Priest endorsing ordination of women in homily

[andersonbd1]

nah - I don’t think I’m gonna write the bishop again. I asked him a bunch of questions originally, which he didn’t answer. I included the priests reasoning in the letter. I feel like he just brushed it off. Nothing new was brought up in my meeting with the priest. I guess I should just let it go. If priests can just pick and choose which Catholic teachings they agree w/, then it’s a free for all isn’t it? I just feel deceived. I left the protestant faith and fell in love with the Catholicism I found in books, radio, TV, Church documents, etc. But, it seems that Catholicism that I came to love isn’t the same as the Catholicism taught down the street. Perhaps that’s the reality that everyone already lives with and my eyes have just been opened. I am disheartened. I just don’t see the point in learning anymore about the Church when any priest on a whim can just say, “well, that’s not what I believe”.

 

[mnealon1]

The issue of women ordinations I think will always be a thorny issue and remain with us. However I do agree with the statment of Pope John Paul on the subject. For me there are more pressing issues like some of our present Priests launching out with their own opinions contrary to the teachings of the Church. This only causes confusion, unrest, and instability, and unfortunately causing some people to throw their hands in the air and maybe give up.This is the very opposite to their own vows which they took at their own ordination, with such pride and love of God. It is terribly sad for us the lay people who depend on them for the word of God As Jesus taught it. In our present times we need more than ever to have a totally unified Church to hold on to, with Every priest of a unified opinion.
In Cannon Law 212#2 it states : The right to petition, that is to make known to one,superiors, (Pastors, Bishops and others) ones needs, especially one,s spiritual needs, as well as one,s hopes.
For myself if I had an issue which distressed me and caused me confusion I would write to the Bishop and then higher, and higher until I got a reasonable result. If the issue occured in a sermon in public I would have to think about all the other people going away confused along with myself and if not cleared up just left to fester.
I love Priests and Pray for them every day for God to strengthen and fortity them against the evil one who out to get them, because they are saving souls and put great temptaions in their way. So we need to Pray very hard for our Priests especially those who find it hard to be completly true to the teachings of Christ.

 

[andersonbd1]

The Saint Joseph Foundation got back to me in one day. They pretty much gave me all my options if I want to pursue anything. Seems like they’re really on top of things.

 

[Holland]

nah - I don’t think I’m gonna write the bishop again. I asked him a bunch of questions originally, which he didn’t answer. I included the priests reasoning in the letter. I feel like he just brushed it off. Nothing new was brought up in my meeting with the priest. I guess I should just let it go. If priests can just pick and choose which Catholic teachings they agree w/, then it’s a free for all isn’t it? I just feel deceived. I left the protestant faith and fell in love with the Catholicism I found in books, radio, TV, Church documents, etc. But, it seems that Catholicism that I came to love isn’t the same as the Catholicism taught down the street. Perhaps that’s the reality that everyone already lives with and my eyes have just been opened. I am disheartened. I just don’t see the point in learning anymore about the Church when any priest on a whim can just say, “well, that’s not what I believe”.

I have been in your position and it is disheartening isn’t it? I almost left the Church over the angst I felt every time I attended Mass at the local Church. It truly is a spiritually debilitating experience to attend Mass at a Church where most members do not know or want to know true Catholic teaching. I would try to find another Church to attend if you can. Continue to learn about the Catholic Church and above all pray for the priest where you attend Mass now.

 

[RobbyS]

Our priest every so often in his homilies often issues a scolding to the Church about not ordaining women and says he’s embarassed that it hasn’t happened yet. I recently asked him via a letter to keep his opinions out of the homily and stick with Church teaching. I referenced Ordinatio Sacerdotalis, but didn’t get too heavy on the argument because I figured he’d disagree anyways. Sure enough, he responded that the ordination of women is a discipline (not a doctrine) and that JP2 (among others) was wrong to say the decision is final… implying that eventually the Church will be liberated. I really don’t think the best strategy is to get into a debate, but maybe it is. Please don’t respond by telling me why the church should or shouldn’t ordain women. I already have lots of resources if debate is the way to go. I’m more interested in asking others what I should do. Should I just suck it up and try to ignore it? Or is it my duty to “do something”? Based on what I know of our bishop, I doubt he cares. That’s just my guess based on the little I know of him and it would be consistent with the extremely liberal seminary in our diocese, I’m at a loss for what to do. Of course I am praying a lot about it. I’m trying to discern whether I need more temperance or fortitude. I definitely need prudence in these matter. What do you think?

Argue with him, but cover yourself by sending a letter to the bishop with a CC to him. Try to get the bishop agree or disagree with his assertion that barring women from the priesthood is a matter of discipline alone, More than that, make him point to any time in Church history where women were ordained. My guess is that he has bought into the feminist/gnostic stuff and is basing his opinion on it. He may also be gay, so that would also feed his opinion.

 

[benedictgal]

I have been in your position and it is disheartening isn’t it? I almost left the Church over the angst I felt every time I attended Mass at the local Church. It truly is a spiritually debilitating experience to attend Mass at a Church where most members do not know or want to know true Catholic teaching. I would try to find another Church to attend if you can. Continue to learn about the Catholic Church and above all pray for the priest where you attend Mass now.

My dad has had a festering problem in our diocese. Without going into too much detail, he sent a certified letter to the bishop (return receipt requested). This letter was ignored. My father then wrote to the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments. About three weeks later, he received both the orange return receipt card and a letter of acknowledgment from the bishop.

Since this was in the context of the homily, and, if one hasn’t heard from the bishop, one could write to either the prefect for the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments or the prefect for the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. Either prefect should receive a copy of the original correspondence sent to both the priest and bishop. Rome may not act fast, but, she does act.

 

[RobbyS]

nah - I don’t think I’m gonna write the bishop again. I asked him a bunch of questions originally, which he didn’t answer. I included the priests reasoning in the letter. I feel like he just brushed it off. Nothing new was brought up in my meeting with the priest. I guess I should just let it go. If priests can just pick and choose which Catholic teachings they agree w/, then it’s a free for all isn’t it? I just feel deceived. I left the protestant faith and fell in love with the Catholicism I found in books, radio, TV, Church documents, etc. But, it seems that Catholicism that I came to love isn’t the same as the Catholicism taught down the street. Perhaps that’s the reality that everyone already lives with and my eyes have just been opened. I am disheartened. I just don’t see the point in learning anymore about the Church when any priest on a whim can just say, “well, that’s not what I believe”.

Should have read this first. No, don’t pack it in yet. What we are facing is a mild form of what has torn the Episcopal Church apart. Since 1965 there have been “modernists” who have been trying to get control of the Church. Many of them did leave the Church after 1968, but many stayed and worked to spread their doctrine in the Church, hoping to climb right up to the heights of power and impose their “new order” on the Church.

But the election of John Paul II was a great disappointment for them. He managed to stop them, but not overcome them. He worked against them by his teachings and by working on the people directly through his travels. The present pope become his strong right arms and together they began to push back.

But the modernists, or liberals remain very strong in the Church and they would love to take us down the same faith that their ilk has taken the Episcopal and most the mainline Protesant churches. The best thing is to arm yourself by reading the papal documents, and any of the books of John Paul II and Pope benedict, so they when you encounter one of these heretics–and your priest is one of them you can fight back.

Understand that the Church has always had people of his ilk, which is one reason for the Reformation. At the time of Luther there was a lot of rot and many saw the need for reform, men like St. Thomas More. But his school of reformers was for many years overshadowed by Luther, Zwingli, and Calvin and their followers. Eventually Catholic reformers succeded in taking over the government of the Church, but it was a long hard fight, and only began with the Council of Trent.

In short, the history of the Church has always been a history of civil war within the Church. Only because of the papacy has the whole edifice been kept from crumbling. To use another simile,
the barque of Peter offers a refuge from the ever turbulent seas, but there are always those on deck who would grab the rudder. It is no always clear who has that rudder, but Christ has promised us that the ship will stay on course and will not flounder. Protestants contend that the Bible provide a sure chart, but someone has to read that chart, and their history has them jumping ship into the lifebats going off in all directions at once, and then sinking out of sight.

 

[mabibleteacher]

There is a biblical model for resolving conflict within the church and it comes right from the mouth of Jesus.

In Matthew 18:15-16 it says " *If your brother sins against you go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over. But if he will not listen, take one or two others along, so that every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses. if he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church…" *

You should apply this model to your situation in this way:

First go to the priest, face to face, in private and tell him what you feel. This is not a finger pointing meeting. Just state your case and make your request. Do not threaten him, just ask him nicely and tell him why you feel the way you do.
If he does not see the problem he is creating and repent, then find two other members of your church, perferably ones who are long time members and know the church teachings well. Then the three of you go to him, face to face, in private and make the same request.
If he still does not see what he is doing wrong, then a letter should be sent to the Bishop from all three of you stating what is going on. You should let the Bishop know that you followed the model in Matthew 18 and still the priest did not repent.

God has set up this model of conflict resolution for a reason. It is to the benefit of the person committing the wrong act, to give them a chance to repent and ask forgiveness. It is also to the benefit of the person who has been wronged so it does not become a “it’s my word against yours” scenario.

Check out this website: oasiscc.ca/RESOURCES/Conflict_Resolution.pdf

Good Luck.

 

[dominikus28]

So has the fact that ONLY men can become priests been INFALLIBLY defined by the Catholic Church? Or is it still POSSIBLE that it may change and females will be able to be ordained?

 

[LutheranDK]

So has the fact that ONLY men can become priests been INFALLIBLY defined by the Catholic Church? Or is it still POSSIBLE that it may change and females will be able to be ordained?

Well, if I remember correctly, the previous pope was pretty clear on that subject. When he says that “the Church has no authority to ordain women” to the priesthood, doesn’t that settle the discussion?

Oh, well, I’m already in unknown waters here. Just a question…

 

[japhy]

So has the fact that ONLY men can become priests been INFALLIBLY defined by the Catholic Church? Or is it still POSSIBLE that it may change and females will be able to be ordained?

Pope John Paul II, in his 1994 document Ordinatio Sacerdotalis article 4, made it very clear:
Wherefore, in order that all doubt may be removed regarding a matter of great importance, a matter which pertains to the Church’s divine constitution itself, in virtue of my ministry of confirming the brethren (cf. Lk 22:32) I declare that the Church has no authority whatsoever to confer priestly ordination on women and that this judgment is to be definitively held by all the Church’s faithful.
Only a year later, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith reaffirmed that this teaching is indeed infallible:
In response to this precise act of the Magisterium of the Roman Pontiff, explicitly addressed to the entire Catholic Church, all members of the faithful are required to give their assent to the teaching stated therein. To this end, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, with the approval of the Holy Father, has given an official Reply on the nature of this assent; it is a matter of full definitive assent, that is to say, irrevocable, to a doctrine taught infallibly by the Church. In fact, as the Reply explains, the definitive nature of this assent derives from the truth of the doctrine itself, since, founded on the written Word of God, and constantly held and applied in the Tradition of the Church, it has been set forth infallibly by the ordinary universal Magisterium (cf. Lumen Gentium, 25). Thus, the Reply specifies that this doctrine belongs to the deposit of the faith of the Church.
The case should be closed. The money and effort and publicity and everything else being poured into the “women’s ordination” thing could be much better spent foster true vocations to the priesthood, or in charitable works for the poor and hungry, or in saving closing parishes.

 

[PJM]

Our priest every so often in his homilies often issues a scolding to the Church about not ordaining women and says he’s embarassed that it hasn’t happened yet. I recently asked him via a letter to keep his opinions out of the homily and stick with Church teaching. I referenced Ordinatio Sacerdotalis, but didn’t get too heavy on the argument because I figured he’d disagree anyways. Sure enough, he responded that the ordination of women is a discipline (not a doctrine) and that JP2 (among others) was wrong to say the decision is final…

That is a hertical statement and a lie! It must be challanged.

implying that eventually the Church will be liberated. I really don’t think the best strategy is to get into a debate, but maybe it is. Please don’t respond by telling me why the church should or shouldn’t ordain women. I already have lots of resources if debate is the way to go. I’m more interested in asking others what I should do. Should I just suck it up and try to ignore it? Or is it my duty to “do something”? Based on what I know of our bishop, I doubt he cares. That’s just my guess based on the little I know of him and it would be consistent with the extremely liberal seminary in our diocese, I’m at a loss for what to do. Of course I am praying a lot about it. I’m trying to discern whether I need more temperance or fortitude. I definitely need prudence in these matter. What do you think?

No, stick to the truth that you know to be true.

Write to your Bishop the next time it happens, documenting your previous letter to your priest.

Your call, but you might consider a “CC” to your priest of the Bishops letter. If he is not the pastor, make an appointment to meet with him, (the pastor) and present your case. Keep copies of all letters, calls and talks.

If that does not work,keep copies of your communications, and allow 30 day for the Bishops responce.

Next copy and send to the American Papal Nunico, in Washington DC, and to the currect Prefect for the Sacred Liturgy, in Rome.

Your cover letters should request that you please look into the following abuse. Send copies of your letter written to your priest, his responce, a copy of your letter written to the Bishop and his rsponce, and your name, address and phone number.

This is a hersey that he is holding on to and spreading!

His Holiness Pope John Paul II, said with great clarity, that Ordination is one of the Seven Sacraments Instituted by Christ, and “The Church” not “willnot” BUT CANNOT change it!

The other signifiant reason is physology. "This Is MY Body, This IS My Blood… " Jesus, indespuitability was Male Gender, therefore how could any female gender person, say the same words with the same meaning? Can’t be done. Thus the Church CANNOT change it!

His Holiness than very specifically proclaimed this as a Doctrine of the Church, to be accepted by all!

Don’t give up. God and truth are on your side!

Thanks for your efforts!

 

[benedictgal]

That is a hertical statement and a lie! It must be challanged.

No, stick to the truth that you know to be true.

Write to your Bishop the next time it happens, documenting your previous letter to your priest.

Your call, but you might consider a “CC” to your priest of the Bishops letter. If he is not the pastor, make an appointment to meet with him, (the pastor) and present your case. Keep copies of all letters, calls and talks.

If that does not work,keep copies of your communications, and allow 30 day for the Bishops responce.

Next copy and send to the American Papal Nunico, in Washington DC, and to the currect Prefect for the Sacred Liturgy, in Rome.

Your cover letters should request that you please look into the following abuse. Send copies of your letter written to your priest, his responce, a copy of your letter written to the Bishop and his rsponce, and your name, address and phone number.

This is a hersey that he is holding on to and spreading!

His Holiness Pope John Paul II, said with great clarity, that Ordination is one of the Seven Sacraments Instituted by Christ, and “The Church” not “willnot” BUT CANNOT change it!

The other signifiant reason is physology. "This Is MY Body, This IS My Blood… " Jesus, indespuitability was Male Gender, therefore how could any female gender person, say the same words with the same meaning? Can’t be done. Thus the Church CANNOT change it!

His Holiness than very specifically proclaimed this as a Doctrine of the Church, to be accepted by all!

Don’t give up. God and truth are on your side!

Thanks for your efforts!

The Apostolic Delegate will only forward your letter back to the bishop. The correct channel, according to Redemptionis Sacramentum, is to go to the Congregation for Divine Worship if you do not get recourse to the bishop.

You may contact them at:

His Eminence Antonio Cardinal Cañizares Llovera
Prefect, Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments
Palazzo delle Congregazioni
Piazza Pio XII, 10
00120 CITTÀ DEL VATICANO

Now, since this is also a doctrinal issue, you may also want to send a letter to the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith:

His Eminencde William Cardinal Levada
Prefect, Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith
Palazzo del Sant’Uffizio
00120 Città del Vaticano

When writing to either prefect or both, include copies of the correspondence that you have sent to the priest and/or bishop. When writing to the bishop, make sure that it is certified, return receipt requested. Send a copy of the certified receipt in your packet to the Prefect(s). When sending your packet, make sure that you also make that package certified, return receipt requested. Roughly three weeks after you send your letter, you will more than likely receive an orange card from the Holy See acknowledging that they have received your letter. Some days later, you will get a formal letter of receipt from the Congregation.

I hope this information helps.