Pope speaks on priestly celibacy, populism in new interview [CWN]

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Pope Francis indicated that he is open to discussion of ordination for married men, in his latest published interview.

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Well, I suppose some of the apostles were married. The New Testament speaks of Christ curing Peter’s mother-in-law. Up until some point in history, the Roman Church had married priests. Celibacy is a discipline, though. So I can see the argument from that side, i.e. “if we allow that discipline to drop, where draw the line?”
 
Here we go again…😛

News outlets will now sound like they care.😉

MJ
 
Populism is evil?

I wonder if he would say the same about socialism

Ah well back to making more of that “devils dung”

Speaking of which guess i shouldnt commit to the bishops appeal anymore; dumping a load of devils dung would bring scandal.
 
Tbrightson said:
Populism is evil?

I wonder if he would say the same about socialism

Ah well back to making more of that “devils dung”

Speaking of which guess i shouldnt commit to the bishops appeal anymore; dumping a load of devils dung would bring scandal.
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“If I repeated some passages from the homilies of the Church Fathers in the second or third century, about how we must treat the poor, some would accuse me of giving a Marxist homily."

“I can only say that the communists have stolen our flag. The flag of the poor is Christian. Poverty is at the center of the Gospel.”

“It it has been said many times and my response has always been that, if anything, it is the communists who think like Christians.”

“Communists say that all this is communism. Sure, twenty centuries later. So when they speak, one can say to them: ‘but then you are Christian.’”

“Some people continue to defend trickle-down theories which assume that economic growth, encouraged by a free market, will inevitably succeed in bringing about greater justice and inclusiveness in the world. This opinion, which has never been confirmed by the facts, expresses a crude and naive trust in the goodness of those wielding economic power and in the sacralized workings of the prevailing economic system.”

“How I wish that Christians could kneel in veneration when a poor person enters the church.”

“Poverty is the great teaching that Jesus gave to us when he descended into the waters of the Jordan to be baptised by John the Baptist. He did not do so out of a need for penance, for conversion; He did so in order to be among the people, people in need of forgiveness, in the midst of us, sinners, in order to bear the burden of our sins.”
 
“It is communists who think like christians”

Wow, but no actually; i am not surprised

Millions of christians murdered for their
Faith by communists are spinning in their mass graves.
 
Tbrightson said:
“It is communists who think like christians”

Wow, but no actually; i am not surprised

Millions of christians murdered for their
Faith by communists are spinning in their mass graves.
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Who are these millions murdered for their faith?
 
icl.nd.edu/assets/84231/the_demographics_of_christian_martyrdom_todd_johnson.pdf

It says that most of the Russian Orthodox Church were most of the Christian “martyrs” and that 50 million Russian Christians have been killed by the Soviets. If that was so, wouldn’t the Russian Orthodox Church not be tacit regarding the legacy of Stalin and actually condemn him?

Moreover, there wasn’t even tens of millions of death in the Soviet penal system. It was about 1.2 million, and most of those deaths occurred during World War II. The claim that millions have died is impossible.
But even if we put at hundreds of thousands the casualties of the most chaotic period of collectivization (deaths in exile, rather than from starvation in the 1932 famine), plus later victims of different categories for which we have no data, it is unlikely that “custodial mortality” figures of the 1930s would reach 2 million: a huge number of “excess deaths” but far below most prevailing estimates. Although the figures we can document for deaths related to Soviet penal policy are rough and inexact, the available sources provide a reliable order of magnitude, at least for the pre-war period.
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Turning to executions and custodial deaths in the entire Stalin period, we know that, between 1934 and 1953, 1,053,829 persons died in the camps of the GULAG.
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Moreover, you have no evidence that a large proportion of those sent to the Gulag or executed in 1937-38 were sentenced because of their religious faith or that faith was a primary factor for being sentenced.
 
Latias said:
icl.nd.edu/assets/84231/the_demographics_of_christian_martyrdom_todd_johnson.pdf

It says that most of the Russian Orthodox Church were most of the Christian “martyrs” and that 50 million Russian Christians have been killed by the Soviets. If that was so, wouldn’t the Russian Orthodox Church not be tacit regarding the legacy of Stalin and actually condemn him?

Moreover, there wasn’t even tens of millions of death in the Soviet penal system. It was about 1.2 million, and most of those deaths occurred during World War II. The claim that millions have died is impossible.

Moreover, you have no evidence that a large proportion of those sent to the Gulag or executed in 1937-38 were sentenced because of their religious faith or that faith was a primary factor for being sentenced.
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Bless your heart. Next you will tell me the holodomor was all about a poor harvest.

“Its communists who think like christians” i wonder what JPII would think of that remark given he lived under communism.
 
Tbrightson said:
Bless your heart. Next you will tell me the holodomor was all about a poor harvest.

“Its communists who think like christians” i wonder what JPII would think of that remark given he lived under communism.
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Woltyja has no evidence that communists killed millions of Poles either.

Pope Francis lived in a different political environment and the communists were not the persecutors there.
As for the Holodomor, I have to be interested in the evidence regarding the “Holodomor” and the extent of Soviet political repression. Again, for the latter, the evidence simply does not support tens of millions of deaths. I don’t have any evidence that it was a genocide. There was no Holodomor at all! Just a Holod! I have no interest in supporting bad history or manufactured grievances.
 
Great Christian Thinkers…

I can see the new list now…

CS Lewis
Augustine
Bonhoeffer
Marx
Lenin
Stalin
Moa

:rotfl
 
I’ve come to understand, through the papacy of pope Francis how much different South American thought is from “western” thought.
The experiences and even the terminology is completely different. From capitalism to communism, even his comments on parenting reflect a culture many of us are not familiar with. It’s leading to a clash in the Church based on terminology and personal experiences of pontiffs. And that is not how our faith or theology works. St JPII would not have ever uttered those words. What a confusing time we live in!
 
The Pope’s warning about populism is spot on. I think it indirectly applies to Trump and some of his supporters. It is a dangerous movement. It has apparently hit home - I heard one of the major talk show hosts, a huge Trump/populism supporter, lash out at the Pope and Church today in reaction to the Pope’s comments. I suspect it was from inner guilt as he knows the Pope’s words are true. Catholics should peacefully resist this new populism in the US or in Europe. Wherever it is a threat.
 
JPUSC said:
“If I repeated some passages from the homilies of the Church Fathers in the second or third century, about how we must treat the poor, some would accuse me of giving a Marxist homily."

“I can only say that the communists have stolen our flag. The flag of the poor is Christian. Poverty is at the center of the Gospel.”

“It it has been said many times and my response has always been that, if anything, it is the communists who think like Christians.”

“Communists say that all this is communism. Sure, twenty centuries later. So when they speak, one can say to them: ‘but then you are Christian.’”

“Some people continue to defend trickle-down theories which assume that economic growth, encouraged by a free market, will inevitably succeed in bringing about greater justice and inclusiveness in the world. This opinion, which has never been confirmed by the facts, expresses a crude and naive trust in the goodness of those wielding economic power and in the sacralized workings of the prevailing economic system.”

“How I wish that Christians could kneel in veneration when a poor person enters the church.”

“Poverty is the great teaching that Jesus gave to us when he descended into the waters of the Jordan to be baptised by John the Baptist. He did not do so out of a need for penance, for conversion; He did so in order to be among the people, people in need of forgiveness, in the midst of us, sinners, in order to bear the burden of our sins.”
Click to expand...
All great and holy statements. Thanks for sharing them.
 
I’m confused…what is populism? The definition I found seems to define it as ‘defending the little guy’…
 
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