Pray for Abdul Rahmen

[inJESUS]

**a time will come when anyone who puts you to death will claim to be serving God! All this they will do to you because they knew neither the Father nor me. But I have told you these things that when their hour comes, you may remember my telling you of them." **

Lord Jesus, we remember and will endure the anti-Christ and his satanic teachings

 

[inJESUS]

Shadowcry:

What about the Ethinkoi who were persecuted by imperial Christian rome. its not that different.

would you stop you bla bla? persecuting and killing apostates is not Christian…killing apostates is in islam not Christianity.

 

[Shadowcry]

Very hypocritcal Injesus. If this is what the forum is coming to then I will gladly not be a part of it. You spouting nonsense while notr listening to what others have to say is ridiculous.

 

[inJESUS]

Eden:

Can the Muslims here tell us if you believe converting from Islam to Christianity should be punishable by death or do you join us in condemning such a sentence?

they cannot condemn this atrocity when their prophet allowed it:

        "Prophet, make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal rigorously with them.  Hell shall be their home:  an evil fire.  They swear by God that they said nothing.  Yet they uttered the word of unbelief and renounced Islam after embracing it.  They sought to do what they could not attain.  Yet they had no reason to be spiteful except perhaps because God and His apostle had enriched them through His bounty.  If they repent, it will indeed be better for them, but if they give no heed, God will sternly punish them, both in this world and in the world to come.  They shall have none on this earth to protect or help them."

Bukhari, volume 9, #17

        "Narrated Abdullah:  Allah's Messenger said, "The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Messenger, cannot be shed except in three cases:  in Qisas (equality in punishment) for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (Apostate) and leaves the Muslims."

If they condemn it, they negate their prophet. To be more human is to be agaisnt their deity.

 

[inJESUS]

Shadowcry:

Very hypocritcal Injesus. If this is what the forum is coming to then I will gladly not be a part of it. You spouting nonsense while notr listening to what others have to say is ridiculous.

how can we help the guy? is an apostate to be killed or not in islam? maybe we are mistaken so can you enlighten us in order to know how to deal with such situations please?

 

[inJESUS]

i found this so far:

The Hanafites: When the Muslim falls away from Islam – may Allah forbid it! – he is first asked to return. If he has doubts, he is to express them; one can then clear up his doubts, for it may be that he truly has questions with regard to the faith – questions in need of explanation. By this it is possible to deal with his evil deed (sharr) through the best of two possibilities: death or the acceptance of Islam. However, it remains desirable to offer him the acceptance of Islam again, although this is not obligatory, because the message had already been offered him once.

If he needs time to reconsider, it is desirable that the judge allow him a three-day extension, during which he is to remain in custody. If he accepts Islam thereafter, it is good; if not, he is to be killed, for Allah says to “kill those who believe in many gods” (Sura al-Tawba 9:5), without fixing a deadline. The Prophet also said, “Kill him who changes his religion,” without mentioning a delay, because the apostate is surely a hostile unbeliever and no asylum seeker (musta’min) who has asked for protection; furthermore, he is no dhimmi (a non-Muslim under Islamic rule), for no poll tax is demanded of him. Therefore, he should be killed without reservation
light-of-life.com/eng/ilaw/

 

[Mike_D30]

Shadowcry:

What about the Ethinkoi who were persecuted by imperial Christian rome. its not that different.

How long ago was that? This man is still alive, and facing execution. Again no Muslim has come forward to condemn the action, nor state Afghanistan is wrong for this action. All we get is Red Herring’s and glib remarks like “he should move to the west”. Religion of peace?

 

[inJESUS]

Mike_D30:

How long ago was that? This man is still alive, and facing execution. Again no Muslim has come forward to condemn the action, nor state Afghanistan is wrong for this action. All we get is Red Herring’s and glib remarks like “he should move to the west”. Religion of peace?

they know it’s agaisnt humanity and human right, but they cant say mohammad is wrong even if he is.

The prescribed punishment for a murtadd:

If a sane person who has reached puberty voluntarily apostatizes from Islam, he deserves to be punished.‏ In such a case, it is obligatory for the caliph (or his representative) to ask him to repent and return to Islam. If he does, it is accepted from him, but if he refuses, he is immediately killed

islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-Ask_Scholar/FatwaE/FatwaE&cid=1119503544134 : FATWA.

 

[inJESUS]

Lily might start a petition…please all join in in case a petition is put…

 

[brotherhrolf]

Shadowcry:

What about the Ethinkoi who were persecuted by imperial Christian rome. its not that different.

Who? Never heard of them! Imperial Christian Rome only lasted a hundred years or so (310 AD to 450 AD) and in all my studies and readings I’ve never heard of them which tells me it was some isolated situation out on the edges of the empire. So please, enlighten me and tell me why they are more important than the Ostrogoths, Visigoths, Vandals, Angles, Saxons, Frisians, Franks, Gepids ad infinitum which were plaguing the Empire at that time.

 

[Shadowcry]

People aren’t more important than other people. THe Ethnikoi were the people who practised the original greek religion.

 

[Mike_D30]

Shadowcry:

People aren’t more important than other people. THe Ethnikoi were the people who practised the original greek religion.

What does this have to do with the topic at hand?

You are the worst form of debater, you have no leg to stand on so you start throwing our red herring’s.

Now answer, is it wrong for Afghanistan to execute a man for converting to Christianity and not revert to Islam?

 

[pro_universal]

I see more of the same here:

If a country that is populated by muslims does something bad, it speaks for all muslims!

If someone brings up an example of a christian doing something bad, “he/she was not following christianity.”

And if there’s an example of muslims doing something good: “they’re not following islam.”

If someone has a meter for hypocrisy, he’d best keep it away from this thread, or it will break from overactivity.

 

[Mike_D30]

pro_universal:

I see more of the same here:

If a country that is populated by muslims does something bad, it speaks for all muslims!

If someone brings up an example of a christian doing something bad, “he/she was not following christianity.”

And if there’s an example of muslims doing something good: “they’re not following islam.”

If someone has a meter for hypocrisy, he’d best keep it away from this thread, or it will break from overactivity.

Oh please, talking about something Christians did 1700 years ago has no bearing in this topic, it’s a means to divert the topic into something else. This is now a man is still alive awaiting execution, stop with the nonsense.

 

[pro_universal]

Mike_D30:

What does this have to do with the topic at hand?

You are the worst form of debater, you have no leg to stand on so you start throwing our red herring’s.

Now answer, is it wrong for Afghanistan to execute a man for converting to Christianity and not revert to Islam?

Yes. Now here’s the more pressing question for us in the west:

Is it hypocritical for us to disown every bad thing christians do, while demanding that the whole religion of Islam own every bad thing a muslim does?

 

[inJESUS]

pro_universal:

I see more of the same here:

If a country that is populated by muslims does something bad, it speaks for all muslims!

If someone brings up an example of a christian doing something bad, “he/she was not following christianity.”

And if there’s an example of muslims doing something good: “they’re not following islam.”

If someone has a meter for hypocrisy, he’d best keep it away from this thread, or it will break from overactivity.

do you condone killing apostates as your prophet said?

 

[Mike_D30]

pro_universal:

Yes. Now here’s the more pressing question for us in the west:

Is it hypocritical for us to disown every bad thing christians do, while demanding that the whole religion of Islam own every bad thing a muslim does?

Start a new thread and stop derailing this one, this one is about a Christian man about to be summarily executed for converting. Your tricks are tired seriously either stay on topic (although you can’t because the main topic is indefensible, so you do the next best thing, demonize Christians to try to prove a non-point.) or start a new thread.

 

[inJESUS]

pro_universal:

Yes. Now here’s the more pressing question for us in the west:

Is it hypocritical for us to disown every bad thing christians do, while demanding that the whole religion of Islam own every bad thing a muslim does?

the thread is about killing apostates: good or not according to you?

 

[pro_universal]

Mike_D30:

Start a new thread and stop derailing this one, this one is about a Christian man about to be summarily executed for converting. Your tricks are tired seriously either stay on topic (although you can’t because the main topic is indefensible, so you do the next best thing, demonize Christians to try to prove a non-point.) or start a new thread.

Face it, this thread is about bashing Islam like every other one cestusdei posts on this forum.

The point is not to demonize Christians. The point is to make clear how blazingly hypocritical it is to demand that all muslims take responsibility for crimes like the one against this Abdul Rahman, while simultaneously denying that Christianity is responsible for any crime at all.

Just 20 years ago, there was a whole Church group preaching that blacks were meant to be subdued and that Christianity supported Apartheid. Of course, if someone brings up an example like that, you all say “But they weren’t following Jesus!”

In contrast, when examples of crimes by muslims like the one above are posted, and a muslim comes to say “This is not following Islam!,” half the board pounces on him and says “OH YES IT IS ISLAM! You must take responsibility for this! This is your teaching!”

That is hypocrisy, pure and simple.

 

[LilyM]

pro_universal:

I see more of the same here:

If a country that is populated by muslims does something bad, it speaks for all muslims!

If someone brings up an example of a christian doing something bad, “he/she was not following christianity.”

And if there’s an example of muslims doing something good: “they’re not following islam.”

If someone has a meter for hypocrisy, he’d best keep it away from this thread, or it will break from overactivity.

pro, I am an active member of Amnesty International and have campaigned over many years for the human rights of people of many nationalities and religions - including Muslims in Aceh Indonesia who are seeking independence and the right to practice their religion as they see fit.

Don’t assume that I or others on this forum are necessarily bigoted. I’m sure most of us would go to the defence of a Muslim if they were also threatened with execution simply for peacefully and harmlessly practicing their religion.

I freely admit that I am far from knowing everything there is to know about Islam. It does seem easy, though, to distinguish between Mohammed, who undoubtedly was a warrior himself, and appears to endorse it in some of the Quran passages, and Jesus, who never even responded to violence against his own person and nowhere appears to endorse it in any fashion, even though Christians have been violent in his name.