Power-point during Mass?

[Spiller]

According to our Bishop here in Calgary, the time to instruct people on the Mass is in RCIA classes and in Catechism or Religion classes, or else in a series of pamphlets included in the Bulletin or made available at the coffee hour. Not at the Mass itself.

That’s nice in theory and all but more times than not it’s ineffective and adults end-up receiving no catchesis at all.

When it comes to teaching, if I were a pastor I would give a 3 minute (and I mean a crafted/timed 3 minutes) lecture at every Sunday Mass right after the procession, just before beginning the Mass

Our Deacon got a thorough talking-to from the Bishop one time, for instructing a child on how to hold his hands to receive the Eucharist during a regular Sunday Mass. If this is forbidden, then surely a PowerPoint presentation must also be forbidden, no?

Why? I don’t understand your logic.

 

[jmcrae]

That’s nice in theory and all but more times than not it’s ineffective and adults end-up receiving no catchesis at all.

By their own choice.

When it comes to teaching, if I were a pastor I would give a 3 minute (and I mean a crafted/timed 3 minutes) lecture at every Sunday Mass right after the procession, just before beginning the Mass

This is not allowed.

Why? I don’t understand your logic.

He got dressed-down for “giving an instruction during Mass” (a forbidden activity) to one child, for about 10 seconds.

So, an instructional PowerPoint that runs within view of the entire congregation for the duration of the Mass must be an order of magnitude worse, don’t you think?

 

[Spiller]

By their own choice.

So? What sort of ludicrous response is that? Something is broken with the great majority of Catholic parishes in the USA – poor catechesis and/or non-existent catechesis. This has spawned an abject disinterest in all catechesis from much of the laity. Fixing this problem if the job of ALL Catholics from the Pope to the faithful in the pews.

This is not allowed.

Poppycock. The celebrant can most certainly take time to catechize the faithful before the Mass begins and it begins not with the procession but when he says “In the name of the…” and crosses himself.

He got dressed-down for “giving an instruction during Mass” (a forbidden activity) to one child, for about 10 seconds.

Again, so? This is not analogous to providing catechesis before the Mass begins or just before the dismissal.

It would take a great deal of work, but if a pastor prepared 3 minute lectures for a year, it would really help the spiritual foundations of many Catholics. It might even prepare them to make time for once-a-month catechetical sessions on Tuesday nights at 7 in the parish hall.

So, an instructional PowerPoint that runs within view of the entire congregation for the duration of the Mass must be an order of magnitude worse, don’t you think?

Not necessarily. For many people a PP aid would be of a great deal of help – if it was done correctly. Comments about bouncing balls and such are nothing more than hyperbole. That should NEVER happen.

 

[OutinChgoburbs]

One thing I have always thought would be cool is to put flat-panel LCDs in picture frames around a church. On any given feast/solemnity, scans of famous icons of the saint(s) of the day could be displayed with a few keystrokes. I think they would be FAR superior in many ways to static icons.

I find that idea interesting, actually…But it isn’t on topic. The topic has dissolved into something else entirely than what the OP asked. Why don’t you open a new thread for it?

 

[Brendan]

One thing I have always thought would be cool is to put flat-panel LCDs in picture frames around a church. On any given feast/solemnity, scans of famous icons of the saint(s) of the day could be displayed with a few keystrokes. I think they would be FAR superior in many ways to static icons.

Would that be a Roodscreen saver?

 

[PatrickJT914]

According to our Bishop here in Calgary, the time to instruct people on the Mass is in RCIA classes and in Catechism or Religion classes, or else in a series of pamphlets included in the Bulletin or made available at the coffee hour. Not at the Mass itself.

The Mass itself should (normally) proceed without announcement and without instructions. The only exceptions would be a special Mass held for children in Grade 2 who are being instructed in the rubrics of the Mass (with no one else present except their teachers and parents) and a similar “instructions Mass” for persons in the Period of Mystagogia, in the RCIA process - again, with nobody else present except their teachers and sponsors.

Our Deacon got a thorough talking-to from the Bishop one time, for instructing a child on how to hold his hands to receive the Eucharist during a regular Sunday Mass. If this is forbidden, then surely a PowerPoint presentation must also be forbidden, no?

Hello jmcrae,

So, let me get this straight. Every Protestant, non-Christians, wishing to convert and Catholics wishing to finish their sacramental initiation are filling up your RCIA classes to the point you have to turn them away. That also include Catechism and religion classes. I guess all the lapsed Catholics and the twice a year (Christmas and Easter) Catholics have all decided to return at once. They now attend every Sunday and Holy Day Masses. And because of this now go to Catechism and religion classes regularly.

I also would guess that everybody who works nights,weekends, or overtime. Have accumulated enough money to feed and clothe themselves and/or families. Then they can quit their job to attend religion classes. What about all people who play sports(adults and kids) have given up their activities. Is this starting to sound ridiculous? Of, course it is. People fall through the cracks. The Bishop should care for all his flock and sees to it that Cathoilcs get educated. Since his is the primary educator of his diocese.
He could make sure that as many Catholics as possible become educated in their faith. How can he do this? By utilizing technology of the 20th and 21st century. Television, radio, internet, text messaging, email, PowerPoint, magazine & newpaper ads, church pamphlets, parish telephone trees, bulk mailing,etc.(Of course depends on available funds) The Bishop would be following St. Paul’s comment, I became all things to all men, so I could save a few. Or another way the Bishop could say, “I used many methods of communication to educate as many as I could.” I’m sure the Bishop doesn’t want this OT passage to become true in his diocese. “My people perish for lack of knowledge.”

Education does not start or stop in a classroom or with a formal instructor. All moments can be teaching moments. That also includes Mass.

SIDE NOTE: 1st paragraph
I don’t know what the statistics are in Canada. But here in the States, a survey was done by the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life called U.S. Religious Landscape Survey. One of the areas they surveyed said that just 29% of Catholics said they participate in prayer groups, Scripture study sessions or other types of religious education on a regular basis, with just 13% doing so weekly and 16% participating monthly or yearly. Granted this survey only sampled 8,054 Catholics by phone, but it least gives some idea of where we as a church have to work on.

 

[PatrickJT914]

Once again, yet again-

The OP is not talking about parishes where PP is a regular part of the liturgical experience.

Hi OutinChgoburbs,

First off, congratulations on the Cubbies and the Sox leading their divisions. Is there are a good chance of an all Chicago World Series? Me I’m a Dodgers (ho hum, next year again?) and Angels fan.

You’re right about the OP going off the topic. But the header said “Power-point during Mass?” That sounded very general, maybe it should have said something more detailed. Example: When is it proper to play a Bishop’s PP? I don’t know just an idea.

I would like to apologize for being one of the ones to misdirect the thread. But it has lead to interesting comments on PP in general.

 

[PatrickJT914]

Isn’t a microphone a “worship aid”?

And how many times have we all been “distracted” by a feedback squeal, the Lector “popping their P’s” the priest forgetting to turn on or off his wireless microphone: “The body of Christ…The body of Christ…the body of Christ”.

Methinks technology can enhance the mass; it’s a matter of how reverently it can be accomplished. Personally, I prefer not to have any screens or projectors going during the mass, but I can see how it could be beneficial for some during a homily. During the Liturgy of the Eucharist…no.

Hi Newbie2,

Yes a microphone is a worship aid. There are plenty of others. Let me give you some examples:
-Vestments
-Candles
-Stautes
-Incense
-Music
-Holy Water fonts
-Sacred vessels
-Postures at Mass
-Tabernacle
-Crucifixes and crosses
-Altar
-Altar linens
-Flowers and plants
-Hymnals or song books
-Pews
-Bells
-Missals,Missalettes
-Ambo and lectern
-Lectionary and the Sacramentary
-Book of the Gospels
-Stained glass windows (Early form of PP)
-Baptismal Font
-Kneelers
-Communion rails
-Holy Oils
-Icons
-Stations of the Cross
-Lighting

These items have been introduced at various times in our 2000 years of Church history and tradition. Today we take them for granted. But can you image when some of these were first introduced to the people? What they may have said or felt?
Again PP done well might just be another worship aid that in time will part of the Mass that is taken for granted. Just like all the above-mentioned items.

 

[jmcrae]

Hello jmcrae,

So, let me get this straight. Every Protestant, non-Christians, wishing to convert and Catholics wishing to finish their sacramental initiation are filling up your RCIA classes to the point you have to turn them away.

The law has nothing to do with how many people are showing up for Catechetical instruction. The law is in place to preserve the Mass as an undiluted act of worship, without adding in things that detract from worship, such as educational moments, or business/financial presentations, etc…

The Mass is the central act of worship of the Church. The fact that it’s a “handy” moment when the whole congregation tends to be present does not thereby cause it to become an appropriate time to do catechesis, or to do Church business. We have other venues for these activities.

 

[PatrickJT914]

Are you sure that the Mass is not a place for teaching?

What do you think of these two examples?

" The Liturgy instructs us in the Faith, for the Church teaches as she sanctifies. In the Liturgy God speaks to His people and Christ is still proclaiming His Gospel."
Vatican 2- Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, #33

“the ordinary and privileged teaching of the Church is given in the Liturgy” Pope Pius XI

 

[jmcrae]

Are you sure that the Mass is not a place for teaching?

What do you think of these two examples?

" The Liturgy instructs us in the Faith, for the Church teaches as she sanctifies. In the Liturgy God speaks to His people and Christ is still proclaiming His Gospel."
Vatican 2- Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, #33

“the ordinary and privileged teaching of the Church is given in the Liturgy” Pope Pius XI

According to my Bishop, Catechesis is to take place in the classroom - no where else - and certainly not in the Church during Mass.

If, while worshipping, you happen also to learn something, that’s a different story. But the Mass should not be hijacked and turned into a Catechism class, or into a business meeting.

 

[PatrickJT914]

According to my Bishop, Catechesis is to take place in the classroom - no where else - and certainly not in the Church during Mass.

If, while worshipping, you happen also to learn something, that’s a different story. But the Mass should not be hijacked and turned into a Catechism class, or into a business meeting.

YOUR Bishop said so, Oh really and he represents the Pope and all the worlds Bishops. Then Jesus and others who have taught in open fields, caves, and other places were wrong or maybe their teaching was in error. Learning happens anywhere.

Have you read all my posts?

 

[jmcrae]

YOUR Bishop said so, Oh really and he represents the Pope and all the worlds Bishops. Then Jesus and others who have taught in open fields, caves, and other places were wrong or maybe their teaching was in error.

What are you babbling about? Jesus set up certain places as classrooms, and then used them for teaching in.

He also set up the Upper Room as a space for worship, and held the first Mass in it.

What activity is the space set up for? Do that activity in it. It’s very simple.

Learning happens anywhere.

This has nothing to do with hijacking the Mass for a teaching opportunity.

Have you read all my posts?

Yes. You seem to be under the impression that the purpose of going to Mass is to learn something.

No. The purpose of going to Mass is to connect your heart to God’s heart, and to worship Him.

 

[Tsuwano]

YOUR Bishop said so, Oh really and he represents the Pope and all the worlds Bishops. Then Jesus and others who have taught in open fields, caves, and other places were wrong or maybe their teaching was in error. Learning happens anywhere.

Have you read all my posts?

I’m afraid I have to agree with jmcrae and his Bishop on this one. It’s true that learning may happen anywhere, but instruction shouldn’t. An instructor who waited until his driver’s education pupil was flying down the highway at 80 miles an hour before instructing him how to use the brake wouldn’t be much of a teacher. The pupil may indeed learn how to use the brake on his own at that time, but that certainly isn’t the place where he should learn it. The same is true for the liturgy. The priest shouldn’t, and good priests don’t, stop the progression of the liturgy to explain to the gathered faithful the theology behind his actions on the altar, even though many may not know the theology at all. The instruction, or catechism, is taught elsewhere. Still, you’re right when you say that teaching occurs during the liturgy, but that is because the liturgy itself is the main catechetical work of the Church. The liturgy itself is not a teaching, but the teaching. It is not a means of teaching, but that which is in itself taught. It is through the act of worship that we come to know the Lord. Any instruction that needs to be given to the gathered assembly that is not part of the worship service should be done at some other time than during the sacrifice of the liturgy. A power point presentation does not strike me as a proper means of facilitating worship during the liturgy. This doesn’t mean that it is not appropriate in some forms of worship, say a prayer meeting or a Protestant service (my Protestant friends would have to let me know about that), but I don’t think it is appropriate during a Catholic celebration of the Mass. Again, I would like to hear the opinion of a professional liturgist on this.

 

[PatrickJT914]

What do you guys think of this?

Catechism of the Catholic Church
The Celebration of the Christian Mystery
Catechesis and Liturgy

#1074 “The liturgy is the summit toward which the activity of the Church is directed; it is also the font from which all her power flows.” It is therefore the privileged place for catechizing
the People of God. " Catechesis is intrinsically linked with the whole of liturgical and sacramental activity, for it is in the sacraments, especially in the Eucharist, that Christ Jesus works in fullness for the transformation of men."

I’m asking because I didn’t want to put a personal opinion on it.

 

[jmcrae]

What do you guys think of this?

Catechism of the Catholic Church
The Celebration of the Christian Mystery
Catechesis and Liturgy

#1074 “The liturgy is the summit toward which the activity of the Church is directed; it is also the font from which all her power flows.” It is therefore the privileged place for catechizing
the People of God. " Catechesis is intrinsically linked with the whole of liturgical and sacramental activity, for it is in the sacraments, especially in the Eucharist, that Christ Jesus works in fullness for the transformation of men."

I’m asking because I didn’t want to put a personal opinion on it.

I believe that this is in the sense that the Sacrament itself does the Catechizing; not that someone should be standing up there saying, “Okay, now boys and girls, we see that the priest is walking up the aisle,” and doing a slide show on walking up the aisle, or whatever. (Unless it is specifically a teaching Mass for children in Grade 2, of course. But normally, no.)

 

[Jonathan_Cid]

Wow, someone mentioned that Bishops are sending out videos to “lay down the line”, however, I think it does distract from the Holy Mass, playing videos and what-not, and it takes the laity’s minds away from the Holy Sacrifice to something “away” from the Mass.

How exactly would you even set up screens and projectors in a chapel, a place for simple prayer and contemplation?

 

[Mea_Culpa]

Yes, PP is a worship aid.

AID- means Act or result of helping; assistance.
Noun: money, equipment or services provided for people in need; assistance.

That is what we are supposed to do as Catholics is to love and help others. It is also part of the “TRADITIONAL” Spiritual Works of Mercy.

INSTRUCT THE IGNORANT

For those of who get easily distracted, you must get bored very quickly. Because maybe you won’t admit to yourselves, that you find Mass boring. Which it is sometimes. Let’s be truthful. Jesus said that he would rather have us hot or cold, than luke warm anything else he’ll spit us out of his mouth.( It’s in scripture)

The part in red says it all. Mass is not “boring” if you know what is going on. Is the reading of the Word of God boring? Is the re-creation of the sacrifice of Calvary boring? Having a light show going on during the sacred liturgy is sacrilege and profanation - it’s something people who think the Mass is “boring” would come up with to “spice it up.”

Maybe we should put the whole thing in music video format - dancing girls, scene cuts every .8 seconds, lots of bass - and show that on the screens! Let’s get this party started! We’re never going to reach people with boring old readings and hosts and vestments. Let’s get with the spirit of the times - some hip hop, rapping the eucharistic prayer, multiple screens to play the videos on, laser light show.

 

[Jonathan_Cid]

I agree with Mea Culpa - why would you add something to the Holy Mass that is unecessary and doesn’t actually add to the Mass? Something not in line with focus on the Mass? In doing so you’re essentially taking away from the Holy Mass.

 

[OutinChgoburbs]

Wow, someone mentioned that Bishops are sending out videos to “lay down the line”, however, I think it does distract from the Holy Mass, playing videos and what-not, and it takes the laity’s minds away from the Holy Sacrifice to something “away” from the Mass.

How exactly would you even set up screens and projectors in a chapel, a place for simple prayer and contemplation?

Not exactly “lay down the line” but to keep a bishop’s pastoral- which you may not have in a gnostic church- from being read wrong or misinterpretted. The information needs to stay*** uniform*** as much as possible. To ensure this, some bishops send out DVDs of themselves deivering their pastoral, or their team comes and delivers a PP presentation that has been passworded so it is not changed.

In the case of my last parish, I shot it to the right of the altar on a big blank piece of wall. This was not a regular occurence, once a year. It is not an addition to the Mass, but after the blessing and before the last hymn. It is allowed in GIRM, which I gather you also do not have in your gnostic, liberal church.