Pope Francis wants Church to be poor, and for the poor

[liturgyluver]

reuters.com/article/2013/03/16/us-pope-poor-idUSBRE92F05P20130316

This all looks very encouraging. Clealy a thoughful man who is determined to do things his way:

*While the formal voting continued, the pope recalled: “I thought of wars … and Francis (of Assisi) is the man of peace, and that is how the name entered my heart, Francis of Assisi, for me he is the man of poverty, the man of peace, the man who loves and protects others.”

It was the latest indication that the pope wanted the worldwide Church to take on an austere style.

On the night he was elected he shunned the papal limousine and travelled on a bus with other cardinals. He went to the Church-run hotel where he had been staying before the conclave and insisted on paying the bill.

Francis, the former Cardinal Jorge Bergoglio, has also urged Argentines not to make costly trips to Rome to see him but to give the money to the poor instead.

RESPECT NATURE

St. Francis of Assisi, who died in 1226, renounced his family’s fortune for a life of charity and poverty and is also revered by environmentalists because he loved nature and preached to animals.*"*Right now, we don’t have a very good relation with creation," the pope said.

He said that Catholics should remember that Jesus, not the pope, was the centre of the Church. At the end of his address, switching from Italian into Spanish, he also made a gesture to non-believers and members of other religions.

“I told you I would willingly give you a blessing. Since many of you do not belong to the Catholic Church and others are non-believers, from the bottom of my heart I give this silent blessing to each and every one of you, respecting the conscience of each one of you but knowing that each one of you is a child of God. May God bless all of you,” he said*

 

[Ellen_Mary]

I truly believe Pope Francis will be an awesome Pope. He is showing himself to be a man of humility, love and compassion for all. The more I hear about our beloved Pope Francis the more I like him.

 

[Lucky7]

reuters.com/article/2013/03/16/us-pope-poor-idUSBRE92F05P20130316

He said that Catholics should remember that Jesus, not the pope, was the centre of the Church. At the end of his address, switching from Italian into Spanish, he also made a gesture to non-believers and members of other religions.

“I told you I would willingly give you a blessing. Since many of you do not belong to the Catholic Church and others are non-believers, from the bottom of my heart I give this **silent blessing **to each and every one of you, respecting the conscience of each one of you but knowing that each one of you is a child of God. May God bless all of you,” he said

Hm. I* think *I like how he worded this. In one breath he shows repsect, but at the same time he makes it clear that they are not members of the Catholic Church and many are non-believers. I just wonder whether they realize that they didn’t get an official, Catholic blessing because of that fact. I am extremely sensitive to quotes by Catholic leaders that make it seem like any religion is a.o.k. when in reality it should be clear that the Catholic Faith is the fullness of the Faith.

 

[Bartolome_Casas]

Thank you for posting this. I saw the same article this morning and was shocked.
This same content can be seen on this Vatican web site: en.radiovaticana.va/news/2013…/en1-674003
As far as I can determine, conservative Catholic news sources, such as National Catholic Register, EWTN, Our Sunday Visitor, and Catholic World Report, are not reporting on this.
I imagine George Weigel, Supreme Knight Carl A. Anderson, Fr. Robert Sirico, Thomas E. Woods, Paul Ryan, and the president of the Ayn Rand Society on the phone this morning in a conference call saying, “WHAT do we do now?!”

 

[CutlerB]

I’m not sure whether I understand the Pope correctly, when he says he wants the Church to be poor.

If he means: “We shouldn’t spend money on secondary things, when there are more urgent investments or spendings to be done”, then I agree!

But if he means: “I’m going to sell off all the stuff in the Vatican and all churches must be stripped of pomp and beauty” then I am very concerned.

 

[gnjsdad]

I suspect he’ll have something to say about captialism, consumerism, greed, and Wall Street’s excesses. The preferential option for the poor will be given a new emphasis, I believe.

The more I hear about the new Holy Father, the more I like about him.

 

[DaveBj]

I’m not sure whether I understand the Pope correctly, when he says he wants the Church to be poor.

If he means: “We shouldn’t spend money on secondary things, when there are more urgent investments or spendings to be done”, then I agree!

But if he means: “I’m going to sell off all the stuff in the Vatican and all churches must be stripped of pomp and beauty” then I am very concerned.

I agree, especially with you second statement (altho I do think that the Church could do with a little less pomp). If the Church is going to be “for the poor,” then at least some of the Church’s members need to be prosperous.

 

[Tampa_Dave]

I’m not sure whether I understand the Pope correctly, when he says he wants the Church to be poor.

If he means: “We shouldn’t spend money on secondary things, when there are more urgent investments or spendings to be done”, then I agree!

**But if he means: “I’m going to sell off all the stuff in the Vatican and all churches must be stripped of pomp and beauty” then I am very concerned. **

Totally agree. I have no idea where Pope Francis is going with his personal perception of what “Church poverty” entails.

 

[CutlerB]

I agree, especially with you second statement (altho I do think that the Church could do with a little less pomp). If the Church is going to be “for the poor,” then at least some of the Church’s members need to be prosperous.

The Church needs to be rich/prosperous in order to help the poor. I see a contradiction in her being poor and helping the poor. About the pomp: I am a huge fan of ornate and beautiful churches, and in fact I think that every church should be a marvel. They express the glory of God and heaven, and that’s why I don’t want to see some regulations or so imposed that restrict that (I doubt that will happen).

In line with the Holy Fathers attitude, I advocate humility in person and behaviour, but beauty and majesty in all things pertaining to God.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

Since the cathedral in Buenos Aires still has its artwork, gold candlesticks, etc. I don’t think he is talking about stripping things out of the Vatican to sell. But if he means that bishops can get along without personal chefs than he has traction. I don’t think that every bishop needs to cook all his own meals, but certainly things could be a bit more austere in many places including many seminaries and rectories.

 

[CutlerB]

Since the cathedral in Buenos Aires still has its artwork, gold candlesticks, etc. I don’t think he is talking about stripping things out of the Vatican to sell. But if he means that bishops can get along without personal chefs than he has traction. I don’t think that every bishop needs to cook all his own meals, but certainly things could be a bit more austere in many places including many seminaries and rectories.

Agree!

 

[kelvinf]

Thank you for posting this. I saw the same article this morning and was shocked.
This same content can be seen on this Vatican web site: en.radiovaticana.va/news/2013…/en1-674003
As far as I can determine, conservative Catholic news sources, such as National Catholic Register, EWTN, Our Sunday Visitor, and Catholic World Report, are not reporting on this.
I imagine George Weigel, Supreme Knight Carl A. Anderson, Fr. Robert Sirico, Thomas E. Woods, Paul Ryan, and the president of the Ayn Rand Society on the phone this morning in a conference call saying, “WHAT do we do now?!”

The title of this thread is what secular news agencies like the BBC and co are reporting. This wasn’t the core of the pope’s message today!

 

[Tampa_Dave]

The Church needs to be rich/prosperous in order to help the poor. I see a contradiction in her being poor and helping the poor. About the pomp: I am a huge fan of ornate and beautiful churches, and in fact I think that every church should be a marvel. They express the glory of God and heaven, and that’s why I don’t want to see some regulations or so imposed that restrict that (I doubt that will happen).

In line with the Holy Fathers attitude, I advocate humility in person and behaviour, but beauty and majesty in all things pertaining to God.

I do not wish to see Pope Francis walking the streets of Rome barefoot in dirty robes, nor Vatican treasures pawned, basilicas sold, or Church bank accounts emptied for the sake of humility. What would the global community think if President Obama donned Levi jeans and a sweatshirt, sold the White House in favor of an apartment in Southeast DC, and flew coach on United Airlines commercial flights to conduct U.S. business across the globe? I can understand diverting Church income to fund poverty programs favored by Pope Francis, but I cannot see him dismantling the Church infrastructure or dissipating accumulated Church wealth.

 

[Tobias22]

Thank you for posting this. I saw the same article this morning and was shocked.
This same content can be seen on this Vatican web site: en.radiovaticana.va/news/2013…/en1-674003
As far as I can determine, conservative Catholic news sources, such as National Catholic Register, EWTN, Our Sunday Visitor, and Catholic World Report, are not reporting on this.
I imagine George Weigel, Supreme Knight Carl A. Anderson, Fr. Robert Sirico, Thomas E. Woods, Paul Ryan, and the president of the Ayn Rand Society on the phone this morning in a conference call saying, “WHAT do we do now?!”

I imagine the Pope will discourage the building of ornate new churches or building a Cathedral when one already exists and it’s sort of just for show. This was done in Oakland a while back.

I think this is reflected in his very simple Masses. Don’t know what this will mean for attempting to reform the liturgy as Benedict did. I just don’t see that as being a priority for this Pope.

If the comment about the lack of need for the Ordinariate is true, and it sort of looks that way, what will this mean for talks with the SPPX? The deal they rejected from Benedict may be the best they could have gotten. The SPPX tends to be ornate in it’s services and all and that is apparently not something the new Pope stresses.

 

[confusedgirl]

I think it has much to do with where he’s from. There are so many people in poverty in south america and its not really looked at much in Europe or in North america not to say we dont care but he must of either lived in poverty or lived around people who were. Some people go to mass for themselves but often forget about their service to others. I personally believe he is trying to reinforce charity to others in the church. God bless our new pope and may he lead us into a bright future for the church. I prayed for a wise leader and it looks like I got one

 

[liturgyluver]

The title of this thread is what secular news agencies like the BBC and co are reporting. This wasn’t the core of the pope’s message today!

Well this is what he said in relation to the poor:

*Some people wanted to know why the Bishop of Rome wished to be called Francis. Some thought of Francis Xavier, Francis De Sales, and also Francis of Assisi. I will tell you the story. During the election, I was seated next to the Archbishop Emeritus of São Paolo and Prefect Emeritus of the Congregation for the Clergy, Cardinal Claudio Hummes: a good friend, a good friend! When things were looking dangerous, he encouraged me. And when the votes reached two thirds, there was the usual applause, because the Pope had been elected. And he gave me a hug and a kiss, and said: “Don’t forget the poor!” And those words came to me: the poor, the poor. Then, right away, thinking of the poor, I thought of Francis of Assisi. Then I thought of all the wars, as the votes were still being counted, till the end. Francis is also the man of peace. That is how the name came into my heart: Francis of Assisi. For me, he is the man of poverty, the man of peace, the man who loves and protects creation; these days we do not have a very good relationship with creation, do we? He is the man who gives us this spirit of peace, the poor man … How I would like a Church which is poor and for the poor! Afterwards, people were joking with me. *

And here is a link to the full text. news.va/en/news/pope-francis-to-media-representatives-full-text

I don’t think the reuter link is at odds with this at all.

 

[liturgyluver]

I think it has much to do with where he’s from. There are so many people in poverty in south america and its not really looked at much in Europe or in North america not to say we dont care but he must of either lived in poverty or lived around people who were. Some people go to mass for themselves but often forget about their service to others. I personally believe he is trying to reinforce charity to others in the church. God bless our new pope and may he lead us into a bright future for the church. I prayed for a wise leader and it looks like I got one

I think you have summed up the spirit of what he meant very well.

 

[Tobias22]

Well this is what he said in relation to the poor:

*Some people wanted to know why the Bishop of Rome wished to be called Francis. Some thought of Francis Xavier, Francis De Sales, and also Francis of Assisi. I will tell you the story. During the election, I was seated next to the Archbishop Emeritus of São Paolo and Prefect Emeritus of the Congregation for the Clergy, Cardinal Claudio Hummes: a good friend, a good friend! When things were looking dangerous, he encouraged me. And when the votes reached two thirds, there was the usual applause, because the Pope had been elected. And he gave me a hug and a kiss, and said: “Don’t forget the poor!” And those words came to me: the poor, the poor. Then, right away, thinking of the poor, I thought of Francis of Assisi. Then I thought of all the wars, as the votes were still being counted, till the end. Francis is also the man of peace. That is how the name came into my heart: Francis of Assisi. For me, he is the man of poverty, the man of peace, the man who loves and protects creation; these days we do not have a very good relationship with creation, do we? He is the man who gives us this spirit of peace, the poor man … How I would like a Church which is poor and for the poor! Afterwards, people were joking with me. *

And here is a link to the full text. news.va/en/news/pope-francis-to-media-representatives-full-text

I don’t think the reuter link is at odds with this at all.

Interesting. The reference to protecting creation. I wonder if he will emphasize an environmentally concious chucrh. One that joins in the fight against global warming?

 

[RocketRM]

I think it has much to do with where he’s from. There are so many people in poverty in south america and its not really looked at much in Europe or in North america not to say we dont care but he must of either lived in poverty or lived around people who were. Some people go to mass for themselves but often forget about their service to others. I personally believe he is trying to reinforce charity to others in the church. God bless our new pope and may he lead us into a bright future for the church. I prayed for a wise leader and it looks like I got one

I agree, I believe my prayers were answered also! Our new Holy Father has already had a profound impact on me.

We as a Church need to walk more like Christ and I believe everything he has done in his short papacy is leading in that direction.

 

[CutlerB]

I imagine the Pope will discourage the building of ornate new churches or building a Cathedral when one already exists and it’s sort of just for show. This was done in Oakland a while back.

I think this is reflected in his very simple Masses. Don’t know what this will mean for attempting to reform the liturgy as Benedict did. I just don’t see that as being a priority for this Pope.

If the comment about the lack of need for the Ordinariate is true, and it sort of looks that way, what will this mean for talks with the SPPX? The deal they rejected from Benedict may be the best they could have gotten. The SPPX tends to be ornate in it’s services and all and that is apparently not something the new Pope stresses.

Well, it’s up to him. But if I were allowed to make a wish, I’d have all those horrible 60s and 70s churches brought “up to speed” or rather replaced. As for superfluous churches and cathedrals: That wouldn’t make any sense, so I think he would be very right to discourage that.

I just heard from Vatican TV that the Pope actually said that the Church exists to “communicate Truth, goodness and beauty in person”. That might put things in perspective.