Pope Francis: I am suspicious of ongoing Medjugorje apparitions [CNA]

  • Thread starter Thread starter CNA_News
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
C

CNA_News

Guest
http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/i...t_27_2015_Credict_Alan_Holdren_CNA.jpgVatican City, May 13, 2017 / 01:06 pm (CNA/EWTN News).- Asked by journalists about the alleged appearance of the Virgin Mary at Medjugorje, Pope Francis said the original apparitions more than three decades ago deserve further study, but voiced doubt in the supposed ongoing visions.

He stressed the need to distinguish between the two sets of apparitions, referencing a report submitted to the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith by a commission set to study the apparitions by Benedict XVI in 2010.

“The first apparitions, which were to children, the report more or less says that these need to continue being studied,” he said, but as for “presumed current apparitions, the report has its doubts.”

“I personally am more suspicious, I prefer the Madonna as Mother, our Mother, and not a woman who’s the head of an office, who every day sends a message at a certain hour. This is not the Mother of Jesus. And these presumed apparitions don’t have a lot of value.”

He clarified that this is his “personal opinion,” but added that the Madonna does not function by saying, “Come tomorrow at this time, and I will give a message to those people.”

However, Francis emphasized the need to differentiate between the initial

Pope Francis spoke to the 70 journalists on board with him during his May 13 flight from Fatima back to Rome. The presser followed a two-day trip to mark the centenary of the Marian apparitions that occurred in Fatima in 1917. During the visit, he also canonized two of the young visionaries, Francisco and Jacinta Marto.

While the Fatima apparitions have long been approved by the Vatican and local bishops, debate continues to cloud discussion over the authenticity of the alleged appearances in Medjugorje.

The apparitions allegedly started June 24, 1981, when six children in Medjugorje, a town in what is now Bosnia and Herzegovina, claimed to have witnessed apparitions of the Blessed Virgin Mary.

According to the alleged visionaries, the apparitions conveyed a message of peace for the world, a call to conversion, prayer and fasting, as well as certain secrets surrounding events to be fulfilled in the future.

These apparitions are said to have continued almost daily since their first occurrence, with three of the original six visionaries claiming to have received apparitions every afternoon because not all of the “secrets” intended for them have been revealed.

In April 1991, the bishops of the former Yugoslavia determined that “on the basis of the research that has been done, it is not possible to state that there were apparitions or supernatural revelations.”

On the basis of those findings, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith directed in October 2013 that clerics and the faithful “are not permitted to participate in meetings, conferences or public celebrations during which the credibility of such ‘apparitions’ would be taken for granted.”

However, Benedict XVI established a commission, headed by Cardinal Camillo Ruini, to study the topic in further detail.

In January 2014, the commission completed their study on supposed apparitions’ doctrinal and disciplinary aspects, and was to have submitted its findings to the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. The congregation has yet to submit its final document to the Pope for a final decision.

Pope Francis told journalists that Ruini’s report was “very well done,” and that there are three main takeaways that must be kept in mind when thinking of the report.

First, he stressed the importance of studying the first apparitions of 1981 as their own entity, and attached to this was the second point on the need to be wary of the alleged ongoing appearances, always distinguishing between the two.

Third, he emphasized the need to also look at the pastoral and spiritual dimensions of Medjugorje, because “people go there and convert. People encounter God, change their lives.”

This isn’t a result of “magic,” he said, but is a valid spiritual and pastoral fact that “can’t be ignored.”

feeds.feedburner.com/~ff/catholicnewsagency/dailynews?d=yIl2AUoC8zA
http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/catholicnewsagency/dailynews/~4/azbHqSlvHb4

Full article…
 
Pope Francis has effectively dismissed reports of continuing apparitions of the Virgin Mary at the Medjugorje shrine in southern Bosnia, saying the visions “don’t have much value” even if the shrine itself has helped Catholics find God.

Francis provided the first-ever details about the contentious process that has been under way for years to determine whether the Catholic Church should describe the Medjugorje visions as authentic.

smh.com.au/world/naughty-pope-pours-cold-water-on-talk-of-virgin-mary-appearing-in-bosnia-20170514-gw4egf.html
 
That’s not the title of your article. The title of your article is:

’Naughty’ Pope pours cold water on talk of Virgin Mary appearing in Bosnia

And Pope Francis’ exact words are:

"I personally am more evil, I prefer the Virgin Mother than the Virgin who becomes in charge of a telegraph office and sends a message every day."

lastampa.it/2017/05/13/vaticaninsider/eng/the-vatican/medjugorje-doubts-and-openings-of-the-pope-drhXLmmf3xzVtBohNoHp0M/pagina.html
Do we have to put the exact title in? Or what the article is about?

And my news article does NOT contain your quote.

You have something different, in your article

And you have not quoted your article correctly. - there is no mention of evil.

"I prefer Our Mother Lady to the one leading a telegraphic office that sends a message every day.” Pope Francis, returning from Fatima, softens the interpretation regarding the prayer on the “bishop dressed in white” (”I did not write it myself”) and answers a question about the apparitions of Medjugorje revealing the content of the Ruini report, positive on the first apparitions yet dubious about the current ones. "

Further quotes from your article

"Personally, I’m meaner: I prefer the Lady Mother, to the boss of telegraphic office, who sends a message every day. And these supposed apparitions do not have much value: I say this as a personal opinion. There are those who think that Our Lady is saying: Come, on that day I will give a message to that seer. "
 
It is interesting to note the Vatican might be viewing the very early Bosnia Apparitions differently to further ongoing Apparitions. Its not the first time Pope Francis has referred to the comment ’ telegraph office’
 
Yes, you have to put the exact title.

They must have modified the original article.
 
Yes, you have to put the exact title.

They must have modified the original article.
Actually no you don’t. I just checked rules. There is not even a rule that a weblink to the article must be supplied.

The only rule is not posting entire articles.

Every paper reporting the press conference on the plane, over the last day has no mention of the Pope calling himself evil.
Naughty yes, evil no. Maybe a paper report you read lied? And it had to be removed?
but I am ignoring all rhetoric of His and Trumps meeting.
 
40.png
Roseeurekacross:
Every paper reporting the press conference on the plane, over the last day has no mention of the Pope calling himself evil.
Naughty yes, evil no.
but I am ignoring all rhetoric of His and Trumps meeting.
spiritdaily.org/blog/uncategorized/pope-indicates-belief-in-early-medjugorje-apparitions
 
The English version of La Stampa uses the word “meaner”:

The Italian word used is “cattivo” which means “bad”. “Piu’ cattivo” means “worse”.

The word for evil in Italian is “male”.

cattivo, a
1 agg
a (persona, azione) bad, wicked , (bambino, birichino) naughty, bad
un bambino cattivo a naughty boy
brutto cattivo! you naughty boy!
quel ragazzo è un cattivo soggetto that boy’s a bit of a rascal
farsi cattivo sangue to worry, get in a state
farsi un cattivo nome to earn a bad reputation for o.s., earn o.s. a bad reputation
b (di qualità, gen) bad , (odore, sapore) bad, nasty, (cibo guasto) off, (insegnante, salute) bad, poor, (mare) rough
 
Blogs are a bit like Wikipedia. Prone to error. That blog links to the full article which uses the word meaner.

And no mention of the context of my article !

“Francis said he knew he was being “naughty” in doubting the Medjugorje phenomenon, in which six youngsters reported seeing visions.”

Don’t you love the media!
Well, the blog had to have cut and paste it from somewhere so I think the original source probably corrected it later on.
 
Well, the blog had to have cut and paste it from somewhere so I think the original source probably corrected it later on.
Unless the blog took the Italian original Italian version and google translated it. La Stampa has very good translations normally.
 
Pope Francis is not “naughty” in the real sense of the word; he is being light and using good humour because he knows his position might be unpopular with a large portion of Catholics.

(The sentiments he made about the Virgin Mary not being a post-mistress was said ages and ages ago).

If this is something new, then great! 👍
 
The English version of La Stampa uses the word “meaner”:

The Italian word used is “cattivo” which means “bad”. “Piu’ cattivo” means “worse”.

The word for evil in Italian is “male”.

cattivo, a
1 agg
a (persona, azione) bad, wicked , (bambino, birichino) naughty, bad
un bambino cattivo a naughty boy
brutto cattivo! you naughty boy!
quel ragazzo è un cattivo soggetto that boy’s a bit of a rascal
farsi cattivo sangue to worry, get in a state
farsi un cattivo nome to earn a bad reputation for o.s., earn o.s. a bad reputation
b (di qualità, gen) bad , (odore, sapore) bad, nasty, (cibo guasto) off, (insegnante, salute) bad, poor, (mare) rough
There you go, naughty is even a confused word in translation.

Which word did Pope Francis intend?

But after working through all that, the main point being how the Bosnia Apparitions are being regarded.

It makes sense to me that perhaps there might have been substance early on.
 
Pope Francis is not “naughty” in the real sense of the word; he is being light and using good humour because he knows his position might be unpopular with a large portion of Catholics.

(The sentiments he made about the Virgin Mary not being a post-mistress was said ages and ages ago).

If this is something new, then great! 👍
Reading the full report, it looks as if he said the same again, this month in 2017. That his “personal opinion” is that Med is not true. (Great stuff! 👍👍👍).

BTW, I thought this topic was disallowed in CAF?

(I remembered after replying - sorry).
 
Reading the full report, it looks as if he said the same again, this month in 2017. That his “personal opinion” is that Med is not true. (Great stuff! 👍👍👍).

BTW, I thought this topic was disallowed in CAF?

(I remembered after replying - sorry).
No , I think Pope Francis is saying the early Apparitions when they were kids, are worthy of further investigation, after reports from his people.

But the later Apparitions have to be treated as seperate. And perhaps there are problems found in those that are being looked into.
But yes, Pope Francis is being ‘meaner’ (naughtier, badder, etc) in regarding, as his personal opinion , that the Mother of Jesus is not a Telegraph Officer.

We can discuss this. We can’t discuss content of the Apparitions.

I do like Pope Francis talking about works of Mercy and works of charity , later in that full CNA interview and sharing that with the Lutherans, in common.
““also there is significance for the ecumenism of the journey… that is, to walk together, with prayer, with martyrdom, with works of charity, with works of mercy.””

I don’t understand the Bishop in White reference though?
 
No , I think Pope Francis is saying the early Apparitions when they were kids, are worthy of further investigation, after reports from his people.

But the later Apparitions have to be treated as seperate. And perhaps there are problems found in those that are being looked into.
But yes, Pope Francis is being ‘meaner’ (naughtier, badder, etc) in regarding, as his personal opinion , that the Mother of Jesus is not a Telegraph Officer.

We can discuss this. We can’t discuss content of the Apparitions.

I do like Pope Francis talking about works of Mercy and works of charity , later in that full CNA interview and sharing that with the Lutherans, in common.
““also there is significance for the ecumenism of the journey… that is, to walk together, with prayer, with martyrdom, with works of charity, with works of mercy.””

I don’t understand the Bishop in White reference though?
Well, while we might be itching to talk about it, we can’t.

Therefore, to do with the article:

…Anyhoo, it is a bit late for looking back at when they were kids. Investigations are done at the time so he might have said that they were more innocent as children than when people have grown up and can’t move on, but I don’t think his comments go beyond that. He has said that they don’t seem to be of the “true Madonna”. That is enough for me.

I think the “Bishop in White” refers to the Prayer said at Fatima recently. And this refers to the vision which mentions the ‘Bishop in White’.

Basically, the Pope is also known as the ‘Pontiff’, and also the ‘Bishop of Rome’. The Bishop of Rome dresses in white to represent purity and innocence (I think). And this is linked with the Blessed Virgin, because Mary is Perpetual Virgin. Maybe this too, is why Our Lady, for the most part, appears to children: because they are innocent of heart. Even in the case of Guadeloupe, Our Lady called St. Don Juan “my dear little son.” The case of reference points to the innocent/pure heart as one that can discern God, which refers back to Scripture: when Jesus said in Matthew 19:14 “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.”. This is the ideal - that souls grow in purity, to be like those of trusting little children, and so the link is there, between God, the Virgin Mary, the Pope (with whom the Virgin Mary is always with in a unique way) and the little children, and too, anyone who strives for saintly perfection.

That’s my: :twocents:
 
While the investigations into the very first alleged apparitions at Medjugorje in must continue, Pope Francis said he has doubts about claims that Mary continues to appear in the village of Bosnia-Herzegovina.

“The report has its doubts, but personally, I am a little worse,” the pope told reporters traveling with him from Fatima, Portugal. “I prefer Our Lady as mother, our mother, and not Our Lady as head of the post office who sends a message at a stated time.”

“This isn’t Jesus’ mother,” he said. “And these alleged apparitions don’t have much value. I say this as a personal opinion, but it is clear. Who thinks that Our Lady says, ‘Come, because tomorrow at this time I will give a message to that seer?’ No!”
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top