Pray, study, listen to conscience, pope says about eucharistic sharing

[gilliam]

ROME (CNS) — When a Lutheran woman married to a Catholic man asked Pope Francis what she and her husband could do to receive Communion together, the pope said he could not issue a general rule on shared Communion, but the couple should pray, study and then act according to their consciences.

“I would never dare to give permission for this because it is not in my authority,” the pope told Anke de Bernardinis after a lengthy response about the faith Catholics and Lutherans share and the ecumenical goal of full unity.

cnstopstories.com/2015/11/16/pray-study-listen-to-conscience-pope-says-about-eucharistic-sharing/

 

[AFerri48]

More cryptic responses to receiving communion?

 

[Louie1983]

The Pope asks the question of eucharistic inter communion and says he doesn’t know how to respond.

Holy father, the church has responded. As the article points out:

*"In general, the Catholic Church teaches that in most cases, only Catholics free from mortal sin may receive the Eucharist at Mass, although members of the Orthodox churches also may receive in special circumstances.

According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church, “Ecclesial communities derived from the Reformation and separated from the Catholic Church, ‘have not preserved the proper reality of the eucharistic mystery in its fullness, especially because of the absence of the sacrament of holy orders.’ It is for this reason that eucharistic intercommunion with these communities is not possible for the Catholic Church.”

The Code of Canon Law, however, does envision a narrow set of circumstances in which eucharistic sharing is possible “if the danger of death is present or if, in the judgment of the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops, some other grave necessity urges it,” as long as the non-Catholic party shares the Catholic belief in the meaning of the Eucharist."*

I’m starting to really fear for where all this is going.

 

[Trad_Catholic27]

Louie Christ will not allow any chqnges to receiveing Holy Communion in a state of Grace this is an unchangeable teaching be at peace

 

[phil19034]

I think the key here is this:

“I would never dare to give permission for this because it is not in my authority”

He is saying he does not have the authority from God to say yes.

I believe the Pope feels that Evangelization before Catechesis is important.

He’s saying “study.” If a couple studies why the Church says no to inter-communion, most people are going to understand and refrain. They might disagree, but most will understand why. And if they refuse to refrain, they MAY or MAY NOT be mortally culpable.

Again, I believe that Pope Francis’ mission is to bring non-practicing Catholics home and to force non-Catholics to take another look at the Catholic Church.

I don’t think his mission is really focused on practicing Catholics.

 

[Louie1983]

Louie Christ will not allow any chqnges to receiveing Holy Communion in a state of Grace this is an unchangeable teaching be at peace

100% agree with you Trad…

I just want the Holy Father to say it as you just have.

Not say “I don’t have the authority” on one hand, but on the other “Let your conscience decide”.

It causes confusion.

 

[LongingSoul]

100% agree with you Trad…

I just want the Holy Father to say it as you just have.

Not say “I don’t have the authority” on one hand, but on the other “Let your conscience decide”.

It causes confusion.

Pope Francis is much easier to understand if you are familiar with the Ignatian spiritual tradition of prayer, contemplation and discerning Gods will in being present to the gospels and the life of Jesus. One of the greatest of Gods gifts to us is ‘free will’. God wants us to get to know Him, the Father, and love Him. He just doesn’t want people to be in a place of stagnant ritual like the Pharisees were in. Pope Francis in my opinion is slowly teaching people Ignatian spirituality.

 

[dmar198]

100% agree with you Trad…

I just want the Holy Father to say it as you just have.

Not say “I don’t have the authority” on one hand, but on the other “Let your conscience decide”.

It causes confusion.

The news article didn’t cite any words from the Holy Father regarding conscience. They Said he mentioned praying and then following your conscience, but they didn’t quote him on that point. I would like to see what he said about conscience in context.

 

[sarah_j]

The news article didn’t cite any words from the Holy Father regarding conscience. They Said he mentioned praying and then following your conscience, but they didn’t quote him on that point. I would like to see what he said about conscience in context.

Here are the Pope’s comments in context.


Question: My name is Anke de Bernardinis and, like many people in our community, I’m married to an Italian, who is a Roman Catholic Christian. We’ve lived happily together for many years, sharing joys and sorrows. And so we greatly regret being divided in faith and not being able to participate in the Lord’s Supper together. What can we do to achieve, finally, communion on this point?

Pope Francis: The question on sharing the Lord’s Supper isn’t easy for me to respond to, above all in front of a theologian like Cardinal Kasper! I’m scared!
I think of how the Lord told us when he gave us this command to “do this in memory of me,” and when we share the Lord’s Supper, we recall and we imitate the same as the Lord. And there will be the Lord’s Supper, there will be the eternal banquet in the new Jerusalem, but that will be the last one. In the meantime, I ask myself — and don’t know how to respond — what you’re asking me, I ask myself the question. To share the Lord’s banquet: is it the goal of the path or is it the viaticum [provisions] for walking together? I leave that question to the theologians and those who understand.

It’s true that in a certain sense, to share means there aren’t differences between us, that we have the same doctrine – underscoring that word, a difficult word to understand — but I ask myself: but don’t we have the same Baptism? If we have the same Baptism, shouldn’t we be walking together? You’re a witness also of a profound journey, a journey of marriage: a journey really of the family and human love and of a shared faith, no? We have the same Baptism.

When you feel yourself to be a sinner – and I feel more of a sinner – when your husband feels a sinner, you go to the Lord and ask forgiveness; your husband does the same and also goes to the priest and asks absolution. I’m healed to keep alive the Baptism. When you pray together, that Baptism grows, becomes stronger. When you teach your kids who Jesus is, why Jesus came, what Jesus did for us, you’re doing the same thing, whether in the Lutheran language or the Catholic one, but it’s the same. The question: and the [Lord’s] Supper? There are questions that, only if one is sincere with oneself and with the little theological light one has, must be responded to on one’s own. See for yourself. This is my body. This is my blood. Do it in remembrance of me – this is a viaticum that helps us to journey on.

I once had a great friendship with an Episcopalian bishop who went a little wrong – he was 48 years old, married, two children. This was a discomfort to him – a Catholic wife, Catholic children, him a bishop. He accompanied his wife and children to Mass on Sunday, and then went to worship with his community. It was a step of participation in the Lord’s Supper. Then he went forward, the Lord called him, a just man. To your question, I can only respond with a question: what can I do with my husband, because the Lord’s Supper accompanies me on my path?
It’s a problem each must answer, but a pastor-friend once told me: “We believe that the Lord is present there, he is present. You all believe that the Lord is present. And so what’s the difference?” — “Eh, there are explanations, interpretations.” Life is bigger than explanations and interpretations. Always refer back to your baptism. “One faith, one baptism, one Lord.” This is what Paul tells us, and then take the consequences from there. I wouldn’t ever dare to allow this, because it’s not my competence. One baptism, one Lord, one faith. Talk to the Lord and then go forward. I don’t dare to say anything more.

Read more: ncregister.com/blog/edward-pentin/pope-tells-lutheran-to-talk-to-the-lord-about-receiving-eucharist/#ixzz3rhbz7q6F

 

[sarah_j]

Why didn’t the Pope just tell her that if she wants to receive Holy Communion
with her Catholic husband that she can become a Catholic?

 

[LongingSoul]

Why didn’t the Pope just tell her that if she wants to receive Holy Communion
with her Catholic husband that she can become a Catholic?

He is facilitating the ‘synodal Church’ by being a listener for the time being. Do you remember his speech at the opening of the synod in October?

The pope’s address received a standing ovation from some 300 bishops and others who were attending the October Synod on the Family. His key points are here:

– A synodal church is a listening church. Listening begins with the “people of God,” who as a whole cannot err in matters of belief. That’s why the Synod on the Family was preceded by a worldwide consultation with local Catholic churches.

“The ‘sensus fidei’ (sense of the faith) makes it impossible to rigidly separate between the ‘teaching church’ and the ‘learning church,’ because even the flock has a ‘nose’ for discerning the new roads the Lord is opening for the church,” the pope said.

– The synod itself should be a time of “mutual listening” between the people of God, the bishops and the pope. But the pope’s role is unique.

“The synodal path culminates in listening to the bishop of Rome, who is called to pronounce as ‘pastor and teacher of all Christians,’ not on the basis of his personal convictions but as the supreme witness of the faith of the whole church, the guarantor of the church’s obedience to and conformity to the will of God, to the Gospel of Christ and to the Tradition of the church,” he said.

– In a synodal church, the hierarchy is, in a sense, flipped over like an inverted pyramid: those with the “highest” positions are at the bottom, in service to the rest. That means being in touch with the everyday problems of the people.

The pope said the church has only partially understood how regional and national bishops’ conferences should function in this synodal understanding of the church. But he said it’s clear that a “healthy decentralization is needed,” because the pope cannot substitute for local bishops in dealing with all local problems.

– The role of the pope and the concept of papal primacy still need to be fully developed.

“The pope does not stand alone above the church, but inside it as a baptized person among the baptized, and inside the episcopal college as a bishop among bishops, called at the same time, as the successor of the Apostle Peter, to guide the church of Rome which presides in love over all the churches,” he said.

vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en/the-vatican/detail/articolo/44045/

 

[dmar198]

Here are the Pope’s comments in context.


Question: My name is Anke de Bernardinis and, like many people in our community, I’m married to an Italian, who is a Roman Catholic Christian. We’ve lived happily together for many years, sharing joys and sorrows. And so we greatly regret being divided in faith and not being able to participate in the Lord’s Supper together. What can we do to achieve, finally, communion on this point?

Pope Francis: The question on sharing the Lord’s Supper isn’t easy for me to respond to, above all in front of a theologian like Cardinal Kasper! I’m scared!
I think of how the Lord told us when he gave us this command to “do this in memory of me,” and when we share the Lord’s Supper, we recall and we imitate the same as the Lord. And there will be the Lord’s Supper, there will be the eternal banquet in the new Jerusalem, but that will be the last one. In the meantime, I ask myself — and don’t know how to respond — what you’re asking me, I ask myself the question. To share the Lord’s banquet: is it the goal of the path or is it the viaticum [provisions] for walking together? I leave that question to the theologians and those who understand.

It’s true that in a certain sense, to share means there aren’t differences between us, that we have the same doctrine – underscoring that word, a difficult word to understand — but I ask myself: but don’t we have the same Baptism? If we have the same Baptism, shouldn’t we be walking together? You’re a witness also of a profound journey, a journey of marriage: a journey really of the family and human love and of a shared faith, no? We have the same Baptism.

When you feel yourself to be a sinner – and I feel more of a sinner – when your husband feels a sinner, you go to the Lord and ask forgiveness; your husband does the same and also goes to the priest and asks absolution. I’m healed to keep alive the Baptism. When you pray together, that Baptism grows, becomes stronger. When you teach your kids who Jesus is, why Jesus came, what Jesus did for us, you’re doing the same thing, whether in the Lutheran language or the Catholic one, but it’s the same. The question: and the [Lord’s] Supper? There are questions that, only if one is sincere with oneself and with the little theological light one has, must be responded to on one’s own. See for yourself. This is my body. This is my blood. Do it in remembrance of me – this is a viaticum that helps us to journey on.

I once had a great friendship with an Episcopalian bishop who went a little wrong – he was 48 years old, married, two children. This was a discomfort to him – a Catholic wife, Catholic children, him a bishop. He accompanied his wife and children to Mass on Sunday, and then went to worship with his community. It was a step of participation in the Lord’s Supper. Then he went forward, the Lord called him, a just man. To your question, I can only respond with a question: what can I do with my husband, because the Lord’s Supper accompanies me on my path?
It’s a problem each must answer, but a pastor-friend once told me: “We believe that the Lord is present there, he is present. You all believe that the Lord is present. And so what’s the difference?” — “Eh, there are explanations, interpretations.” Life is bigger than explanations and interpretations. Always refer back to your baptism. “One faith, one baptism, one Lord.” This is what Paul tells us, and then take the consequences from there. I wouldn’t ever dare to allow this, because it’s not my competence. One baptism, one Lord, one faith. Talk to the Lord and then go forward. I don’t dare to say anything more.

Read more: ncregister.com/blog/edward-pentin/pope-tells-lutheran-to-talk-to-the-lord-about-receiving-eucharist/#ixzz3rhbz7q6F

Thank you. This sounds much better than the article made it sound. If that translation is accurate, the Holy Father did not say to decide for yourself, he said he cannot allow it, and he said that to share Communion means having the same doctrine, the question itself asked how to achieve full Communion, and he said that we should pray to the Lord about how to go forward. That is very different from saying we should just ask Jesus what to do if we want to receive Communion and then do that.

Why didn’t the Pope just tell her that if she wants to receive Holy Communion with her Catholic husband that she can become a Catholic?

There is evidence that he was suggesting that in a subtle way. First, the woman asked what she and her husband could to achieve communion, and the pope said pray to the Lord and go forward. That sounds like he is saying to pray for union and then pursue union. And also, he gave the example of the Episcopalian bishop, which, to me, sounded like the story of a convert, who began taking his Catholic children and wife to Mass and then eventually was “called by the Lord” himself. I don’t think the pope is talking about going up to Communion as an Anglican in that passage, but about becoming a Catholic. If anyone has any info about that, I’d be happy to find out more.

 

[Louie1983]

Here are the Pope’s comments in context.


Question: My name is Anke de Bernardinis and, like many people in our community, I’m married to an Italian, who is a Roman Catholic Christian. We’ve lived happily together for many years, sharing joys and sorrows. And so we greatly regret being divided in faith and not being able to participate in the Lord’s Supper together. What can we do to achieve, finally, communion on this point?

Pope Francis: The question on sharing the Lord’s Supper isn’t easy for me to respond to, above all in front of a theologian like Cardinal Kasper! I’m scared!
I think of how the Lord told us when he gave us this command to “do this in memory of me,” and when we share the Lord’s Supper, we recall and we imitate the same as the Lord. And there will be the Lord’s Supper, there will be the eternal banquet in the new Jerusalem, but that will be the last one. In the meantime, I ask myself — and don’t know how to respond — what you’re asking me, I ask myself the question. To share the Lord’s banquet: is it the goal of the path or is it the viaticum [provisions] for walking together? I leave that question to the theologians and those who understand.

It’s true that in a certain sense, to share means there aren’t differences between us, that we have the same doctrine – underscoring that word, a difficult word to understand — but I ask myself: but don’t we have the same Baptism? If we have the same Baptism, shouldn’t we be walking together? You’re a witness also of a profound journey, a journey of marriage: a journey really of the family and human love and of a shared faith, no? We have the same Baptism.

When you feel yourself to be a sinner – and I feel more of a sinner – when your husband feels a sinner, you go to the Lord and ask forgiveness; your husband does the same and also goes to the priest and asks absolution. I’m healed to keep alive the Baptism. When you pray together, that Baptism grows, becomes stronger. When you teach your kids who Jesus is, why Jesus came, what Jesus did for us, you’re doing the same thing, whether in the Lutheran language or the Catholic one, but it’s the same. The question: and the [Lord’s] Supper? There are questions that, only if one is sincere with oneself and with the little theological light one has, must be responded to on one’s own. See for yourself. This is my body. This is my blood. Do it in remembrance of me – this is a viaticum that helps us to journey on.

I once had a great friendship with an Episcopalian bishop who went a little wrong – he was 48 years old, married, two children. This was a discomfort to him – a Catholic wife, Catholic children, him a bishop. He accompanied his wife and children to Mass on Sunday, and then went to worship with his community. It was a step of participation in the Lord’s Supper. Then he went forward, the Lord called him, a just man. To your question, I can only respond with a question: what can I do with my husband, because the Lord’s Supper accompanies me on my path?
It’s a problem each must answer, but a pastor-friend once told me: “We believe that the Lord is present there, he is present. You all believe that the Lord is present. And so what’s the difference?” — “Eh, there are explanations, interpretations.” Life is bigger than explanations and interpretations. Always refer back to your baptism. “One faith, one baptism, one Lord.” This is what Paul tells us, and then take the consequences from there. I wouldn’t ever dare to allow this, because it’s not my competence. One baptism, one Lord, one faith. Talk to the Lord and then go forward. I don’t dare to say anything more.

Read more: ncregister.com/blog/edward-pentin/pope-tells-lutheran-to-talk-to-the-lord-about-receiving-eucharist/#ixzz3rhbz7q6F

Thank you.

 

[Louie1983]

Pope Francis is much easier to understand if you are familiar with the Ignatian spiritual tradition of prayer, contemplation and discerning Gods will in being present to the gospels and the life of Jesus. One of the greatest of Gods gifts to us is ‘free will’. God wants us to get to know Him, the Father, and love Him. He just doesn’t want people to be in a place of stagnant ritual like the Pharisees were in. Pope Francis in my opinion is slowly teaching people Ignatian spirituality.

Thanks LS, appreciate it.

What you describe is pretty much what I would expect from the church in general, it’s in this “spiritual” tradition in discerning God’s will that we have the dogma/doctrine of the faith today.

That’s why i’m a little worried when the Holy Father says “what you’re asking me, I ask myself the question. To share the Lord’s banquet: is it the goal of the path or is it the viaticum [provisions] for walking together? I leave that question to the theologians and those who understand.”

Does he not understand? Canon law under the guidance of the Holy spirit has given the answer.

God Bless.

 

[_Abyssinia]

Dr. Jeffrey Mirus says in part:

Should this rattle us a bit? Yes, I think it should. Does it raise important questions? Yes, I think it does. Does this have implications for the question of Communion for the divorced and remarried? We might think so, but in fact the two cases turn on very different principles, so when my colleague Phil Lawler introduced this question, I would have placed a question mark after his title! More to the point here, does this decision of Pope Francis justify headlines about the baby, the bathwater, and the horror of heresy? Presumably it would if we were talking about the unbaptized and/or those who do not believe in Christ’s Presence in the Eucharist. But in the specific case at hand, given the principles the Pope enunciated for its resolution, the answer is No: Such headlines, such alarms, are not justified. Moreover, I think we may have here a rather interesting specific example of the type I requested a few days ago when I wrote “The Pope on Christian Humanism: To understand, we need concrete applications”. Is this an example of what Pope Francis means when he says the Church must transcend mere rules? If so, this example makes it clear that he does not mean the Church should transcend the principles of her Faith. I refer to the preference I stated at the outset. But it is also essential to recognize that, in this particular case, Pope Francis seems to have kept the relevant principles of faith very firmly in mind.

• See more at: catholicculture.org/commentary/otc.cfm?id=1343#sthash.gtwiuUiI.dpuf

 

[Paganus]

Well played, Pope Francis! He said what needed to be said, being careful not to offend.

On her Lutheran theology:

“Life is greater than explanations and interpretations."

On her desire to receive Holy Communion:

**"Always refer to your baptism — one faith, one baptism, one Lord,…— and take the consequences from that,” ** …one Church, one Pope…

What should be her next steps?

“Speak with the Lord and move forward. I won’t say anything more.”

Because the Lord will lead you to his Church and welcome you home!

 

[Justin_Swanton]

I think Prof Mirus is trying to do damage control on Pope Francis’ answer. The Pope - clearly - is telling the Lutheran woman she can go ahead and receive Communion if she is personally happy about it. Examining his reply:

Question: My name is Anke de Bernardinis and, like many people in our community, I’m married to an Italian, who is a Roman Catholic Christian. We’ve lived happily together for many years, sharing joys and sorrows. And so we greatly regret being divided in faith and not being able to participate in the Lord’s Supper together. What can we do to achieve, finally, communion on this point?

Pope Francis: The question on sharing the Lord’s Supper isn’t easy for me to respond to, above all in front of a theologian like Cardinal Kasper! I’m scared!

A theologian like Cardinal Kasper? Kasper scares me too, but for different reasons.

…]

It’s true that in a certain sense, to share means there aren’t differences between us, that we have the same doctrine – underscoring that word, a difficult word to understand — but I ask myself: but don’t we have the same Baptism? If we have the same Baptism, shouldn’t we be walking together? You’re a witness also of a profound journey, a journey of marriage: a journey really of the family and human love and of a shared faith, no? We have the same Baptism.

Same baptism, yes, ‘shared faith’, no.

When you feel yourself to be a sinner – and I feel more of a sinner – when your husband feels a sinner, you go to the Lord and ask forgiveness; your husband does the same and also goes to the priest and asks absolution. I’m healed to keep alive the Baptism. When you pray together, that Baptism grows, becomes stronger. When you teach your kids who Jesus is, why Jesus came, what Jesus did for us, you’re doing the same thing, whether in the Lutheran language or the Catholic one, but it’s the same.

No, it’s not the same. The ‘Lutheran language’ is not the same as the ‘Catholic one’. The Lutheran language is full of heresy, i.e. erroneous teachings that distort the Christian Faith and to a certain extent hamstring those that believe them since they do not possess the fullness of the truth.

*The question: and the [Lord’s] Supper? There are questions that, only if one is sincere with oneself and with the little theological light one has, must be responded to on one’s own. See for yourself. This is my body. This is my blood. Do it in remembrance of me – this is a viaticum that helps us to journey on.

I once had a great friendship with an Episcopalian bishop who went a little wrong – he was 48 years old, married, two children. This was a discomfort to him – a Catholic wife, Catholic children, him a bishop. He accompanied his wife and children to Mass on Sunday, and then went to worship with his community. It was a step of participation in the Lord’s Supper. Then he went forward, the Lord called him, a just man.*

One would need to know what is meant by the bishop going forward because the Lord called him. Going forward to receive Communion?

*To your question, I can only respond with a question: what can I do with my husband, because the Lord’s Supper accompanies me on my path?

It’s a problem each must answer, but a pastor-friend once told me: “We believe that the Lord is present there, he is present. You all believe that the Lord is present. And so what’s the difference?”*

The difference lies in the fact that the special grace of Communion is precisely union with Christ’s Mystical Body, and hence an individual who receives it must already be in full union with the Church - the visible manifestation of Christ’s Mystical Body on Earth. Hence excommunicated Catholics may not receive Communion, since their separation from the visible Church precludes receiving a sacrament that supernaturally seals the union with that Church. What applies to excommunicated Catholics also applies to Protestants who ***reject ***the Church as anything more than an association of like-minded believers.

• — “Eh, there are explanations, interpretations.” Life is bigger than explanations and interpretations.*

This of course is wide open to all sorts of ‘explanations and interpretations’. Don’t bother with doctrine? What?

Always refer back to your baptism. “One faith, one baptism, one Lord.” This is what Paul tells us, and then take the consequences from there. I wouldn’t ever dare to allow this, because it’s not my competence. One baptism, one Lord, one faith. Talk to the Lord and then go forward. I don’t dare to say anything more.

Putting this in context (i.e. rereading everything in the Pope’s reply that has preceded it), the Pope is saying that he cannot positively permit the Lutheran spouse to receive Communion but neither does he positively forbid her. She is free to do as she sees fit.

The Pope said: “It’s true that in a certain sense, to share means there aren’t differences between us, that we have the same doctrine” and then spent the rest of his reply telling her that in what matters she ***does ***have the same doctrine: ‘Lutheran language’, ‘shared faith’.

He adds that St Paul requires “One faith, one baptism, one Lord.” but has already said she has all that - which is enough to receive Communion. So if she feels she believes enough like a Catholic (without being required to embrace the Catholic Faith in its entirety), who will stop her?

For the record I continue to love and revere Pope Francis (I especially love his spirituality) but I am keeping my wits about me when he speaks on certain topics like this one.

 

[pepipop]

Well played, Pope Francis! He said what needed to be said, being careful not to offend.

On her Lutheran theology:

“Life is greater than explanations and interpretations."

On her desire to receive Holy Communion:

**"Always refer to your baptism — one faith, one baptism, one Lord,…— and take the consequences from that,” ** …one Church, one Pope…

What should be her next steps?

“Speak with the Lord and move forward. I won’t say anything more.”

Because the Lord will lead you to his Church and welcome you home!

Pope Francis is also aware that as a practicising Christian herself, she will be well aware of the major differences in receiving communion in the CC and as a member of her own church. So, as she is already aware that she cannot receive communion with her Catholic husband, by leaving it to her conscience means she cannot/will not do it.

If she did ever did decide to receive communion in a CC, she will not be in keeping with what her own faith believes. In addition, due to her full knowledge that she is not eligible to receive the Eucharist in the CC, she would feel very guilty.

 

[pnewton]

I just went through the article. I cannot find where the Pope said “listen to conscience.” Is the title wrong?

 

[JimG]

Pope Francis is much easier to understand if you are familiar with the Ignatian spiritual tradition of prayer, contemplation and discerning Gods will in being present to the gospels and the life of Jesus. One of the greatest of Gods gifts to us is ‘free will’. God wants us to get to know Him, the Father, and love Him. He just doesn’t want people to be in a place of stagnant ritual like the Pharisees were in. Pope Francis in my opinion is slowly teaching people Ignatian spirituality.

I don’t know if the Holy Father was speaking Ignatian or not. But this convoluted response seems to require a great deal of study and analysis just to figure out what was being said.