Praying to saints #2

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chagel_333

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Doesnt this verses show we should not ask the saints to pray for us? “who inquires of the dead”

Deuteronomy 18:10-13
“There shall not be found among you anyone who burns his son or his daughter as an offering, anyone who practices divination or tells fortunes or interprets omens, or a sorcerer or a charmer or a medium or a necromancer or one who inquires of the dead, for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord. And because of these abominations the Lord your God is driving them out before you. You shall be blameless before the Lord your God”
 
Asking the saints to pray for us is not the same as divination and necromancy. We’re not attempting to conjure up the saints as though by magic. We’re asking the people who are alive in Christ, since God is not the God of the dead but of the living, who are members of the one Body of Christ along with us, to pray for us, since it is the will of God that we pray and intercede for one another. If it were not, scripture would not command us to.

-Fr ACEGC
 
Asking saints for prayers is the same as asking a living person to pray for us.
One does NOT ask the saints to appear, or tell you the future, or work magic for you. That would be divination and necromancy.
 
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The fact that you would compare mediums and fortunetellers to saints who are in the presence of God tells me that you haven’t done any research into saints or intercession.
 
Sursumcorda1 said:
The fact that you would compare mediums and fortunetellers to saints who are in the presence of God tells me that you haven’t done any research into saints or intercession
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Perhaps we should consider this question as the first step in the direction of research. What merit is there in a reply like this?
 
Not really seeing the value in this post. Perhaps OP is inquiring out of a desire to learn? He or she is not the first to wonder about such thing and nor will they be the last … A rather terse response isn’t helpful

People respond better if you talk to them, rather then down to them
 
This passage pertains to Necromancy – God is a God of the living and we recognize the saints as living eternal life in Heaven, where they dwell.
 
Two negatives in a question, doesn’t and not, implies a rebuke buried in the question.
The repetition of this form of question accompanied by a bible verse taken out of context is not a quest for the truth.
 
No single verse, in isolation, means anything when shredded from the entirety of the scriptures. Like our Lord’s garment, scripture is a seamless whole.

Billions know what the bible says. But what does it mean?

You have pointed out the problem of “bible alone” very well. For that you are commended.
 
po18guy said:
You have pointed out the problem of “bible alone” very well. For that you are commended.
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but when a tradition is questionable should we not turn to the bible to seek the truth of what God desires from us?

I know the bible says saints pray for us, it says that we should pray to each other… but where exactly, specifically does the bible say we should pray to saints to pray for us, to seek saints in order to seek God?
 
Why? The Church holds Christ’s teaching authority and clarifies what is in the bible as well as teaching what the Apostles did - that is not in the bible.

Bible alone was never taught by Christ. It is a 16th century German novelty.
 
I understand, but where does a person go to seek the truth if what is taught, what is tradition, what everyone says is right is in question, when it comes to God?
 
The Catechism. Online or print.

What is great is that beliefs and teachings are explained as well as the reasoning behind them and their source.
 
but who’s the final answer to what is the truth.
If the OP has a question about praying to saints. Tradition, CCC and every priest says its okay, but the bible doesn’t say you should pray to saint, just pray for each other. God says I’m the One True God. Jesus says no one gets to the Father except through Me… aren’t you contradicting what the bible says by praying to saints to pray for you to get to the father… even asking others to pray for you to get to the father is a contradiction to what the bible says about prayer.

the bible does say we should pray for each other, its an automatic thing, we shouldn’t need to ask anyone on earth or already in heaven to pray for us, because as Christians we should automatically be prayer for each other, without having to be asked.

so who’s telling the truth about what God says about praying to saints… tradition or the bible… and if traditions and the CCC are bible based where exactly does it say we should pray to saints… and I’m not saying pray for each other I mean specifically pray to saints.
 
Of course, we should pray directly to Christ with every pressing need we have (see John 14:13–14). That’s something the Catholic Church strongly encourages. In fact, the prayers of the Mass, the central act of Catholic worship, are directed to God and Jesus, not the saints. But this does not mean that we should not also ask our fellow Christians, including those in heaven, to pray with us.

Not only do those in heaven pray with us, they also pray for us. In the book of Revelation, we read: “[An] angel came and stood at the altar [in heaven] with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne; and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God” (Rev. 8:3-4).

And those in heaven who offer to God our prayers aren’t just angels, but humans as well. John sees that “the twenty-four elders [the leaders of the people of God in heaven] fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints” (Rev. 5:8). The simple fact is, as this passage shows: The saints in heaven offer to God the prayers of the saints on earth.

Source - Catholic Answers
 
annad347 said:
but the bible doesn’t say you should pray to saint, just pray for each other.
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I think one must be reminded of what the word pray means. We Catholics tend to use older language, or I mean, language with its older meaning. Pray in the past simply meant request. So, if we use that definition, then when we pray to the Saints, we are merely requesting of the Saints. For instance, in the Chronicles of Narnia, there are numerous cases of people saying to each other things like “pray you come here.” on so forth. They weren’t using it in the case of Prayer to God as worship. But a request. So, with that in mind, when the Bible says to ask others to pray for us, we are praying to others to pray to God for us. Now, we can only pray/request to that which is living. So praying to the Saints in heaven is no different than praying to our fellow Christian for prayers. No difference.

You are getting hung up on the typical protestant idea that the words themselves have to be in the Bible. But that is contradictory. For where is the canon at in the Bible? There is no list. So there is an outside source that can define things and it still be inspired/infallible.
 
SeekerOfTruth7 said:
I think one must be reminded of what the word pray means. We Catholics tend to use older language, or I mean, language with its older meaning. Pray in the past simply meant request…
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I don’t think I’m mixing my words… I know a prayer is a simple request… a prayer to God is a request for God to hear our words.

What I’m saying is that God wants us to pray for each other, its an automatic thing we as Christians should be doing. When we stand in church and pray for the intentions of others that is exactly what God wants us to do. He wants us to be part of each other’s lives, to know each other and to know when we need prayer without being asked. That’s God’s intent. When the saints are bring God our prayers they should be bring Him the prayers we send to Him, to God. Prayers we say for each other.

What I’m asking is if its an automatic thing we should be doing as Christians… then aren’t we contradicting what Jesus words when He says that we should ask someone to pray for us, just cause we feel that person or saint is closer to God then we are, when the only one closest to God is Jesus, the only one who is between us an God is Jesus?
 
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Miracles have been attributed to praying to saints. Of course only God can decided to grant that miracle.
 
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