive ideologies, even if they share a common antipathy toward religion. Communism and west European style liberal secularism attack religion from very different angles, and for rather different reasons.

For a peculiar example of a communist who isn’t a secularist, look up Terry Eagleton. Though he is a communist, even a conservative Christian might appreciate an essay he wrote in which he lambastes Richard Dawkins and his ilk.
Click to expand...
Yes, both communism and “west European style liberal secularism” (notice how you are unable to produce a single name for it, which is simply liberalism, period) share a common hatred : religion, and Christiantiy in particular. You also forget that liberalism, like communism, is an intellectual and ideological construction, and can be dated to the early 18th century in its most militant and potent forms. “Convervativism,” (which, like “liberalism,” is a modern phenomenon) is a logical and natural reactionary movement against liberalism (which, before the succesful republican revolutions, was simply known as “radicalism” - but victors write the histories, of course, and today we call it “liberalism” issuing from “the enlightenment,” which thing didn’t happen in the 18th century, but in the 1st). Hence progressivists and liberals like to dismiss their opponents (traditionalists and conservatives, respectively) as being “reactionary,” as opposed to the much more ideal “action.” So in my country the NDP (a neo-Marxist party) constantly - even to the point of nausea - always demands the government “take action,” “take action,” and… “take action.”

Interestingly, a famous Satanist (Aleister Crowley (sp?) his choice of appelage) once decreed that what he wants from his followers “is action… mindless action.” Now St Augustine taught that contemplation must always precede action, and hence mindless action is pure folly, even a mockery of our God-given reason. Mindless action will ultimately unnaturally submit someone to the worst and most deplorable kind of slavery, wherein they feel helplessly compelled to act upon any and every impulse that floats into their feeble mind (feeble from lack of use).

Now you finished by saying that they (communism and secularism) “attack religion from different angles,” but failed to realize that they attack with virturally the same tactics and almost identical points (most of the time), usually attempting to discredit Christianity on an intellectual grounding or as being somehow antiquated. Please venture the thought that perhaps what really inspires anything is an animus, not an intellect, which is always subservient to one’s animus. Intellect is a tool at man’s disposal : what drives and determines its use is another matter altogether.

Pax,
Tim
 
Raskolnikov said:
Secularism and communism are not one and the same. Most secularists are merely liberals (and some are even Ayn Rand-esque conservative anticommunists). You might notice that secularist liberals, far from sympathizing with communisats, try to distance themselves from communists as much as possible, even going so far as to use the cop out that communism is a religion. So to equate communism with typical secularism/atheism is a mistake. They are very different, mutually exclusive ideologies, even if they share a common antipathy toward religion. Communism and west European style liberal secularism attack religion from very different angles, and for rather different reasons.

For a peculiar example of a communist who isn’t a secularist, look up Terry Eagleton. Though he is a communist, even a conservative Christian might appreciate an essay he wrote in which he lambastes Richard Dawkins and his ilk.
Click to expand...
I agree with you that my analysis is rather black-and-white, lumping all secularists and liberals in a big group with communists. I guess I see society as being increasingly polarized between people who want God to be the center of society, and people who want to re-invent everything according to modern man’s view of how things should be. Even if the liberals don’t take extreme positions, I believe they are on a road towards an extreme destination, and that its just a matter of time before they get there. Most of them probably aren’t even aware of where their philosophy leads.
 
Neil_Anthony said:
I agree with you that my analysis is rather black-and-white, lumping all secularists and liberals in a big group with communists. I guess I see society as being increasingly polarized between people who want God to be the center of society, and people who want to re-invent everything according to modern man’s view of how things should be. Even if the liberals don’t take extreme positions, I believe they are on a road towards an extreme destination, and that its just a matter of time before they get there. Most of them probably aren’t even aware of where their philosophy leads.
Click to expand...
Exactly back to the place where it was inculcated and originally promulgated : the Masonic lodge, unless you think it’s a coincidence that the leaders of radical revolutionaries were overwhelmingly Masons, which given their proportion to the remainder of society is anything but a reflection of the democratic ideals they espoused. Now I do not mean to say that those men did not sincerely hold to and believe in those ideals - they are not fraudsters - without question they overwhelmingly did and still do. What they failed and do continue to fail to consider, however (in my opinion), is the potent reality of evil and its influence, and they thus underestimate the common enemy of mankind by permitting evil all sorts of new avenues for entrance and control in or over society, while weakening the potency of government to combat and expell it. The traditions and beliefs of the people remained as a kind of bulwark against this ; however, those things alone and long sieged tend to be chizzeled away by time and effort, and without bona fide miracles (which we should pray for) or public, legal props for support, those traditions are culpable to be lost, and consequently expose society to the worst evils, misery and corruption.

Masonry’s rank and file may, therefore, may be a peculiar target for evangelism and conversion, and potentially a very fruitful one. First and foremost in any such endeavour would be the need to stress the reality of objective good and evil, and given the Mason’s inculcated propensity for philosophy and high regard for reasoning, the Catholic Church should be able to save souls there ; and through those souls, so many the more. The Mason’s instructed high regard for tradition and ritual purity (I mean keeping rituals pure via memorization and passing it on to the next generation) certainly would be happiest and most fruitful if they accepted the true rituals to hold fast to and keep, ones not of man-made engineering but disposed upon us by Divine Providence. In such a situation their tenacity and genius might bear fruit for the Kingdom of God rather than the synagogue of Satan (as one Pope named it).

Pax,
Tim
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top