Pope says condoms sometimes permissible to stop AIDS

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I do not want anyone to misunderstand me. I love our Holy Father and pray for him regularly. I just do not see how this helped anything, and in fact I think it will likely prove to hurt much.
 
MarianD said:
Popes have done things a lot worse than say that condoms could be used to stop a sinner from forcing others to feel the effects of his sin.

Even then, the Pope is always entitled to his own opinion and what he said in an interview isn’t an ex cathedra statement.
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This is exactly what I was thinking. Is this an ex cathedra statement or is it just Pope Benedict’s opinion? If it’s his opinion then it might be a step in the wrong direction although I can understand what he means.

This is off-topic and I apologize, but I’d like to just mention it. If I were being raped I would hope the rapist would be wearing a condom. I think. No, now I’m not sure and it’s all so complicated. My concern is not that a child would be conceived via rape. If that happened to me I would accept my child and feel extremely blessed to be given such a gift, even if the gift didn’t come through normal channels.

But AIDS? That scares me. I can’t see that as a gift even though God is divine and if He wishes for me to have AIDS I will have AIDS. But it isn’t something I would choose for myself or anyone else.

You know, after reading the posts in this thread I’m finding that I’m in agreement with everyone even though some posters disagree with other posters. This is a very, very confusing issue and I hope the Vatican gives us some more information.

:confused::confused::confused:
 
Agree or disagree, but let’s not forget that Saint Augustine held the idea that prostitution was a virtuous and good thing for society (In my opinion pretty hypocritical considering considering he also went to the opposite extreme in sexual matters in the same breath, that’s why I always skip Augustine’s teachings on sexuality, it was mostly his emotional extreme reaction to what he considered his messed up youth)

Also remember that Benedict may be pope and Augustine may be a saint but neither is perfect and both are giving opinions in each of these cases, so take that for what its worth.
 
jerryson said:
Agree or disagree, but let’s not forget that Saint Augustine held the idea that prostitution was a virtuous and good thing for society (In my opinion pretty hypocritical considering considering he also went to the opposite extreme in sexual matters in the same breath, that’s why I always skip Augustine’s teachings on sexuality, it was mostly his emotional extreme reaction to what he considered his messed up youth)

Also remember that Benedict may be pope and Augustine may be a saint but neither is perfect and both are giving opinions in each of these cases, so take that for what its worth.
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Of course, neither are/were perfect. Yet, this will be used against the Church and the people in pews will suffer for it…again. IMHO.

It is important to remember that “most” people think the Popes are infallible in all matters.
 
LittleSoldier said:
My concern is not that a child would be conceived via rape. If that happened to me I would accept my child and feel extremely blessed to be given such a gift, even if the gift didn’t come through normal channels.
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Go get mental help, now
 
irishpatrick said:
I do not want anyone to misunderstand me. I love our Holy Father and pray for him regularly. I just do not see how this helped anything, and in fact I think it will likely prove to hurt much.
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I don’t think anyone will misunderstand you. I’m so confused right now about this issue!! It’s one of those moral dilemmas that doesn’t have an easy, clear-cut solution.

I love Pope Benedict, too. I’m already disappointed in the media attention. Why does it seem like the whole world holds its breath, waiting for the Pope to say something that might just appear a little bit to be a change in discipline or doctrine, even if it isn’t? I wonder how long it will take for one of those “news magazines” like the National Enquirer to blurt out in huge letters that now the Pope approves of artificial contraception.

But then Catholics have always suffered persecution and I guess the best way to handle this is to learn as much as we can, pray, and when someone brings this up (and that will happen) we can tell that someone what is really going on. And then rejoice in the persecution because it will bring us grace.
 
I am totally confused and I need someone to help me understand this. What message does it send to everyone: It is okay to use condoms.

What???
 
LittleSoldier said:
I don’t think anyone will misunderstand you. I’m so confused right now about this issue!! It’s one of those moral dilemmas that doesn’t have an easy, clear-cut solution.

I love Pope Benedict, too. I’m already disappointed in the media attention. Why does it seem like the whole world holds its breath, waiting for the Pope to say something that might just appear a little bit to be a change in discipline or doctrine, even if it isn’t? I wonder how long it will take for one of those “news magazines” like the National Enquirer to blurt out in huge letters that now the Pope approves of artificial contraception.

But then Catholics have always suffered persecution and I guess the best way to handle this is to learn as much as we can, pray, and when someone brings this up (and that will happen) we can tell that someone what is really going on. And then rejoice in the persecution because it will bring us grace.
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I think with these sorts of terrible moral issues, the Church has to be completely clear that it loves all people, that it wants health and salvation for all, and that it will not affirm people in their sins.
 
irishpatrick said:
My hope is that somehow the Pope’s words have been misrrepresented…again.
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I don’t believe anything the media reports about the Church. The media never gets it right – deliberately and with malice. I wait until I can read the Pope’s own words in context from a trusted source like Zenit or Vatican News Service or CNA. Fox News is now reporting “a change in Church doctrine.” Bull-oney. They’re no doubt reporting what they got from Reuters, who no doubt misinterpreted the meaning of the Pope’s words. News organizations feed off each other – right or wrong.

Jim Dandy
 
Jim_Dandy said:
I don’t believe anything the media reports about the Church. The media never gets it right – deliberately and with malice. I wait until I can read the Pope’s own words in context from a trusted source like Zenit or Vatican News Service or CNA. Fox News is now reporting “a change in Church doctrine.” Bull-oney. They’re no doubt reporting what they got from Reuters, who no doubt misinterpreted the meaning of the Pope’s words. News organizations feed off each other – right or wrong.

Jim Dandy
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I tend to agree with you, yet if the words quoted are correct, than it is a difficult situation.
 
Yes, I too think Archbishop Lefevbre has a point if this is correctly reported. This will give traditionalists a field day and I can’t say I can blame then. This will only please the liberals who hate the Pope’s guts anyway and just let down all the Pope’s true supporters. I pray it will be denied.
 
😦
julianutwood said:
Yes, I too think Archbishop Lefevbre has a point if this is correctly reported. This will give traditionalists a field day and I can’t say I can blame then. This will only please the liberals who hate the Pope’s guts anyway and just let down all the Pope’s true supporters. I pray it will be denied.
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So, what’s next?..

In certain circumstances it is ok for women to be ordained…
In certain circumstances is is ok for gay couples to get married
In certain circumstances it is ok to have an abortion.

Scoff now, but my understanding has always been that condoms are a form of birth control and the Church cannot change its moral teaching on birth control.

Everyone is saying that this isn’t ex-cathedra, but I have always been taught the pope cannot error in matters of faith and morals.
 
irishpatrick said:
Seriously, condoms are now okay, and it would seem so is male prostitution.
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It is a useful exercise to predict how a story will be mangled. It inoculates the news-consumer against spin.

For example, since B16 was the right age for (compulsory) participation in the Hitlerjugend, it only stood to reason that people would start calling him a Nazi, and this is exactly what has happened.

Or again, the spin put on the Holy Office’s 1962 instruction Crimen Sollicitationis turned out to be exactly what you’d expect, that the Vatican conspired to cover up the abuse cases.

Add to that more recently the irresponsible reporting this summer on the canonical revisions to how grave delicts are handled, to the effect that the Vatican - it’s always “The Vatican”, isn’t it? - considers sexual abuse of minors morally equivalent to attempted ordination of a woman. (And nobody said anything about extending the statute of limitations on abuse charges; that would make the Vatican look good.)

So now, maybe it’s a little late, but does anyone have predictions how this will be spun?
 
Apollos said:
It is a useful exercise to predict how a story will be mangled. It inoculates the news-consumer against spin.

For example, since B16 was the right age for (compulsory) participation in the Hitlerjugend, it only stood to reason that people would start calling him a Nazi, and this is exactly what has happened.

Or again, the spin put on the Holy Office’s 1962 instruction Crimen Sollicitationis turned out to be exactly what you’d expect, that the Vatican conspired to cover up the abuse cases.

Add to that more recently the irresponsible reporting this summer on the canonical revisions to how grave delicts are handled, to the effect that the Vatican - it’s always “The Vatican”, isn’t it? - considers sexual abuse of minors morally equivalent to attempted ordination of a woman. (And nobody said anything about extending the statute of limitations on abuse charges; that would make the Vatican look good.)

So now, maybe it’s a little late, but does anyone have predictions how this will be spun?
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It will be spun, as it is already, that the Church has made a major doctrinal change.
 
jerryson said:
Agree or disagree, but let’s not forget that Saint Augustine held the idea that prostitution was a virtuous and good thing for society (In my opinion pretty hypocritical considering considering he also went to the opposite extreme in sexual matters in the same breath, that’s why I always skip Augustine’s teachings on sexuality, it was mostly his emotional extreme reaction to what he considered his messed up youth)

Also remember that Benedict may be pope and Augustine may be a saint but neither is perfect and both are giving opinions in each of these cases, so take that for what its worth.
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To clarify, Saint Augustine does not hold the view you accuse him of. Augustine may very well have held that view, but as far as I know, Saint Augustine is in heaven with God and now knows Truth. Or are you having conversations with Saint Augustine? If so, why tell me to seek mental help?

And why should I seek mental health for accepting one of the greatest gifts in the world? What would you have me do - abort my own child? Not love her? Give her away? I would never do anything like that.

So, for the third time - Why?
 
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