Prayer to the Blessed Virgin

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Keep in mind that individual catholics must also interpret the Scriptures on their own since the church has never done so. Were all in the same boat…View attachment 4039
Not at all. The Church gives us the authentic traditions of the Apotles through which we are to look at the scirptures. Protestantism gives us each persons likes and dislikes through which to view Protestantism.
 
Not at all. The Church gives us the authentic traditions of the Apotles through which we are to look at the scirptures. Protestantism gives us each persons likes and dislikes through which to view Protestantism.
What exactly are these “authentic traditions of the Apotles”? Can you give a couple of specific examples?
 
guanophore;4167743]
Originally Posted by justasking4
Keep in mind that individual catholics must also interpret the Scriptures on their own since the church has never done so. Were all in the same boat…
guanophore
No, ja4, we are not in the same boat. The Church teaches us the Doctrine, so that we can properly understand the scriptures.
Its doctrine that uses the Scriptures to support what you think the Scriptures mean?
We also have guidlines of interpretation, to keep us from going astray. When Jesus said “I will not leave you orphaned”, He meant that.
What are some of these guidlines? Can you give some examples?

How do they help you to know if you should be praying to Mary?
 
I know that Catholics say that they do not pray TO Mary; however, I found this published in my local paper this morning:

PRAYER TO THE BLESSED VIRGIN

"(Never known to all) Oh, most beautiful flowers of Mount Carmel, fruitful vine, splendor of Heaven, Blessed Mother of the Son of God, Immaculate Virgin, assist me in my necessity. Oh, Star of the Sea, help me and show me, herein you are my mother. Oh, Holy Mary, Mother of God, Queen of Heaven and Earth! I humbly beseech you from the bottom of my heart to succor me in this necessity.

All the above is recognizing the Queen of heaven, the Mother of God in all her divine gifts given her from God, The one praying is acknowledging the blessed Mother to assist in praying for the pentitent. Who admits belief in God and her Son Jesus and later the Holy Spirit. This is Gospel praying period.

B]There are none that can withstand your power.] Oh, show me herein you are my mother. Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee (3X).

**The first part of the prayer ends here; asking the blessed Mary who concieved without sin to pray for us, and who has recourse to the Holy Spirit, by which Mary concieved according to the Gospels. The power is reflective of her powerful intercession for us to her Son Jesus directly because she is his Mother. Come on, your not really thinking that Mary has power greater than the Holy Spirit, this is the folly and the distortion of Marian belief, by non Catholics.

The rest of the prayer is recognizing the Holy Spirit that does all things. To the one who has a special devotion to Mary, as myself, would pray this recognizing that the Holy Spirit living in Mary because she conceived by the Holy Spirit, to pray and assist us, and we recognize all the wonderful revelations that the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit working through Mary in his mercy and love. Who would ever want to be seperated from the Holy Spirit and the blessed Mother of Jesus, who is in heaven, praying for us now and at the hour of our death, just as she did Jesus our brother, so she does for all her siblings (see Revelations 12:17)**

Holy Spirit, you who solve all problems, light all roads so I can attain my goal. You who have the divine gift to forgive and forget all evil against me and that in all instances in my life, you are with me. I want in this short prayer to thank you for all things as I confirm once again that I never want to be separated from you in eternal glory. Thank you for your mercy toward me and mine. The person must say this prayer for 3 consecutive days. After 3 days, the request will be granted. This prayer must be published after the favor is granted."

**To have a correct understanding of the blessed virgin Mary is to have a correct belief in Jesus. So if you have a distorted view and belief of Mary who is the mother of Jesus, leads to a distorted view and belief in Jesus who is the son of Mary and Joseph. Mary brings us Jesus Christ on earth, and Mary takes us to Jesus in Heaven by her prayers and intercession, not to mention those in purgatory, but that is another topic dealing with her powerful intercession for us to our King of King and Lord of Lords.

Superstition has nothing to do with God being the God of the living whether those are awake or asleep they are all alive to God.

Peace**
 
What exactly are these “authentic traditions of the Apotles”? Can you give a couple of specific examples?
That the Holy Scriptures are not to be separated from the Authoritative Teaching of those who produced it.

That the Blessed Virgin had only One Child. 👍
Its doctrine that uses the Scriptures to support what you think the Scriptures mean?
No. It is the world view of Jesus, taught through the Apostles, that helps us to understand what they meant when they wrote the NT.
What are some of these guidlines? Can you give some examples?
The same ones you have been given. That the Holy Scripture is not to be separated from those to whom Jesus gave the Authority to teach the Gospel.
How do they help you to know if you should be praying to Mary?
We have received the Apostles “ways”. They believed in the communion of saints, and that death could not separate those who are in Christ. We can ask anyone in Christ for prayer, this side of the veil, or the other.
The apostles did not have anything to do with this in the sense of determining the canon.
On the contrary, they have everything to do with it. The Apostles passed on everything that Jesus wanted the Church to know. It was by these TEachings that the books that belonged in the Bible were recognized. It was by their authority that they passed on to their successors that the decision was made.

Not only that, they were interceding for the Church the whole time. 😉
 
What exactly are these “authentic traditions of the Apotles”? Can you give a couple of specific examples?
The doctrines of the sacraments, apostilic tradition, the exultation of Mary, the inerrancy of the scirptures, the liturgy, etc etc etc.
 
I not “dissing” anyone, your most assuredly not helping your cause. Our first priority should be Christ not Mary.

Thou shalt make no other god before me, the first commandment.
"Honor thy father and thy mother, which is “the first commandment with promise”.Ephesians 6.2 says that.
Your still trying to add to Christ atonement on the Cross, by your own admission and now trying to spin it in the opposite way
[sign1]
Piffle.

Pshaw.

Pfui.
[/sign1]
You, au contraire, are trying to 😦 subtract from the atonement those things which are patently there.
Its you:whistle: who are “spinning,” you see…
What exactly are these “authentic traditions of the Apotles”? Can you give a couple of specific examples?
That the Holy Scriptures are not to be separated from the Authoritative Teaching of those who produced it.

That the Blessed Virgin had only One Child.
:amen: Those were the ones that I thought of, right off, too.👍 👍
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guanophore:
Not only that, they were interceding for the Church the whole time. 😉
:yup:
 
East and West;4172324]
Originally Posted by justasking4
What exactly are these “authentic traditions of the Apotles”? Can you give a couple of specific examples?
East and West
The doctrines of the sacraments,
Here is the defintion of what sacrament means --Sacraments are outward signs of inward grace, instituted by Christ for our sanctification.

Where do the apostles mention this in the Scriptures? Where do they mention by name the 7 sacraments in Scripture?
apostilic tradition,
Still trying to understand exactly what this is.
the exultation of Mary,
The apostles never mention her in the ways the Catholic church does. Where do we find in the writings of the apostles titles like this given to Mary?
Queen of heaven, Mirror of justice,
Seat of wisdom,
Cause of our joy,
Spiritual vessel,
Vessel of honor,
Singular vessel of devotion,
Mystical rose,
Tower of David,
Tower of ivory,
House of gold,
the inerrancy of the scirptures, the liturgy, etc etc etc.
 
O dear Justasking, you’re biting off more than you can chew in taking on all 7 Sacraments. You really must not be very biblically literate if you need to have them pointed out to you. Really. I’m shocked! Besides this thread is about prayers offered to the Blessed Virgin Mary and her intercession on our behalf. If you’d like to challenge the Biblical credibility of the Seven Sacraments, I sugget you start another thread. You could start it out with “I’m just asking, but…” Go for it!

Peace,

Gail
 
P.S. Justasking - Do you still have any questions about Mary’s intercession on your behalf or have we answered you? And have you prayed to her yet? It really isn’t hard. You could do it if you swallowed your pride and admitted you need a Mother too! God’s waiting…

Peace,

Gail
 
Here is the defintion of what sacrament means --Sacraments are outward signs of inward grace, instituted by Christ for our sanctification.

Where do the apostles mention this in the Scriptures? Where do they mention by name the 7 sacraments in Scripture?
Off topic. Are you getting upset again? Why are you trying to derail the thread?
Still trying to understand exactly what this is.
It would do more good to master the basics first.
The apostles never mention her in the ways the Catholic church does. Where do we find in the writings of the apostles titles like this given to Mary?
Queen of heaven, Mirror of justice,
Seat of wisdom,
Cause of our joy,
Spiritual vessel,
Vessel of honor,
Singular vessel of devotion,
Mystical rose,
Tower of David,
Tower of ivory,
House of gold,
We have them preserved in the prayers that are part of the Sacred Tradition. However, ja4, the Church does not require that you pray them, so can you not go on your way, praying prayers that do not hinder you? Why concern yourself over the private devotions of others?
 
The apostles never mention her in the ways the Catholic church does. Where do we find in the writings of the apostles titles like this given to Mary?
Queen of heaven, Mirror of justice,
I am familiar with your objections to the term “queen of heaven”. What about “mirror of justice”. Do you not think that Christ is the fulfillment of God’s justice? Do you not think that Mary reflects that?
Seat of wisdom,
The HS is referred to as Wisdom. When the HS overshadowed Mary, she became His “seat”.
Cause of our joy,
Don’t you think that Elisabeth was full of joy to have Mary visit?
Code:
Spiritual vessel,
Would you not agree that Mary is a vessel unto God? Do you not agree that she was impregnated spiritually by God?
Vessel of honor
I know for sure you consider it a great honor for Mary to bear in her womb the King of Kings. You have said as much before.
Code:
Singular vessel of devotion,
I am sure you have a hard time with this, since you reject the Apostolic Teaching that her devotion to God was singular. You seem to believe that, after becoming the Spouse of the Holy Spirit, she then became intimate later with Joseph. 🤷
 
guanophore;4174456]
Originally Posted by justasking4
The apostles never mention her in the ways the Catholic church does. Where do we find in the writings of the apostles titles like this given to Mary?
Queen of heaven, Mirror of justice,
Seat of wisdom,
Cause of our joy,
Spiritual vessel,
Vessel of honor,
Singular vessel of devotion,
Mystical rose,
Tower of David,
Tower of ivory,
House of gold,
guanophore
We have them preserved in the prayers that are part of the Sacred Tradition. However, ja4, the Church does not require that you pray them, so can you not go on your way, praying prayers that do not hinder you? Why concern yourself over the private devotions of others?
Can it be said these titles given to Mary are part of Sacred Tradition?
 
Can it be said these titles given to Mary are part of Sacred Tradition?
No, they are private revelations and devotions, which is why they are not binding on the faithful. They are not contradictory with the Apostolic Teachings. The prayers and devotions of the Apostles are what is part of Sacred Traditoin.
 
I know that Catholics say that they do not pray TO Mary; however, I found this published in my local paper this morning:

PRAYER TO THE BLESSED VIRGIN

“(Never known to all) Oh, most beautiful flowers of Mount Carmel, fruitful vine, splendor of Heaven, Blessed Mother of the Son of God, Immaculate Virgin, assist me in my necessity. Oh, Star of the Sea, help me and show me, herein you are my mother. Oh, Holy Mary, Mother of God, Queen of Heaven and Earth! I humbly beseech you from the bottom of my heart to succor me in this necessity. There are none that can withstand your power. Oh, show me herein you are my mother. Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee (3X). Holy Spirit, you who solve all problems, light all roads so I can attain my goal. You who have the divine gift to forgive and forget all evil against me and that in all instances in my life, you are with me. I want in this short prayer to thank you for all things as I confirm once again that I never want to be separated from you in eternal glory. Thank you for your mercy toward me and mine. The person must say this prayer for 3 consecutive days. After 3 days, the request will be granted. This prayer must be published after the favor is granted.”

I know that Catholics say that this is the same as asking friend to pray for us, but is it really? The prayer addresses Mary in the same way as it addresses the Holy Spirit. Is Mary equal to the Holy Spirit?

What about the superstition? The prayer says, “You must say this prayer for 3 consecutive days. After 3 days, the request will be granted. This prayer must be published after the favor is granted.”

I don’t want to argue, but I’m really trying to understand this type of prayer.
**I do not apologize for saying that I pray TO Mary and WITH Mary as well as WITH the entire Communion of Saints.

I am not familiar with this prayer and don’t know from where it comes. But I think you are reading more into it than what is there. It is a poetic but sincere petition for her intercession and that of the Holy Spirit. The prayer is divided into two parts: (1) the recognition of Mary’s maternity over the Church and over us as our spiritual mother, her intercession, and her love for us; (2) prayer to the Holy Spirit, Who is God. There is no inention in any way in the prayer that Mary equals the Holy Spirit.

Whatever was granted through the intercession of Mary by the Holy Spirit was granted to the person because it says if the request is granted the prayer must be published afterwards. I don’t know the significance of this except to show that Mary’s intercession is real. Also, I don’t know much about recitation of the prayer for three days. I know there are novenas that can go on for 5, 7, 9 days or more, but these are personal devotions tolerated by the Church because they get people to pray and reinforce simple doctrine. This isn’t superstition.**
 
Can it be said these titles given to Mary are part of Sacred Tradition?
No, these are part of devotional life.
They are beautiful ways to speak to our :love: beloved Virgin Mother.

The electric power is off at my house; I am at the library. I fell asleep last night, repeating all the names for Mary that I could remember from heart:
Our Lady of Prompt Succor, pray for us.
Our Lady of Perpetual Help, pray for us.
Our Lady of Guadelupe, pray for us.
I could almost feel that I was a little girl again, crawling into my mother’s bed, and:heaven: snuggling up while she prayed.
Y’all are going to have to do better than sarcasm, better than half-truths mixed with anger, before you ever convince us here, that the Blessed Virgin Mary is anything but the best mother of all, and the greatest prayer warrior of all time.
Mother of Christ, pray for us.
Mother of us, pray for us.
Mother conceived without original sin, pray for us.:gopray2: :gopray2: :gopray2:

Very:( sad, to try to live without a mother to intercede with her prayers… Very, very:crying: sad.
 
No, these are part of devotional life.
They are beautiful ways to speak to our :love: beloved Virgin Mother.

The electric power is off at my house; I am at the library. I fell asleep last night, repeating all the names for Mary that I could remember from heart:
Our Lady of Prompt Succor, pray for us.
Our Lady of Perpetual Help, pray for us.
Our Lady of Guadelupe, pray for us.
I could almost feel that I was a little girl again, crawling into my mother’s bed, and:heaven: snuggling up while she prayed.
Y’all are going to have to do better than sarcasm, better than half-truths mixed with anger, before you ever convince us here, that the Blessed Virgin Mary is anything but the best mother of all, and the greatest prayer warrior of all time.
Mother of Christ, pray for us.
Mother of us, pray for us.
Mother conceived without original sin, pray for us.:gopray2: :gopray2: :gopray2:

Very:( sad, to try to live without a mother to intercede with her prayers… Very, very:crying: sad.
I think you have hit the nail on the head here. I think those who react so negatively of Jesus’ gift to us of His own mother do so because there are unhealed wounds related to an earthly mother. These wounds make it difficult or impossible to access the love that is poured out from her heart to us.

Blessed Mary, Ever Virgin, Pray for us that have recourse to thee.
 
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