Pope Blames Refugee Crisis on 'God of Money,' 'Socio-Economic System That Is Bad, Unjust'

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Tomdstone said:
It is true, but I don’t see how to repair the American socio-economic system that worships “the god of money.”
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Communism is the solution, apparently. Not only to repair America but also to prevent Islamic State from sending Syrians to Europe.
 
sarah_j said:
I wonder where Pope Francis stands on liberation theology?

ncronline.org/news/jesuit-liberation-theology-will-endure-and-grow
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Tolerant if not outright sympathetic would be my guess judging from his rehabilitation of adherents.

One thing I noticed from that article: Pope John Paul is supposed to have opposed Marxism merely because he had the misfortune to live under it. Whereas, apparently, those who have not had the misfortune, such as Latin American liberation theologians, can better appreciate its virtues.
 
If the translation is accurate (and that is a BIG if), I just don’t know what to say. The refugees coming to Europe aren’t escaping global warming, crony capitalism nor the god of money, they are escaping Islamists.

I have no idea why the Pope would even say such a thing. It makes NO sense.
 
zz912 said:
If the translation is accurate (and that is a BIG if), I just don’t know what to say. The refugees coming to Europe aren’t escaping global warming, crony capitalism nor the god of money, they are escaping Islamists.

I have no idea why the Pope would even say such a thing. It makes NO sense.
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Ask Tomdstone - he apparently thinks the refugees crisis is a fiscal one as well.

He probably got that from Republican Presidential Candidate Rand Paul though, so take that with a grain of salt.
 
Maximilan_Kolbe said:
Ask Tomdstone - he apparently thinks the refugees crisis is a fiscal one as well.

He probably got that from Republican Presidential Candidate Rand Paul though, so take that with a grain of salt.
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I heard Donald Trump say similar things. And when the Sunni extremists founded IS, they said that their purpose was to get rid of the “crusaders” who had invaded their country.
 
Bubba_Switzler said:
Tolerant if not outright sympathetic would be my guess judging from his rehabilitation of adherents.

One thing I noticed from that article: Pope John Paul is supposed to have opposed Marxism merely because he had the misfortune to live under it. Whereas, apparently, those who have not had the misfortune, such as Latin American liberation theologians, can better appreciate its virtues.
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It would perhaps be helpful to know that as the Jesuit provincial in Argentina during the 1970’s, the future Pope Francis took a firm stand again the Maxism in liberation theology, was then appointed the Archbishop of Buenos Aires, the largest diocese in Argentina, by Saint Pope John Paul II at a time when John Paul II was intent on suppressing the Marxism in liberation theology in Latin America. He then appointed the future Pope Francis a Cardinal.
 
Thomas_White said:
It would perhaps be helpful to know that as the Jesuit provincial in Argentina during the 1970’s, the future Pope Francis took a firm stand again the Maxism in liberation theology, was then appointed the Archbishop of Buenos Aires, the largest diocese in Argentina, by Saint Pope John Paul II at a time when John Paul II was intent on suppressing the Marxism in liberation theology in Latin America. He then appointed the future Pope Francis a Cardinal.
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Obviously correct. Some people like to jump to conclusions instead of doing their homework.
 
Thomas_White said:
It would perhaps be helpful to know that as the Jesuit provincial in Argentina during the 1970’s, the future Pope Francis took a firm stand again the Maxism in liberation theology, was then appointed the Archbishop of Buenos Aires, the largest diocese in Argentina, by Saint Pope John Paul II at a time when John Paul II was intent on suppressing the Marxism in liberation theology in Latin America. He then appointed the future Pope Francis a Cardinal.
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When you see Pope Francis through the prism of liberation theology, all of his statements fall into line.
And, since becoming pope, his actions certainly seem
to indicate that he is enamored of that school of thought:

*"Among the first things that Argentine Cardinal Jorge Mario Bergoglio did upon becoming Pope Francis in March 2013, was to invite the Peruvian priest and theologian Gustavo Gutiérrez, considered the father of liberation theology, to Rome.

Then, in another much-discussed gesture last spring, Francis cleared the way for the beatification of Oscar Romero, the martyred Salvadoran archbishop who was gunned down at the altar by a right-wing death-squad sharpshooter in 1980.

Such moves are taken as a clear sign that Francis wants to complete a reconciliation between the Vatican and the theological and social movement that emboldened resistance to right-wing Latin American regimes in the 1970s and ’80s and became a target of Cold War anticommunism under John Paul II and then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger .

That reconciliation has been under way for several years. Ratzinger’s successor as prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Cardinal Gerhard Ludwig Müller, worked in Peru and cowrote a book with Gutiérrez, On the Side of the Poor: The Theology of Liberation, in which he calls liberation theology “one of the most significant currents of Catholic theology in the twentieth century.”

Intriguingly, in an act much less publicized than the invitation to Gutiérrez, Francis also reached out early on in his papacy to a far more controversial figure: the Brazilian theologian and former Franciscan friar Leonardo Boff, another of the founders of liberation theology, who in 1985 was silenced by Ratzinger for his criticism of the church and subsequently left the priesthood.

Boff is also known for his work on ecotheology; according to Vallely, this was among the reasons that Francis reached out to him privately and asked Boff to send his writings, saying he wanted to publish an encyclical on environmental issues. "*

thenation.com/article/how-pope-francis-came-to-embrace-not-just-climate-justice-but-liberation-theology/
 
sarah_j said:
When you see Pope Francis through the prism of liberation theology, all of his statements fall into line.
And, since becoming pope, his actions certainly seem
to indicate that he is enamored of that school of thought:

*"Among the first things that Argentine Cardinal Jorge Mario Bergoglio did upon becoming Pope Francis in March 2013, was to invite the Peruvian priest and theologian Gustavo Gutiérrez, considered the father of liberation theology, to Rome.

Then, in another much-discussed gesture last spring, Francis cleared the way for the beatification of Oscar Romero, the martyred Salvadoran archbishop who was gunned down at the altar by a right-wing death-squad sharpshooter in 1980.

Such moves are taken as a clear sign that Francis wants to complete a reconciliation between the Vatican and the theological and social movement that emboldened resistance to right-wing Latin American regimes in the 1970s and ’80s and became a target of Cold War anticommunism under John Paul II and then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger .

That reconciliation has been under way for several years. Ratzinger’s successor as prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Cardinal Gerhard Ludwig Müller, worked in Peru and cowrote a book with Gutiérrez, On the Side of the Poor: The Theology of Liberation, in which he calls liberation theology “one of the most significant currents of Catholic theology in the twentieth century.”

Intriguingly, in an act much less publicized than the invitation to Gutiérrez, Francis also reached out early on in his papacy to a far more controversial figure: the Brazilian theologian and former Franciscan friar Leonardo Boff, another of the founders of liberation theology, who in 1985 was silenced by Ratzinger for his criticism of the church and subsequently left the priesthood.

Boff is also known for his work on ecotheology; according to Vallely, this was among the reasons that Francis reached out to him privately and asked Boff to send his writings, saying he wanted to publish an encyclical on environmental issues. "*

thenation.com/article/how-pope-francis-came-to-embrace-not-just-climate-justice-but-liberation-theology/
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In 1968, the Conference of Latin American Catholic Bishops formulated what is known as “the preferential option for the poor”. This was and remains an element of Catholic social teaching, but the Bishops believed there should be a focus on this teaching due to the widespread poverty in Latin America. The future Pope Francis, Jorge Bergoglio, was at that time not yet ordained, but he shortly thereafter was ordained and became a Jesuit missionary working with the poor in Buenos Aires. He remained in Buenos Aires as a Jesuit missionary, the Jesuit provincial for Argentina and as the Archbisop of Buenos Aires until the time he became Pope Francis.

The “preferential option for the poor” was adopted by liberation theology. Liberation theology evolved to where Marxism became a component of it. This Marxist component was firmly rejected by both the future Pope Francis and Saint Pope John Paul II. As the Jesuit provincial and as an Archbishop, the future Pope Francis retained the preferential option for the poor that the Latin American Conference of Catholic Bishops had adopted in 1968. This occurred with the support of both Saint Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI.

Suffice it to say, the conclave of Cardinals that elected Pope Francis were surely aware of this history. The teaching–the preferential option for the poor–is central in the message of Laudato Si. It is not Marxist. It is Catholic social teaching.
 
Thomas_White said:
Liberation theology evolved to where Marxism became a component of it.
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This gives the false impression that liberation theology was originally pure and was later corrupted by Marxism. It is more accurate to say that liberation theology was inspired by Marxism and has always incorporated it to one degree or another.
 
Bubba_Switzler said:
This gives the false impression that liberation theology was originally pure and was later corrupted by Marxism. It is more accurate to say that liberation theology was inspired by Marxism and has always incorporated it to one degree or another.
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I would think that what is important is that Father Jorge Bergoglio, the future Pope Francis; Saint Pope John Paul II; and then-Cardianal Joseph Ratziner firmly rejected the Marxist component in liberation theology, and that the future Pope Francis retained the “preferential option for the poor” for Latin America with the full support of those two popes–and with the enthusiastic support of Joseph Ratzinger when he became Pope Benedict XVI. The concept of liberation theology today is not what it was for some in Latin America in the 1970’s. Marxism is no longer a component, and it seems likely Pope Francis wishes to see a healing of old wounds and a reuniting of faith. This is not wrong.

I say what follows in a charitable way. It seems that there are those so-called “conservative” Catholics in the U.S. that are unaware of the direction of the Church. Pope Benedict XVI believed that the Church of Latin America could become the source Church for Catholicism in response to the crisis of the Church in Europe. What is occurring is that Pope Francis is now introducing this source of faith into the universal Church. It is no chance occurrance.
 
Thomas_White said:
I would think that what is important is that Father Jorge Bergoglio, the future Pope Francis; Saint Pope John Paul II; and then-Cardianal Joseph Ratziner firmly rejected the Marxist component in liberation theology, and that the future Pope Francis retained the “preferential option for the poor” for Latin America with the full support of those two popes–and with the enthusiastic support of Joseph Ratzinger when he became Pope Benedict XVI. The concept of liberation theology today is not what it was for some in Latin America in the 1970’s. Marxism is no longer a component, and it seems likely Pope Francis wishes to see a healing of old wounds and a reuniting of faith. This is not wrong.
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I can appreciate why some would like to rehabilitate Liberation Theology. This is the essence of socialism: ever to claim that the previous instance was wrongly implemented. This time we’ll do it without the gulags and the bread lines. Liberation theology cannot rid itself of its Marxist roots.
I say what follows in a charitable way. It seems that there are those so-called “conservative” Catholics in the U.S. that are unaware of the direction of the Church. Pope Benedict XVI believed that the Church of Latin America could become the source Church for Catholicism in response to the crisis of the Church in Europe. What is occurring is that Pope Francis is now introducing this source of faith into the universal Church. It is no chance occurrance.
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Saints preserve us. Latin America is a social and politcal basket case with a long history of poverty and civil war. We do not want a world like Argentina, much less Venezuala or Cuba.
 
Bubba_Switzler said:
I can appreciate why some would like to rehabilitate Liberation Theology. This is the essence of socialism: ever to claim that the previous instance was wrongly implemented. This time we’ll do it without the gulags and the bread lines. Liberation theology cannot rid itself of its Marxist roots.

Saints preserve us. Latin America is a social and politcal basket case with a long history of poverty and civil war. We do not want a world like Argentina, much less Venezuala or Cuba.
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The difficulty is in understanding or interpreting what is spiritual in a political way. The “preferential option for the poor” is a concept derived directly from the teachings of Christ in the Gospels. The concept is Catholic social teaching and has nothing whatever to do with a revival of Marxism in liberation theology (not that atheism was or possibly could be a component of liberation theology or of any theology). I would think the preferential option for the poor is the commonality of interest to Pope Francis, not Marxism, in the sense that liberation theology returns to the Catholic theology from which it sprung.

Again, and in a charitable way, it is why I have said I do not believe Pope Francis can be understood when viewed through the prism of political ideology. The teaching is spiritual; it is not political. The introduction of facts seems a futile effort here, so I will let it go.
 
Thomas_White said:
The difficulty is in understanding or interpreting what is spiritual in a political way. The “preferential option for the poor” is a concept derived directly from the teachings of Christ in the Gospels. The concept is Catholic social teaching and has nothing whatever to do with a revival of Marxism in liberation theology (not that atheism was or possibly could be a component of liberation theology or of any theology). I would think the preferential option for the poor is the commonality of interest to Pope Francis, not Marxism, in the sense that liberation theology returns to the Catholic theology from which it sprung.
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If Pope Francis and the Liberation Theology advocates were merely concerned for the poor, even if they were primarily concerned for the poor, there woud be no dispute or debate. The dispute arises only as a consequence of what they prescribe to do about the problem of poverty.

Capitalism is, quite simply, the best thing that ever happened to the poor in the history of mankind. We need more, not less, of it, not for the sake of the rich and the middle class but for the sake of the poor.
Again, and in a charitable way, it is why I have said I do not believe Pope Francis can be understood when viewed through the prism of political ideology. The teaching is spiritual; it is not political. The introduction of facts seems a futile effort here, so I will let it go.
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I believe that Pope Francis is a human being and, like other human beings, particuarly those of an intellectual bent, he has a socio-political worldview. I don’t believe, as you seem to, that he has successfully sanitized his spiritual proclamations of his socio-political worldview nor do I think it is even possible or meaningful to do so. Does he even claim this himself? On the contrary, he seems to be more than happy to offer his opinions freely.
 
I am hopeful Francis speaks out about GREED in his upcoming visit, this is something MANY need to hear, I just hope his comments are not censored or watered down as to better fit whats popular in the US.
 
Bubba_Switzler said:
If Pope Francis and the Liberation Theology advocates were merely concerned for the poor, even if they were primarily concerned for the poor, there woud be no dispute or debate. The dispute arises only as a consequence of what they prescribe to do about the problem of poverty.

Capitalism is, quite simply, the best thing that ever happened to the poor in the history of mankind. We need more, not less, of it, not for the sake of the rich and the middle class but for the sake of the poor.

I believe that Pope Francis is a human being and, like other human beings, particuarly those of an intellectual bent, he has a socio-political worldview. I don’t believe, as you seem to, that he has successfully sanitized his spiritual proclamations of his socio-political worldview nor do I think it is even possible or meaningful to do so. Does he even claim this himself? On the contrary, he seems to be more than happy to offer his opinions freely.
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Code: 
 Agreed.
Let’s not forget that Pope John Paul II didn’t make any bones about his stand against Communism/
his support of Solidarity in Poland.
No doubt Pope Francis also has a particular worldview.
I don’t know why discussion of his world outlook should be off limits…in fact, it would
probably help in understanding some of his remarks which leave people scratching
their heads and blaming the media or the translators.
 
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