Pope says weapons manufacturers can't call themselves Christian

[bobcrawford]

Yup. I agree.

It was completely followed and was a just war. The weapons of mass destruction have been found. The gas was uncovered in the desert a few years ago. It was there all the time, just hidden. Also, some of it was moved to Syria before the fall of Saddam.

What happened is that Obama and the evil regime that it is, removed the troops too early and left a vacuum that allowed ISIS to fill the vacuum. No one could predict that a greater evil would develop but clearly Obama is the one who made the disastrous decision which allowed it to happen.

 

[bobcrawford]

nationalreview.com/article/421227/kevin-sutherland-murder-man-duty-defend-weak-vulnerable

The Socialist Progressive Liberals have ruined several generations. They have made wussies out of young men. The country has grown fat and lazy and no appreciation for work and freedom.

50% of Catholics in this country continue to vote for and support the Democrats who support and contribute to anti-Catholic ideals like destruction of marriage and families. They vote for and support Democrats who put anti-Christian judges in place. They vote for politicians and Catholic politicians who support and promote abortion.

The Pope even cozies up to Obama and the Communists in Cuba.

There is no excommunication of so-called Catholic politicians like Pelosi and Biden who openly defy the Church’s position on abortion. The Church supports the influx of illegal immigrants who take jobs away from especially African-Americans and keep wages low causing the middle class to decline.

We have a crisis in this Church and I wonder if the Holy Spirit is really guiding the Church now. Or is the Holy Spirit trying, but the men leading the Church now are just ignoring the guidance. What I see happening now in the Church simply cannot be the will of God.

 

[EIF5A]

Yes, the majority of people do not want to work for nothing. The stockholders also want to make money from their investments. Just because a company and its people manufacturer weapons of ANY type does not mean it has to be a non-profit business. Profits create jobs. Profits help retirees with income. Profit is good, not a bad thing.

We would not have to have a weapons industry if all countries and their leaders acted as rational human beings. As it is now, most Muslims would kill Christians if given the opportunity. Iran has a hate America day. Iran has publicly stated they want to wipe Israel off the map. They are killing Christians because of their faith.

We’ve seen what Nazi Germany can do. We’ve seen what people in our own country can do in killing children. We need weapons to defend our country and even individuals need to defend themselves against threats on their lives.

There is nothing wrong with weapons manufacturing and manufacturing them for profit. The Pope comes from a failed Socialist country. Instead of learning from the failure, he promotes it.

I for one am getting tired of people saying it’s a translation error. The reality of it is, it’s not a translation error. This is what he really thinks.

Wasn’t the pope talking about greed, not profit?

Profit at the expense of the poor. Profit at the expense of unnecessary violence and killing. Indifference due to profit-seeking. etc

Do people profit off of war? Do people want more war to sell more products?

 

[EIF5A]

The Pope even cozies up to Obama and the Communists in Cuba.

“Cozies up”? How is it so easy for you to judge the intents and motives of the Holy Father? And don’t even try to say it’s not a loaded phrase.

 

[bobcrawford]

He is Christ’s Vicar on Earth surely we owe him obedience.

I’ve been meaning to read Revelations. Doesn’t it speak to the Church being taken over those who will not follow the guidance of the Holy Spirit? Someone like an anti-Christ or anti-pope?

Or am I just getting it confused with people’s interpretations?

 

[EIF5A]

We have a crisis in this Church and** I wonder if the Holy Spirit is really guiding the Church now.** Or is the Holy Spirit trying, but the men leading the Church now are just ignoring the guidance. What I see happening now in the Church simply cannot be the will of God.

By what authority do you have this discernment? Did Jesus tell you, “Actually, let me take back My words about the gates of Hades not prevailing”?

So tell me, what heretical thing has Pope Francis taught? Actually heretical, and not just disagreeing with your vision of idyllic, capitalistic world.

 

[bobcrawford]

I for one am tired of hearing the Pope’s attack on wealth generation and accumulation. People earn wealth to take care of their families and provide for themselves in retirement. People want to live in comfort.

What the Pope needs to address instead are those who prefer to live off the work of others. Women who have baby, after baby with no marriage and no husband, preferring to live off the money the government gives them.

Why is there no focus on WORK and taking care of yourself? I never hear the Pope address the laziness of people. Look at Greece, his own country Argentina, Italy where he lives now, where people rather take government assistance than work.

Why is nothing said about this? I see the Catholic bishops support the illegal immigrants but why doesn’t he condemn the countries like Mexico who are corrupt and fail to provide for their own citizens?

Seems like the Pope is misdirected in his attacks.

 

[EIF5A]

Why is nothing said about this? I see the Catholic bishops support the illegal immigrants but why doesn’t he condemn the countries like Mexico who are corrupt and fail to provide for their own citizens?

Seems like the Pope is misdirected in his attacks.

Well, corruption stems from greed and wanting more and more money regardless of how it’s obtained…

I don’t think the pope has to point out every country’s detailed faults…

 

[bobcrawford]

That’s why it took TWO. Because they were so ready to surrender.

Yeah, no kidding. If the Japanese were ready to surrender why were we looking at a land invasion and prediction of casualties of close to 1,000,000 US soldiers killed or wounded.

It just is not true that the Japanese were ready to surrender. Were they defeated at that point? Sure, but were they going to give up without continuing the fight? Not a chance. It was the atomic bomb that forced the surrender. No revisionist history is going to change that fact.

 

[bobcrawford]

I love the comments about “greed” and constant pursuit of money.

Is it greed then that drives every Catholic institution to constantly hit me up for money? If I cannot let my greed drive my accumulation of wealth, how do I get the money to support all the requests for money from these greedy Catholic institutions?

Why is it Catholic elementary school tuition is $5K to $10K, high school tuition at $7K+ and Catholic college tuition at $30K or more? If that is not greed and punishing to Catholic families, I don’t know what is.

 

[styrgwillidar]

Yeah, no kidding. If the Japanese were ready to surrender why were we looking at a land invasion and prediction of casualties of close to 1,000,000 US soldiers killed or wounded.

It just is not true that the Japanese were ready to surrender. Were they defeated at that point? Sure, but were they going to give up without continuing the fight? Not a chance. It was the atomic bomb that forced the surrender. No revisionist history is going to change that fact.

Well, actually the Japanese did send an envoy (if I recall correctly it was the prince) to Russia after Hiroshima to inquire on terms of surrender. I have read that Stalin did not inform the allies because he wanted to see if the US had additional weapons. US might still have dropped the second nuke since the US/allied position was the Japanese surrender needed to be unconditional.

 

[EIF5A]

I love the comments about “greed” and constant pursuit of money.

Is it greed then that drives every Catholic institution to constantly hit me up for money? If I cannot let my greed drive my accumulation of wealth, how do I get the money to support all the requests for money from these greedy Catholic institutions?

Why is it Catholic elementary school tuition is $5K to $10K, high school tuition at $7K+ and Catholic college tuition at $30K or more? If that is not greed and punishing to Catholic families, I don’t know what is.

Greed is excessive desire for money.

Money itself is not evil.

Can you really not differentiate between charitable organizations and current corporate capitalism?

This conversation will clearly go nowhere.

Good day to you.

 

[bobcrawford]

You need only look at the debt of each country for proof. Look at Greece today. Look at the debt of our own country. It is over $100,000 for every man, woman and child. There is no way to repay it. Read, listen to the news. Greece is the problem now, but they state that Italy, Portugal, Spain, etc are in similar straits.

Constant handouts of food, now healthcare, housing, etc. without work, are bankrupting countries. People need to learn to work to get food, healthcare and housing. People need to support themselves. Sure we can help those down on their luck until they get back on their feet, but we now have multigenerational of families whose members have never worked a day in their lives. That is immoral. Yet, were is the Pope’s comments on those who fail to work?

BTW, what exactly does building wealth on the backs of the poor mean?

 

[bobcrawford]

Well, actually the Japanese did send an envoy (if I recall correctly it was the prince) to Russia after Hiroshima to inquire on terms of surrender. I have read that Stalin did not inform the allies because he wanted to see if the US had additional weapons. US might still have dropped the second nuke since the US/allied position was the Japanese surrender needed to be unconditional.

I inquired about a Corvette once. Didn’t buy it.

Inquiring is not commitment. Hence the second bomb which turned an inquiry into a commitment.

 

[bobcrawford]

OK, well not sure where you are from since you did not care to elaborate, but many European and South American countries are in a similar situation. Just a matter of time before it all collapses…just like Greece.

 

[bobcrawford]

No, that is not it at all. I actually think Revelations may be playing out right now and what I do know of Revelations, seems to be coming true. Widespread attacks on Christianity and Christians, people using the Word of God to accept sin, such as accepting homosexuality in the name of love, war, death, etc.

Of course I am sure some thought that of WWII, but we did not have the widespread attacks on Christians because of their faith then.

But remember charity is a two-way street. It is not fair or reasonable to say weapons manufacturers should not call themselves Christians either as that is not being charitable either. That is grouping everyone together and remember, we don’t judge a group by the actions of a few.

 

[crai7]

Switzerland is also a major manufacturer of arms/weapons.

Definitely.

 

[bobcrawford]

My mother is Irish. Ireland is very much heading to a situation similar to Greece.

My comments on the Pope are not “jibes” but observations that the Pope does not apply his attacks and criticisms of people equally. In other words, it is fair to talk about greed, but should also be tempered by an equal criticism of people who leech off society and do not work. In other words, balance the criticism. Without some greed, humans would not have achieved what we have achieved over the last 150 or so years. We’d still be living in shacks without electricity. Greed drives innovation and advanced. Hence why Communism and Socialism fails, like water, even the productive give up just as water tends to seek the common level. Instead of rising, water recedes, just like humans, the work ethic and the drive to be better.

BTW, wasn’t it your country - a primarily Catholic country (assuming you are not from the North) that went against the Pope’s teachings in order to accept homosexual marriage?

 

[bobcrawford]

Greed is excessive desire for money.

Money itself is not evil.

Can you really not differentiate between charitable organizations and current corporate capitalism?

This conversation will clearly go nowhere.

Good day to you.

Who is defining excessive? Your excessive may not be my excessive.

The one thing we agree on is that money is not evil.

Sure I can differentiate between a so-called charitable organization and a for-profit corporation. But can you?

When our Archbishop buys a $400,000 house with church funds (BTW, the community’s average house price for a family in that area is $300K and the house usually has four to five people living in it) instead of using the housing available to him at the cathedral, can you differentiate between wasting the money gifted to the Church in the name of charity and excessive unwarranted spending? It’s different when it is privately earned money. The Church spends money on big parish halls, big residences and other waste, while families are going broke trying to pay Catholic School tuition. Can YOU understand that difference?

 

[bobcrawford]

Great, Matthew was not referring the book known as Revelations. Not relevant to the discussion.