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Maximus1
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Catholic ( with little c). Nicely written.
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Pope Francis on we are all children of God yet the bible says only those who believe in Christ are
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EndTimes
Guest
This question gets asked in similar manners…All ARE children of God, whether by free will they decide to be followers of the Way, or not.
and answered in similar manners.
No. Not all are Children of God…
Some… are deemed children of the Father of Lies. .
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dscath
Guest
No. They are simply followers of the Father of Lies, but only God is the Father, in the sense that he was the creator. Satan has followers, but no humans (or even angels) are begotten by Satan.No. Not all are Children of God…
Some… are deemed children of the Father of Lies. .
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EndTimes
Guest
Interesting way of putting it - although, it could be reasonably argued that in the spiritual sense, just as those who are saved are deemed as being / becoming as actual Children of God, that those who allow the spirit of Satan to remain in them, become in the same manner - spiritual children of him.No. They are simply followers of the Father of Lies, but only God is the Father, in the sense that he was the creator. Satan has followers, but no humans (or even angels) are begotten by Satan.
You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father’s desires.
He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth,
because there is no truth in him.
When he lies, he speaks out of his own character, for he is a liar and the father of lies.
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Bottom line… in either case - my main concern is to remain a Child of God.
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EndTimes
Guest
No. that common False Protestant “Faith vs works” argumentThis is not true at all. This is a claim that you are justified by works. Romans 1-3 directly contradicts this understanding of salvation. And Romans 10 provides for us the sense of urgency to proclaim the gospel for the very reason that we are not saved by works but through faith.
- tossed against Catholics - solely refers to obeying Mosaic laws…
GOD SAYS: “Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds”
These refer to Deeds which would/must flow naturally - from any with actual Faith…
When Jesus speaks of Judgement / Goats and Sheep, The Goats are those who did not give (an action) e.g., water/food/shelter/clothing/Love - to those in need.
Here it’s clearly spelled out…
What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them? 15 Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. 16 If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? 17 In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.
18 But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.”
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. 19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.
20 You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless[d]? 21 Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. 23 And the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,”[e] and he was called God’s friend. 24 You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.
25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a diffe
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dscath
Guest
Bottom line…in any case…you will always remain a Child of God.Bottom line… in either case - my main concern is to remain a Child of God.
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Thom18
Guest
It stands to reason that God has as many children as there are human beings on the earth, and it’s merely a matter of who desires to act like His children that they are. We can speak of those children who participate in the relationship, those who don’t know about the possibility for this relationship, and those who are aware of the possibility and reject it.
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EndTimes
Guest
No.It stands to reason that God has as many children as there are human beings on the earth
Not to Sacred Scriptures
Those who and who’ve rejected God - are not His Children
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EndTimes
Guest
Bottom line is that only those who become Deemed by God as His Children - are…Bottom line…in any case…you will always remain a Child of God.
REF - Sacred Scriptures
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dscath
Guest
Perhaps if you take scripture literally, but the Catechism teaches we consider the literal sense (which is quite different from “taking it literally)”, and also consider the spiritual senses of Sacred Scripture.REF - Sacred Scriptures
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EndTimes
Guest
What you just said above is as a plain vanilla aka non-applicable gloss which lacks all meaning unless you can actually clearly connect it to/with a presented argument(s) within this discussion.Perhaps if you take scripture literally, but the Catechism teaches we consider the literal sense (which is quite different from “taking it literally)”, and also consider the spiritual senses of Sacred Scripture.
Whereas I can present support to what I’ve said about Children of God as well as children of Satan - the onus is on you to support your ongoing contention that we’re all specifically “Children of God”
AND – for Starters - THIS Looks to me that in the spiritual sense -
God’s also Teaching that those who’d rejected JESUS are Not Children of God, eh?
E.G. – The true light that gives light to everyone was coming into the world. He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.
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dscath
Guest
The discussion points I am making are based on Catholic teachings, which is all I can speak for.What you just said above is as a plain vanilla aka non-applicable gloss which lacks all meaning unless you can actually clearly connect it to/with a presented argument(s) within this discussion.
So, we may never be on the same page, so I have to bow out of this one, because it appears we are both speaking difference languages, and cannot understand each other.
Peace to you!
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EndTimes
Guest
So am I … Catholic Teachings and Teachings alone.The discussion points I am making are based on Catholic teachings, which is all I can speak for.
Ergo … A Catholic should have no problem understanding and accepting this:
Saint John - Gospel
The true light that gives light to everyone was coming into the world. He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.
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Cathoholic
Guest
Hodos . . .
Romans 10 says faith comes through hearing the word PREACHED (preaching is of course a “work”).
And all this was said in the context of “men” preaching.
That’d be many men. I am not excluding Jesus.
As a matter of fact Jesus works in and through these men.
St. Paul is describing one of the duties of PRIESTS here.
Faith comes via hearing the word preached via the WORKS of the Priests who are sent for among other things, preaching.
Funny you would cite Romans 10.And Romans 10 provides for us the sense of urgency to proclaim the gospel for the very reason that we are not saved by works but through faith.
Romans 10 says faith comes through hearing the word PREACHED (preaching is of course a “work”).
And all this was said in the context of “men” preaching.
That’d be many men. I am not excluding Jesus.
As a matter of fact Jesus works in and through these men.
St. Paul is describing one of the duties of PRIESTS here.
Faith comes via hearing the word preached via the WORKS of the Priests who are sent for among other things, preaching.
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MountainCruiser
Guest
Yes, I agree. There are people who have never heard the Gospel. The bible says they will be judged on what they do know.We are all children of God. Period. The atheist, pagan, Jew and Muslim are all children of God, just like Christians. Whether any of them are saved is a question only God can answer, including as to the Christian.
Romans 2:12-29 New International Version (NIV)
12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
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Uriel1
Guest
John 14:6 tells us we cannot come to the Father except through Jesus
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
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EndTimes
Guest
All have the potential to be children of God…
Any who steadfasty refuse Him are in essence children of Satan the Refuser
Such are the choices of our will…
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Any who steadfasty refuse Him are in essence children of Satan the Refuser
Such are the choices of our will…
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MountainCruiser
Guest
What about people that never heard the Gospel? Curious what you think happens to them.John 14:6 tells us we cannot come to the Father except through Jesus
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
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EndTimes
Guest
We hear this question - constantly…What about people that never heard the Gospel? Curious what you think happens to them.
God is written in the hearts of people…
Their conscience is their guide.
There’s really no actual runaround today re: Jesus / Gospel -
Let’s look at Gentiles - who’d never heard of God, Messiah or Jesus = as Jews did.
Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my Gospel declares.
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MountainCruiser
Guest
. . . . That’s the exact same biblical quote I quoted when I said that there are people who have never heard the Gospel and that they are judged on what they do know…We hear this question - constantly…
God is written in the hearts of people…
Their conscience is their guide.
There’s really no actual runaround today re: Jesus / Gospel -
Let’s look at Gentiles - who’d never heard of God, Messiah or Jesus = as Jews did.
Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my Gospel declares.
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