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StratusRose
Guest
Thank you! We are very blessed.Great post! I have been meaning to congratulate you on your pregnancy by the way. I’m excited for you!
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PaulinVA
Guest
Imperfect - There is much confusion right now about sex in the CoE and the Anglican Communion.
The Catholic Church has no such confusion. Individuals might not follow the Catholic teaching, but there is only one teaching - sex before marraige (of a man and a woman) is a sin.
Out of love for your boyfriend, respect his beliefs. Catholics don’t have a big tent with different beliefs living in tension. We have one set of beliefs we all try to follow.
God does not view you relationship as wrong. But there is a right time for everything.
The Catholic Church has no such confusion. Individuals might not follow the Catholic teaching, but there is only one teaching - sex before marraige (of a man and a woman) is a sin.
Out of love for your boyfriend, respect his beliefs. Catholics don’t have a big tent with different beliefs living in tension. We have one set of beliefs we all try to follow.
God does not view you relationship as wrong. But there is a right time for everything.
H
HeWillProvide
Guest
I would think that if you are in love with someone, you would want them to keep their morals and values. If he does not keep his morals and values with you regarding this, why would he keep them with anything else in the future???
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Just_wondering
Guest
Imperfect - I am in a similar situation. I am a non-Catholic, dating a Catholic man. I have been in relationships before that involved sex - again, not like one night stands and promiscuous dating, but I always figured that sex was a level of intimacy that came before marriage. (I still kind of think that.)
Now I’m dating a Catholic man, and one of the things I admire about him is his strong faith and deep sense of honour. I know that if he gave in to pressure from me, that would make me respect him less, not more. After all, if I could convince him to dismiss his rights and duties, what could some other girl do? There must be a prettier girl than me out there, who could lure him away from me once he let that weakness in. Why would I want to make this relationship, which is about mutual respect, admiration, and love, turn into something based on sex? Oh, believe me, I desire it very badly. So does he - he was in an invalid marriage before, so he isn’t a virgin and he knows what he’s missing. But as he said, if we have the rest of our lives ahead of us, what does it hurt to wait?
If you need a commitment to him, to keep you from worrying when you’re apart, ask for something concrete, something that doesn’t take away from his soul and what makes him who he is. My boyfriend gave me a pair of earrings. When I’m feeling insecure about myself and when I wonder whether he really is serious about me, I think of the earrings he gave me and the promises he has made to me. I know an engagement ring would be a better symbol of our commitment, but since he can’t afford one yet, the earrings will do for me.
If you really need a commitment from him, pressure him to put a ring on your finger. If you’re not ready to accept a ring, then you have no right to be pressuring him about sex.
My two cents.
Now I’m dating a Catholic man, and one of the things I admire about him is his strong faith and deep sense of honour. I know that if he gave in to pressure from me, that would make me respect him less, not more. After all, if I could convince him to dismiss his rights and duties, what could some other girl do? There must be a prettier girl than me out there, who could lure him away from me once he let that weakness in. Why would I want to make this relationship, which is about mutual respect, admiration, and love, turn into something based on sex? Oh, believe me, I desire it very badly. So does he - he was in an invalid marriage before, so he isn’t a virgin and he knows what he’s missing. But as he said, if we have the rest of our lives ahead of us, what does it hurt to wait?
If you need a commitment to him, to keep you from worrying when you’re apart, ask for something concrete, something that doesn’t take away from his soul and what makes him who he is. My boyfriend gave me a pair of earrings. When I’m feeling insecure about myself and when I wonder whether he really is serious about me, I think of the earrings he gave me and the promises he has made to me. I know an engagement ring would be a better symbol of our commitment, but since he can’t afford one yet, the earrings will do for me.
If you really need a commitment from him, pressure him to put a ring on your finger. If you’re not ready to accept a ring, then you have no right to be pressuring him about sex.
My two cents.
T
turtle18
Guest
I’m sorry his parents can’t be devout Catholics and be advocates of pre-marital sex. In the end, it doesn’t really matter what his parents think, it is a matter of what God thinks and following his will, not your own. If you are chosing to have pre-martial relations, you are following your own will and you should repent. Who do you love more? Your boyfriend or God? If you truly love God, you will follow his Will in your life and pre-marital sex or relations is never a part of God’s desire.
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Becky42
Guest
i know this might sound like something very basic to say given the complexity of the situation but maybe it is important to consider exactly what love for another person is.
Love for another being (especially the special love that exists between a man and a woman) is not just the feeling of love, the feeling of wanting to be joined at the hip all the time and all those wondrful feelings the world associates with love. Love, i believe, and from what i interepret from catholic church teachings, is that love is above all the intention to do what is best for the other person and for them to want to do what is best for you.
Putting that into context, are you doing ‘what is best’ for your boyfriend if you know that he feels that having sex with you is a sin?
i believe that if he seriously feels he is ready for sex than by that he is saying he is ready for marriage and if that is not the case then maybe the phsycial attraction to sex is more lust filled than love filled (which can be very very confusing i think!!)
it probably doesnt help that you guys live so far apart as the distance and lack of contact between you two (ie the ability to hug each other or see each other every day or so) makes the ‘craving’ for one another all the more intense which is probably putting pressure on both of you.
just my thoughts anyway,
I’ll keep you both in my thoughts and prayers
God bless
Becky
Love for another being (especially the special love that exists between a man and a woman) is not just the feeling of love, the feeling of wanting to be joined at the hip all the time and all those wondrful feelings the world associates with love. Love, i believe, and from what i interepret from catholic church teachings, is that love is above all the intention to do what is best for the other person and for them to want to do what is best for you.
Putting that into context, are you doing ‘what is best’ for your boyfriend if you know that he feels that having sex with you is a sin?
i believe that if he seriously feels he is ready for sex than by that he is saying he is ready for marriage and if that is not the case then maybe the phsycial attraction to sex is more lust filled than love filled (which can be very very confusing i think!!)
it probably doesnt help that you guys live so far apart as the distance and lack of contact between you two (ie the ability to hug each other or see each other every day or so) makes the ‘craving’ for one another all the more intense which is probably putting pressure on both of you.
just my thoughts anyway,
I’ll keep you both in my thoughts and prayers
God bless
Becky
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ladylinguist
Guest
I’ve been on the other side of the coin, being the member of the relationship committed to avoiding pre-marital sex and dating someone who didn’t think it was an issue. I don’t know if you’ve pushed the idea of pre-marital sex at all, but even suggesting it when you already know he’s against it can seem both pushy and an indication that you lack respect for his beliefs. My old boyfriend said he respected my desire to wait, but still would ask me if I were changing my mind at all. This told me that he didn’t really mean what he was saying. Also, if your boyfriend does eventually give in and have sex with you, he might come to regret his decision (and this is likely if he’s a strong Catholic). This may cause him to resent you by extension, as you were the one who asked him to set aside his convictions. There’s also the possible issue that he may have sex with you and, regretting his choice, decide he doesn’t want to have sex anymore. Would you be all right with that? Or would that cause you to feel rejected becuase you view sex as an expression of emotions? While I never actually had sex with my ex, we were very intimate and shared a bed often. When I moved away and I was lucky enough to really grow in my faith, I realized that I was behaving in a sinful manner and I told him that when he came to visit me he would not be allowed to share my bed. His reaction? He got angry and told me that if he had to sleep in the spare room he wasn’t going to stay with me at all, unless he could sleep with me.
This is just one situation, but I’ve seen it happen in both my relationship and in relationships that my friends have had. Asking someone to set aside their convictions is never a loving action and only leads to more problems.
This is just one situation, but I’ve seen it happen in both my relationship and in relationships that my friends have had. Asking someone to set aside their convictions is never a loving action and only leads to more problems.
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stadre
Guest
This is worth repeating:
Have you discussed the “what ifs?” The main one being, what about pregnancy? If you intend to get married, why don’t just get married? Do you realize that you can be married six months from now? (You could check out the stories from Ave Marie Singles. These are devoted Catholics who often meet and marry someone from a distance. It can be done.)
You don’t have to believe that your relationship will be sinful. God has told you it is (or would be). You trust many people about the proper way to use the things they make. (ie. Do you use the proper gas in your car?) If you can trust the car manufacturer, why can’t you trust God? He did create us and He created sex. Don’t you think He knows how best to use it?
You’ve come here for a reason. I don’t think you are surprised that we are not telling you to continue on this path. I hope and pray that you are open to the truth. If you want a successful marriage with this man, give yourselves the best start: practice chastity.
I also strongly recommend this book:
Have you considered that this coersion to change his values, will really change his values? Look into the future, now that he’s feeling guilty about doing this (and he will feel guilty–even if he doesn’t tell you) there is a possiblity you are not considering. He could withdraw from you completely over this. You are concerned about this “commitment” before moving across the ocean. How will you handle moving over here because of it and now you are alone anyway?
You asked us to be gentle. I am trying to say this as lovingly as possible. You really need to do some more learning about love, marriage and sexuality (see above mentioned book). You say that you love him. You know that he believes he will go to hell if he sleeps with you, but you can’t commit to him if he doesn’t. How can you say that is loving? Think about it: you are telling him that he should go to hell for you. As a husband, he should be willing to die for you, but not go to hell. When you get married, you are saying that you are responsible for helping your spouse get to Heaven. I still just can’t believe you would pressure someone you love to do something when you know he would be deciding hell.
And this is what it comes down to. Having sex outside of marriage to show “love, trust, faith, and commitment” is a lie. Having sex in marriage is a renewal of marriage vows. It tells each other that you are united and open to life, it affirms your love rather than proves it.
Have you discussed the “what ifs?” The main one being, what about pregnancy? If you intend to get married, why don’t just get married? Do you realize that you can be married six months from now? (You could check out the stories from Ave Marie Singles. These are devoted Catholics who often meet and marry someone from a distance. It can be done.)
You don’t have to believe that your relationship will be sinful. God has told you it is (or would be). You trust many people about the proper way to use the things they make. (ie. Do you use the proper gas in your car?) If you can trust the car manufacturer, why can’t you trust God? He did create us and He created sex. Don’t you think He knows how best to use it?
You’ve come here for a reason. I don’t think you are surprised that we are not telling you to continue on this path. I hope and pray that you are open to the truth. If you want a successful marriage with this man, give yourselves the best start: practice chastity.
M
Maria1212
Guest
You are very right. Saving oneself for marriage is something is a Christian belief, not just a Catholic Christian belief. But as a Catholic, who has dated non-Cathoilc Christians, I often forget this is a Christian belief, and not just a Catholic Christian belief. Sadly, the sin of pre-maritial sex is something often overlooked by Christians and Catholic Christians alike.
Again, I cannot recommend enough the book by Chris West. I hope you will take the time to read it. It is money well spent. And both you and your boyfriend are worth it.
Sincerely,
Maria1212
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He_Man
Guest
Agreed. His commitment is to God first, then you. If I love my girlfriend/fiance/spouse, I would NEVER ask them to turn their back on their faith to God.
That isn’t love.
I
imperfect
Guest
I am so thankful for all of your responses. It comforts me to know that there is nothing in any of the posts made here that I have not already considered. We talk. We talk. We talk.
I don’t like the word coercion, of course, and I hate the thought that I am the cause of his guilt, however, I have no control over his thought process and I will always be thankful that we can talk and talk and talk.
Nothing here makes me question my love for him. Perhaps that’s where my emphasis should be, but it is a matter of beliefs. Sex is not a sin for me, it is an extension and a commitment. For him, and you guys, it is a sin outside of marriage. I do get that.
Having people understand and show understanding is so helpful. It allows me to order my thoughts. Our peers do not understand and while we are a private couple I have longed to discuss with people who get this from all angles.
I do realise now though what it is that I want. We have both made sacrifices to get to the stage we are at now and i do not doubt that there will be more to come.
I want to highlight this part because I think it’s the most important thing i have said and I would really welcome your comments on it:
I need him to be ready, and perhaps, willing, to commit to me in this way, and he needs me to acknowledge that by really wanting to wait until we are married. And i do. And of course I will because despite what is said here I do respect and love him. I am not sure if him even getting to that point is a sin. I hope it isn’t. I hope the sin is in the act that is canceled out by marriage.
I don’t like the word coercion, of course, and I hate the thought that I am the cause of his guilt, however, I have no control over his thought process and I will always be thankful that we can talk and talk and talk.
Nothing here makes me question my love for him. Perhaps that’s where my emphasis should be, but it is a matter of beliefs. Sex is not a sin for me, it is an extension and a commitment. For him, and you guys, it is a sin outside of marriage. I do get that.
Having people understand and show understanding is so helpful. It allows me to order my thoughts. Our peers do not understand and while we are a private couple I have longed to discuss with people who get this from all angles.
I do realise now though what it is that I want. We have both made sacrifices to get to the stage we are at now and i do not doubt that there will be more to come.
I want to highlight this part because I think it’s the most important thing i have said and I would really welcome your comments on it:
I need him to be ready, and perhaps, willing, to commit to me in this way, and he needs me to acknowledge that by really wanting to wait until we are married. And i do. And of course I will because despite what is said here I do respect and love him. I am not sure if him even getting to that point is a sin. I hope it isn’t. I hope the sin is in the act that is canceled out by marriage.
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dulcissima
Guest
Imperfect,
I can’t quite make out whether you are saying you have decided to wait until marriage or are just saying that you have already taken this all into consideration and still want to go ahead. I am hoping that you have decided to wait.
There are a couple of items though from what you wrote that I want to comment on…
You say, “Sex is not a sin for me, it is an extension and a commitment.” I hope that you understand that we don’t get to decide what is and what is not a sin. God decides that, and God does not decide that one thing is a sin for one person and not for another. Also, you say that sex is a commitment. Well, guess what…you’ve already made that commitment to someone else. Was that really the kind of a commitment that you are looking for with this young man?
And the other item I wanted to point…marriage does not cancel out sin. This is a mistake in thinking that a lot of people make. It doesn’t make it ok to fornicate and that when you marry that will just wash it all away. Instead…you take that sin with you into marriage and you will pay for it. Divorce rates are so much higher for couples who engaged in premarital relations as well as for those who cohabited prior to marriage. If you are willing to sacrifice what you want right now, you are going to be entering into marriage on a much more solid foundation than if you make this young man compromise his beliefs for you.
I can’t quite make out whether you are saying you have decided to wait until marriage or are just saying that you have already taken this all into consideration and still want to go ahead. I am hoping that you have decided to wait.
There are a couple of items though from what you wrote that I want to comment on…
You say, “Sex is not a sin for me, it is an extension and a commitment.” I hope that you understand that we don’t get to decide what is and what is not a sin. God decides that, and God does not decide that one thing is a sin for one person and not for another. Also, you say that sex is a commitment. Well, guess what…you’ve already made that commitment to someone else. Was that really the kind of a commitment that you are looking for with this young man?
And the other item I wanted to point…marriage does not cancel out sin. This is a mistake in thinking that a lot of people make. It doesn’t make it ok to fornicate and that when you marry that will just wash it all away. Instead…you take that sin with you into marriage and you will pay for it. Divorce rates are so much higher for couples who engaged in premarital relations as well as for those who cohabited prior to marriage. If you are willing to sacrifice what you want right now, you are going to be entering into marriage on a much more solid foundation than if you make this young man compromise his beliefs for you.
W
whatevergirl
Guest
I agree with you, here.
I have also heard that the stat for the divorce rate soaring is very high, with couples who have had premarital sex? What is the reason for that? Just curious–I never understood why that is?
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dulcissima
Guest
I think it is because people who engage in premarital sex probably aren’t as aware of what marriage is really all about. I know I am now divorced and slept with my ex-husband before we were married. It’s not like most people go through marriage preparation and then decide to sleep together.
So, to the OP, I would ask what is your understanding about the purpose of marriage? What type of preparation for marriage have you made with this young man that you are interested in?
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lizaanne
Guest
However - it is a sin to God when it is outside of marriage, regardless of what you may think or feel. There is only one Truth, not multiple truths. Your boyfriend is Catholic and he adheres to this Truth. To ask him to go against this, for whatever reason, is abhorent.
If you love him - marry him. Have sex after. It’s really not that big a deal to wait. And if you question his commitment or whatever because you have not had sex with him prior to marriage, you have MUCH bigger issues than this to deal with.
I’m starting to question why in the world such a devout man would want to get involved with someone who feels so differently than he does. Why would he want to constantly have to qualify his Faith at every turn, when he’s having to do so before the wedding even happens?
I know this is harsh - but this is the Truth. You can try to justify your way around it any way you like - but it does not change reality.
~Liza
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whatevergirl
Guest
Hi again, imperfect;
May I ask – do you feel like something is lacking in your relationship (like a sense of feeling loved) by your bf’s stance on permarital sex? I ask because you look at sex (in your relationship) as being an extension of love as you post…but, is it an extension, or might you feel that sex will *confirm *that he loves you? That’s an important distinction to make. My husband was ‘active’ before me, and I was waiting for marriage–so he was not used to a woman ‘holding back,’ or ‘being reserved.’ He felt a little uneasy about that during our courtship, but then he grew to accept that it actually made our bond stronger. My husband had been chaste for a few years leading up to meeting me–per wanting to live his life more for God. But, when he realized ‘I was the one,’ he didn’t see anything wrong with having sex, even though we were just engaged and not married. He had some struggles because in his mind–this is how a person confirms his/her love for one another. No, a person confirms his/her love through marriage–making a lifelong commitment to one another. Glad we waited–were his sentiments. (and so am I)
And so will you be. Please trust me/us.
May I ask – do you feel like something is lacking in your relationship (like a sense of feeling loved) by your bf’s stance on permarital sex? I ask because you look at sex (in your relationship) as being an extension of love as you post…but, is it an extension, or might you feel that sex will *confirm *that he loves you? That’s an important distinction to make. My husband was ‘active’ before me, and I was waiting for marriage–so he was not used to a woman ‘holding back,’ or ‘being reserved.’ He felt a little uneasy about that during our courtship, but then he grew to accept that it actually made our bond stronger. My husband had been chaste for a few years leading up to meeting me–per wanting to live his life more for God. But, when he realized ‘I was the one,’ he didn’t see anything wrong with having sex, even though we were just engaged and not married. He had some struggles because in his mind–this is how a person confirms his/her love for one another. No, a person confirms his/her love through marriage–making a lifelong commitment to one another. Glad we waited–were his sentiments. (and so am I)
And so will you be. Please trust me/us.
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Pro-Life_Teen
Guest
This isn’t an answer to the question. Many Catholics are with people of opposing views and religions, even devout Catholics. As to the why, the simple answer of love should be enough. If this is to turn into another discussion, there are many threads posts by Catholics and non-Catholic about mixed-faith relationships.
It seems as if you’ll wait, from what I’ve gathered. The bolded part is a bit hard to decipher. Heh. At the very least if there’s still a hesitation here’s a thought: People have regretted sleeping with their partners before marriage, but few if any have regretted waiting.
God Bless you both and I wish you the best. You do write as someone who is in love and with that you can overcome trials. True love, proper selfless sacrificing love, can conquer all. Be those things dramatic or something less than-- waiting a while perhaps until you two can be properly together.
A
agapewolf
Guest
If you have sex before married…that is exactly what you will know about each other: that you both will sleep with someone you aren’t married to. I don’t think that is something you want to know about someone that you will eventually be married to…that he will sleep with someone he isn’t married to.
Sex cannot be USED to bring someone closer or to commit. It is an expression of what already exists. Do not lie with your body.
Sex cannot be USED to bring someone closer or to commit. It is an expression of what already exists. Do not lie with your body.
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harrisunt
Guest
I have been struggling with this topic since I began my conversion to Catholicism. I just went online and purchased The Good News About Sex and Marriage, which was recommended in an earlier post. Being a bookworm, I think this book will do a great deal to steer me in the right direction.
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puzzleannie
Guest
very long post so maybe I missed the part about “we got married” before “we became sexually intimate”
sex is for marriage
marriage is for people who are ready to live together, to build a life together, to have a family.
if you are not there, you may not have sex, it is a privilege, not a right, does not go with “but we’re in love” it goes with “we are committed in a covenant publicly proclaimed before God, church and society lasting for life and open to life”
getting justification for wrongdoing from well meaning people, even priests, is not going to save you from the ill effects of pre-marital sex, which, as my generation, the first to experiment with the so-called freedoms (actually, chains) forged by the sexual revolution can attest with feeling and sad experience.
but how in blue blazes do you justify discussing sex life on a public internet site, let alone with your boyfriend’s mother, that blows me away even more. I guess I will ask my mothership to beam me back up to my home planet now.
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