Pope Bluntly Faults Church's Focus on Gays and Abortion

[LittleFlower378]

[QUOTEIf you read through secular media (journalism major here, I was bombarded by it for 4 years), you see a church of strict rules, filled with corruption and scandal, and not much love because of how hard it comes against gay marriage, abortion and other major social issues. How would you feel if a group taught that you were “intrinsically disordered”?]

This I dont believe is true. What we are seeing is socialistic tendencies in America and the Church has done what she is supposed to and stand up for social justice issues that effect the whole of society. Sometimes though as the Pope said we can go too far in that message and need to set our priorities straight.

 

[Jon_S_1]

I just read the America interview, and it certainly was not as sensationalistic as the NYT made it out to be, but it was still troubling. I just wonder how much passivity toward moral issues the Pope wants the Church to take.

It kind of sounded to me like the Pope was not be so much passive but refocused. Sort of the idea that you preach the gospel to people and then when they accept that they have good reason for accepting the moral standards.

Many people today think that the church is just a bunch of rules because they don’t understand the gospel. I we can focus our preaching on the gospel and get people to embrace that then they will more likely submit to the morality associated with living the gospel.

 

[AdvanceAlways]

[QUOTEIf you read through secular media (journalism major here, I was bombarded by it for 4 years), you see a church of strict rules, filled with corruption and scandal, and not much love because of how hard it comes against gay marriage, abortion and other major social issues. How would you feel if a group taught that you were “intrinsically disordered”?]

This I dont believe is true. What we are seeing is socialistic tendencies in America and the Church has done what she is supposed to and stand up for social justice issues that effect the whole of society. Sometimes though as the Pope said we can go too far in that message and need to set our priorities straight.

So, the thousands of babies slaughtered every day is a priority that needs to take a back seat?

 

[stewstew03]

Fresh from the Media Sensationalism Department…

 

[Baloo]

Have not heard a homily about gay marriage, contraception, abortion or sin of any kind since I reverted to the Catholic Church in 2005.

I don’t think it’s just homilies Pope Francis is talking about though. I am good friends with Catholics who are very passionate about these topics to the point where I can see Pope Francis’ point in the interview. I’m involved with my Newman Center at my college, as Catholics we do frequently talk about these topics on almost a daily basis amongst ourselves. Then there are speeches from people, talks of the HHS mandate, organizations like Generation Life, etc. etc. A friend of mine considers Abortion “the greatest evil in the world today.” Are we sending the right message as Catholics by focusing so heavily on these issues? There are so many more topics, like declining Church attendance, and bringing the message of Jesus Christ back to those who have fallen away. I guess that’s what I’m trying to get at. I totally agree with Pope Francis.

Again, these sins are indeed grave matter. But we must look at them as part of a larger goal, bringing everyone into communion with the Lord. They’re not the end-all be-all to the Church. By bringing people in and showing how we as True Catholics live our life, then we can more fully show our points of view and how they work as part of the truth that we have, rather than trying to tell people why they’re wrong for doing things.

 

[The_Bucket]

Jesus said the world will hate his followers. What does it say about Pope Francis that the world loves him?

They don’t love him. They love a caricature of him that they have created for themselves. Just as they did with JP2.

 

[agnes_therese]

Jesus said the world will hate his followers. What does it say about Pope Francis that the world loves him?

You seem to be implying that Pope Francis is, therefore, not a follower of Jesus. I do hope you’ll clear that up.

 

[agnes_therese]

So, the thousands of babies slaughtered every day is a priority that needs to take a back seat?

I can’t find anyplace where the Holy Father has said this. Are you sure you’re not “reading into” his comments, just like the MSM does?

 

[stewstew03]

They don’t love him. They love a caricature of him that they have created for themselves. Just as they did with JP2.

Ex-ACT-ly

 

[AdvanceAlways]

I can’t find anyplace where the Holy Father has said this. Are you sure you’re not “reading into” his comments, just like the MSM does?

He may not have said it, but by refusing to speak on abortion because it may be pastorally insensitive is deeply disturbing.

 

[KimberlyCat]

The Pope was saying that the Catholic Church spends too much time on the subjects of abortion, atheists and homosexuality. When non Catholics hear the word “Catholic” they automatically think of abortion, gay marriage, and child rapists. It’s a fact. Many think that is all the church is about…about being ANTI-abortion, ANTI-gay, ANTI-this, ANTI-that. We will always be pro-life and anti-gay but God is to judge the sinners…not us. The rules have not changed. Confession is a sacrament. Remember?

The Pope was merely pointing out that the church is beautiful and miraculous and has so much to offer. The Eucharist, grace, miracles, our saints, our prayers, etc. Catholicism is a beautiful gift from God and he wants everyone to know about it.

As far as women go he said they need to have a stronger voice in the church. Women have many gifts to offer and our opinions do matter. He did NOT say women should be Catholic priests. TOMORROW morning he is not going to allow women serve in the priesthood. Perhaps sometime within the next 2000 years that would be a possibility however.

Just my humble opinion.

 

[rotlex]

Note the bold (which I added, I hope dixieagle doesn’t mind).

I can’t imagine allowing the media’s choice of headlines to make me feel “disturbed” about the vicar of Christ. He should be making us think. I love this man more and more every day.

 

[AdvanceAlways]

The Pope was saying that the Catholic Church spends too much time on the subjects of abortion, atheists and homosexuality. When non Catholics hear the word “Catholic” they automatically think of abortion, gay marriage, and child rapists. It’s a fact. Many think that is all the church is about…about being ANTI-abortion, ANTI-gay, ANTI-this, ANTI-that. We will always be pro-life and anti-gay but God is to judge the sinners…not us. The rules have not changed. Confession is a sacrament. Remember?

The Pope was merely pointing out that the church is beautiful and miraculous and has so much to offer. The Eucharist, grace, miracles, our saints, our prayers, etc. Catholicism is a beautiful gift from God and he wants everyone to know about it.

As far as women go he said they need to have a stronger voice in the church. Women have many gifts to offer and our opinions do matter. He did NOT say women should be Catholic priests. TOMORROW morning he is not going to allow women serve in the priesthood. Perhaps sometime within the next 2000 years that would be a possibility however.

Just my humble opinion.

Not to change topics here, but no, women as priests will never be possible. I just don’t see what the Holy Father hoped to accomplish here, other than give a big rousing victory for “progressives” in the Church.

 

[Country_Gal]

I agree with the Holy Father. The Church has allowed itself to be perceived as one dimensional. I always loved the Church for it’s rich spiritual tradition and got bored with the droning focus on these repetitive modern themes.

I’m impressed with Pope Francis!

 

[Baloo]

Women cannot act In Persona Christi, and therefore will NEVER become Priests…

It’s possible we will see Married Priests as in some of the Eastern Rites, but not Women priests…

 

[Cider]

Read it people. Read it. I say it again, READ IT. It’s not the Holy Father’s fault that the media is going to twist what he has to say. They’re going to twist it no matter what. So should he be silent?

.

He could try to stop making it so easy for them though.

 

[Jon_S_1]

He may not have said it, but by refusing to speak on abortion because it may be pastorally insensitive is deeply disturbing.

This is copied and pasted from the Pope Francis official Facebook Page. (bolding from me)

To begin the interview, Spadoro bluntly asks, “Who is Jorge Mario Bergolio?” - Francis’s name before he was elected pope.

“I am a sinner,” the pope answers. "This is the most accurate definition. It is not a figure of speech, a literary genre. I am a sinner.”

The pope didn’t mention any particular sins, and Catholic theology holds that all humans are sinners, a consequence of Adam and Eve’s original transgression. Still, a pope describing himself foremost as “sinner” is striking.

Offering new glimpses of his personal life, Francis said he prays at the dentist’s office and that he felt trapped in the Vatican’s traditional papal apartments. (He moved to a smaller one in a nearby building.) He has a taste for tragic artists and Italian films and keeps the will of his beloved grandmother in his prayerbook.

But it was the pope’s vision for the church’s future - painted in broad strokes - that’s sure to rile or inspire Catholics, depending on which side of the church they sit.

Here are some highlights:

— On Women

Francis said, emphatically, that the “door is closed,” on women’s ordination, a statement that disappointed many Catholic liberals.

But that doesn’t mean the church should consider women secondary or inferior, Francis said. “The feminine genius is needed wherever we make important decisions,” he told Spadora.

Francis also called on Catholics to think hard about the function of women in the church.

“Women are asking deep questions that must be addressed,” the pope said. “The church cannot be herself without the woman and her role.”

— On Homosexuality

**When Francis was a bishop in Buenos Aires, Argentina, he received letters from gays and lesbians who said they were “socially wounded” by the church, he said.

“But the church does not want to do this,” Francis said in the interview**.

The pope then recalled his comments in July, when he told the media aboard a flight to Rome, “Who am I to judge” gay people?

“By saying this, I said what the catechism says,” the pope told Spadaro. The catechism, the Catholic Church’s book of official doctrine,** condemns homosexual acts,** but says gays and lesbians “must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity.”

“Religion has the right to express its opinion in the service of the people, but God in creation has set us free: it is not possible to interfere spiritually in the life of a person.”

Francis said that someone once asked him if he “approved” of homosexuality.

“I replied with another question,” he said. “`Tell me, when God looks at a gay person, does he endorse the existence of this person with love, or reject and condemn this person?’ We must always consider the person. Here we enter into the mystery of the human being.”

— Abortion, gay marriage and contraception

Some American Catholics grumble that Francis has been largely silent on signature Catholic political issues.

“I’m a little bit disappointed in Pope Francis that he hasn’t, at least that I’m aware of, said much about unborn children, about abortion, and many people have noticed that,” Bishop Thomas Tobin of Providence, Rhode Island, said earlier this month.

Francis said that he’s aware of the criticism, but he is not going to change.

“We cannot insist only on issues related to abortion, gay marriage and the use of contraceptive methods," he told his Jesuit interviewer. “I have not spoken much about these things, and I was reprimanded for that.”

But the pope said the church’s teachings on those issue are clear, and he clearly believes in those teachings, so what else is there to say?

“It is not necessary to talk about these issues all the time,” Francis said.

— False prophets and quick decisions

Only false prophets claim to have all the answers, Francis said.

“The great leaders of the people of God, like Moses, have always left room for doubt,” he said. “You must leave room for the Lord.”

But church leaders, including himself, haven’t always practiced humility, the pope admitted.

Many of the bad decisions he made while leading Catholics in Argentina came about because of his “authoritarianism and quick manner of making decisions,” the pope said.

That won’t happen again, Francis said, as he begins to steer the church in a new direction.

He didn’t offer an exact course, but he said change will come. Sooner or later.

“Many think that changes and reforms can take place in a short time,” he said. “I believe that we always need time to lay the foundations for real, effective change. And this is the time of discernment.”

 

[BigBlueCane]

Just another example of great progressive ideals this Pope, and the Church, espouses!

 

[The_Bucket]

He could try to stop making it so easy for them though.

How? And I mean that with all sincerity. Should he just shut up then? Should he not preach the Gospel then?

This is the Good News: God loves us.

This is our call: To love Him in return and our neighbors as ourselves.

Francis is simply saying that going on and on about what we are against leaves us no time to talk about who and what we are for and he is correct in saying that. Look at others in the thread worried that this is a “progressive victory” or some other nonsense. We are all Catholics. We are all sinners. That some of us have not come to understand and embrace the Lord’s teachings fully is only proof that they and we are all human.

If I may use what I think is an appropriate analogy… you have to chum the water with love before you can catch men. If you are only focused on the structure of your rod and reel and do not chum the water and properly bait your hook, you will not catch many men.

 

[dixieagle]

Read it people. Read it. I say it again, READ IT. It’s not the Holy Father’s fault that the media is going to twist what he has to say. They’re going to twist it no matter what. So should he be silent?

I imagine that Christ’s words were twisted plenty. I’m sure many in the crowds did not hear what they expected based on what they heard through the grapevine. Look at how many followed Him and then abandoned Him when they heard His command to eat His flesh and drink His blood. Look at the adoring crowds that turned into a bloodthirsty mob when they did not hear what they expected.

Should Christ have silenced himself out of fear that His message would be inadvertently or even deliberately twisted? Good heavens no. And neither should His vicar be silent regardless of how the media will portray it.

Yes!!!