Our only resonsibility is to share the truth. Not to belittle others who hold a truth different from our own.
Why is it wrong to pray to Mary so that we may grow in devotion to Christ? Why is it wrong to ask our fellow saints (brothers and sisters) in heaven to pray for us?Does the truth matter?
Of course, That is exactly what AshleyBelle is trying to tell you.
If a person has good reasons …
Why did that make me smile?
…to believe something is not true do they have a responsibility to address that?
Isn’t that exactly what all us Catholics have been doing with things that you have posted? Now do you understand?
I will ask you as itsjustdave did adout this pious Catholic practice of Indulgences. Why don’t you still practice it? You know slip a nice big check to the pope and cut to the front of the line.
If we dip our fingers in holy water and make the sign of the Cross while saying In the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit we gain a 1,000 day indulgence. We still have them Bud, but it isn’t any of your business what we do or believe is it? AS Father Philip said in His " Church is not Wal-Mart " essay,** “Telling Catholics that they aren’t perfect makes as much sense as telling fish they’re wet. We know already. Move on.” But the HS gets us back on track. And we do believe that even Protestants can help do that, Like Luther, but you are no Martty!Oh, by the way Luther still loved the CC, even when he left it! Poor lost soul! **
Until you can give me some evidence from the bible showing me my error the only thing you have to stand on is your church’s traditions.
Can you explain exactly why we have to do this???
The Mormons tradition is/was to have more than one wife who says they are wrong?Now you cant use the bible to support your position, thats your own standard!!!
Now tell me why are they wrong.
Who would want more than one wife? (Sorry ladies, The devil made me say that!) We don’t have to use the bible. In the old testament and even today in some societies it is permissable. However, in our society it isn’;t allowed. It is that simple. And the Protestants were the ones that forced the Mormans to stop it. Or didn’t you know that?
Wow what a concept you have their.Thank you for clarifying this, Bud. Now it is clear that your rejection of the Teachings results from a deficient understanding of salvation history.
Eve was created without sin. She was fully human, and produced fully human offspring. Mary was created withou tsin, and was fully human, and produced fully human offspring. The offspring of both are “man part” that can fall into sin. Eve chose to fall into sin. Mary did not .
Yes, God provided HImself a sacrifice - an unblemished male lamb, born of a woman, born under the law.
Wow. You have been very deprived. Try Jesus’ Prayer Book, aka, the Psalms. Try reciting them all every day, as the early monastics did. You will change your tune!
I know it is customary to say that anything that defies your understanding is a “figure of speech”, but again, you are incorrect. On the contrary, Jesus said that, if the people stopped praising Him, the very rocks themselves would cry out!
AH!!! So you see it, too?!! I was hoping others would get this.
Leeann?
I don’t think you fear Her, but I do think you are scared of Mary. Even evidenced in this post. I’m not sure why. Does She threaten you? Do you think that She will somehow come between you and Christ? Are you jealous that Jesus loves Her more? What IS your issue with Her? I am trying to help you and to get you to look inside yourself. You are not being humble and you are not being honest. We keep telling you that it’s not an either/or, but, you do not take our word for it. We keep telling you that God is all great, and you do not accept this is our belief. I think that this is a level of your pride, Leeann, God knows this post here can’t be helping you to lessen yourself, but, I think this is a level of pride for you on two levels:
You can use the Bible all you want (and that is what is happening, you are using it, not utilizing it, but, merely using it so you can get it to do what you want), but, when the passages are explained, you still cling to what YOU believe about the passages. You (and all Protestants who believe like you do), have to have such a small view of things, that while you may claim it’s just Jesus and Me and I’m in a relationship, it’s really JUST YOU, sans Jesus, because it can NEVER be just Jesus and another person. AND, if it is just you, not Jesus, then you really don’t care about ANYTHING He said, just what you say and what you believe. …And if this is the case, then you will not see that the Apostles, in your faulty scenario, wouldn’t know where to turn because if Mary says no, then Jesus will listen to Her. And if this is the case, then you will not see that the Apostles, in your faulty scenario, wouldn’t split up Jesus and Mary. And if this is the case, then you will not see that the Apostles, in your faulty scenario, cannot split up Mary’s, ‘yes,’ to God’s will. …But you can’t see any of this, because when we tell you where you err, and how, you say, ‘No, you’re wrong. ONLY JESUS ONLY JESUS ONLY JESUS.’ You say this because it’s just you.
- It’s NOT just you and God when it all comes down to it
- You MUST stick to your pride and incorrect assertions to make yourself feel better and comfortable.
And, ~I~ say this to get to the deeper issue, that you are jealous, or threatened, or scared of Mary.
You have been so brainwashed against Her that whenever anybody mentions Her, lights and sirens go off in you and your walls go up.
“A Freudian slip maybe? When you say one thing, but meaning your mother.”
You have been conditioned to accept that Mary is such a Catholic thing that She can NEVER be for the good and love of all peoples, let alone Protestants. Something (I’m not saying human, though, it could have been a pastor or a parent or friends just as much as experiences) has gotten into your psyche and prevents you from accepting the free love and graces of Mary. I bet even with that your mind is thinking, “ONLY GOD CAN GRANT GRACES!!! MARY DOES NOT NOR CAN SHE FREELY LOVE!!!” Yes She can and She does, both love and graces.
Mary can grant graces?Thumbing through CCC!
Well, golly gee willikers.
Leeann? Bud? Ja4?
I don’t understand this accusation at all. How is it that Mary, the chose Spouse of the HS “replace” His work, when she herself is the humble recipient of it?
While this is true, if it is all there is to your definition, then your perception is grossly deficient.
I agree. If the Catholic Church consisted only of the earthly manifestation, then it would be as deficient as your representation of “church”. Fortunately, this is not the case.
I guess you are trying to compare the Catholic Church to the Pharisees that Jesus was condemning.
Right. So why do you think Catholics are exempt from this?
You are making a distinction that does not exist. Mary was one with the HS for decades before He was given to the church. Mary lives, moves, and has her being in that HS who overshadowed her. She is present at Pentecost for us, because she had already been overshadowed by the HS.
You are making a distinction that does not exist. Mary always points to Christ, and in her, His goodness and the work of faith are manifested in power. Any grace that Mary shares comes from Him, as does all the grace that any of us can dispense.
Well, Mary was not present at the time, and Mary did not pronounce the consequences as Peter did. You also seem to presuppose that the Rosary is “vain repetition”, which is false.
What does one thing have to do with the other? Paul asks for the prayers of the saints often.
I suppose you are right. This is because the Bible was not created to support “RC theology”. Catholic theology existed in complete fullness prior to any word of the NT being written. It is not a “support” but a reflection. The reason it seems inconsistent to you is that you do not understand the Apostolic Teachings from whence it was produced.
Realcatholicgk:
You dont I was replying to why I dont follow traditions
Your right I for got that the Catholic religion is universal and can/has been integrated into anyone’s preexisting practices, you know like walmart one stop shop.
Maybe the RCC never planed that 1500 years later the masses would learn to read and write. And then discovered that what was being tough by the RCC was not the same as what the NT writers wrote.
I noticed you’re avoiding my questions above, budQuote:
Originally Posted by bud02 View Post
Its a very simple thing to use an online bible that searches key words in the bible. Words like church, pray, spirit, Mary, intercession ect.
The bible doesn’t support your RC theology, in fact it points to Jesus, the Holy Spirit and the Father. As Leeann has been pointing out the gospel that the RC teach is not the same described in the bible.
Maybe the RCC never planed that 1500 years later the masses would learn to read and write. And then discovered that what was being tough by the RCC was not the same as what the NT writers wrote.
Perhaps you would not believe it, but it is PRECISELY reading, studying, and searching God's word in the Bible which has led many home to the Catholic church. How do you account for this phenomenon if the church was hoping nobody would learn to read? :thumbsup:You would think that the masses would have also learned how to spell!Maybe the RCC never -]planed/-] planned that 1500 years later the masses would learn to read and write. And then discovered that what was being -]tough/-] taught by the RCC was not the same as what the NT writers wrote.
Well AshleyBell im sorry that sharing the truth upsets you.
Quite simply because you have no problem accepting tradition first then the bible.I noticed you’re avoiding my questions above, bud
Code:Perhaps you would not believe it, but it is PRECISELY reading, studying, and searching God's word in the Bible which has led many home to the Catholic church. How do you account for this phenomenon if the church was hoping nobody would learn to read? :thumbsup:
Exactly justasking!justasking
Nonsense. The pope is expressing not only his belief in Mary and what she can do but also what the Catholic church does in fact teach and promote. This is not slander. You are mistaken again…
First bud, I am not upset. I am actually full of joy because I know that despite all this, our blessed mother is still holding all Christians in her prayers
She has some loved ones who appear, from her perspective, to have replaced Jesus with Mary. She seems to be here to try to figure out how this happens.
Dont you think its about time the church takes a stand about whether Mary died or not???
