Pope Francis to speak from Lincoln's Gettysburg Address lectern

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Interestingly enough, we’ve got a few around here with negtaive opinions regarding President Lincoln. I wonder how they feel about this.

I think it’s a great image myself.
 
Lincoln’s way too beloved for tastes, but this is cool nonetheless.
 
Well all things considered, why anybody thinks the Roman Pontiff standing behind that podium is some distinctive honor I do not agree. Lincoln was a deceiver and spoke many untruths in his little victory jig. I think Menken had it right.

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But let us not forget that it is poetry, not logic; beauty, not sense. Think of the argument in it. Put it into the cold words of everyday. The doctrine is simply this: that the Union soldiers who died at Gettysburg sacrificed their lives to the cause of self-determination—“that government of the people, by the people, for the people,” should not perish from the earth. It is difficult to imagine anything more untrue. The Union soldiers in that battle actually fought against self-determination; it was the Confederates who fought for the right of their people to govern themselves. What was the practical effect of the battle of Gettysburg? What else than the destruction of the old sovereignty of the States, i.e., of the people of the States? The Confederates went into battle free; they came out with their freedom subject to the supervision and veto of the rest of the country—and for nearly twenty years that veto was so effective that they enjoyed scarcely more liberty, in the political sense, than so many convicts in the penitentiary.
dcdave.com/article5/081122.htm
 
stevegravy said:
Well all things considered, why anybody thinks the Roman Pontiff standing behind that podium is some distinctive honor I do not agree. Lincoln was a deceiver and spoke many untruths in his little victory jig. I think Menken had it right.

Quote
But let us not forget that it is poetry, not logic; beauty, not sense. Think of the argument in it. Put it into the cold words of everyday. The doctrine is simply this: that the Union soldiers who died at Gettysburg sacrificed their lives to the cause of self-determination—“that government of the people, by the people, for the people,” should not perish from the earth. It is difficult to imagine anything more untrue. The Union soldiers in that battle actually fought against self-determination; it was the Confederates who fought for the right of their people to govern themselves. What was the practical effect of the battle of Gettysburg? What else than the destruction of the old sovereignty of the States, i.e., of the people of the States? The Confederates went into battle free; they came out with their freedom subject to the supervision and veto of the rest of the country—and for nearly twenty years that veto was so effective that they enjoyed scarcely more liberty, in the political sense, than so many convicts in the penitentiary.
dcdave.com/article5/081122.htm
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The Confederacy fought to be able to continue the institution of slavery.

Lincoln is perhaps the greatest American President.
 
ringil said:
The Confederacy fought to be able to continue the institution of slavery.

So, who cares? It was their State, their laws, their independence from an oppressive and greedy federal government. Lincoln got 600,000 guys killed to maintain his access to Yankee custom house revenues and so not to be the president caretaker of a rump country. That the Yankees won the war, built their empire, and could control the narrative doesn’t change the facts.

Lincoln is perhaps the greatest American President.
And I like chocolate.
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Governments do what they have to do in order to maintain control, they will commit all and any injustice not to lose.

I will admit that he had the personality and strength of character and a tenacious mind to manage the victory, not to mention a real trickster out maneuvering Davis at almost every turn. His victory began the transformation of a free people to serfdom which should be completed in the next half century or less. The question I cannot resolve is, whether the transformation was inevitable as the frontier disappeared and the cities filled up. The people’s natural inclination to be controlled and provided for, to be bribed with their own money as Tocqueville put it, just might have been worked into the cards. Lincoln just may have been the fortunate one sitting in the chair when the sh** show started.
 
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