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- Status
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cjforJesus
Guest
: Before I start to describe my own experience, perhaps it would be better to give a little detail about what Kundalini means. We are not using the totality of the human brain. According to various estimates, most of us use only ten percent of the brain and according to some only eight percent. That means 90 percent of the brain is unutilized, that there is still a large margin in the brain which could be used for other purposes, and nature has provided it for certain purposes which are not yet known to science. According to Indian tradition, there is a region in the brain below the crown and about the pallette which is called Brahmarendra or the cavity of Brahman. This region can be activated by certain disciplines and when activated it can give to the individual the same vision of the universe which all great mystics of the Earth have described. When it is awakened the normal energy of the body or the blood is not able to fuel the center. It needs a more powerful and constrained psychic fuel. This fuel comes from the reproductive system, which is transformed into a kind of radiation and that radiation awakens and makes the center function : From an interview with Gopi Krisha, and author who writes extensively
on kundalini and yoga.
According to Gopi Krishna Jesus Christ is just another prophet or “enlightened master” who evolved! YIKES and millions follow his writings blindly.This is eerily similar to the doctrines of theosophy which also promotes harnessing this obscure sexual energy.
according to this man kundalini is our savior and will guide the collective conscious into an advanced stage of evolution…
He also states that once this INTELLIGENT FORCE is aroused it cannot be controlled! It is total contradiction to the laws of free will which God gave to us.
Reading more on this topic I can clearly see why this type of spirituality is being promoted by our secular society and why Christianity is being viciously persecuted. Jesus said that we will be hated because the world hated Him first
on kundalini and yoga.
According to Gopi Krishna Jesus Christ is just another prophet or “enlightened master” who evolved! YIKES and millions follow his writings blindly.This is eerily similar to the doctrines of theosophy which also promotes harnessing this obscure sexual energy.
according to this man kundalini is our savior and will guide the collective conscious into an advanced stage of evolution…
He also states that once this INTELLIGENT FORCE is aroused it cannot be controlled! It is total contradiction to the laws of free will which God gave to us.
Reading more on this topic I can clearly see why this type of spirituality is being promoted by our secular society and why Christianity is being viciously persecuted. Jesus said that we will be hated because the world hated Him first
C
cjforJesus
Guest
I an beginning to understand what this priest meant as he was deeply involved in the new age.
Yoga just for exercise is not really true yoga because yoga means “yoking with the divine”.True yoga involves seeking occult powers and abilities.
Gopi Krishna was seeking an experience and he found it.There was nothing accidental or unknown about his encounter with kundalini.It was always expected though it nearly drove him insane. I found this excerpt from a book he wrote and he makes some absurd claims about semen leaking into the spinal fluid to fuel the awakened kundalini. I do not even know where to start regarding this contention.
It is sufficient to mention here that during the whole course of this (kundalini) transformation, in addition to the blood and other fuels present in the body, every particle of powerful reproductive fluid in the system is sucked up through the spinal canal to irrigate and feed the various nerve junctions and the brain. This entirely biological operation is carried out in such an unmistakeable way that even a novice in physiology cannot fail to notice it. The semen in men is now produced in such abundance that a tiny stream rises day and night through the spine into the cranium to provide the richest and the purest food for the now heavily overworked brain cells. In women, the sexual energy and secretions involved in erotics are used as the fuel. This is a perfect example of the forethought and ingenuity of nature to keep the body equipped with all the necessities to make the completion of the evolutionary process, normally needing eons to accomplish, possible in the short span of one life."
~ Gopi Krishna – The Biological Basis of Religion and Genius
Yoga just for exercise is not really true yoga because yoga means “yoking with the divine”.True yoga involves seeking occult powers and abilities.
Gopi Krishna was seeking an experience and he found it.There was nothing accidental or unknown about his encounter with kundalini.It was always expected though it nearly drove him insane. I found this excerpt from a book he wrote and he makes some absurd claims about semen leaking into the spinal fluid to fuel the awakened kundalini. I do not even know where to start regarding this contention.
It is sufficient to mention here that during the whole course of this (kundalini) transformation, in addition to the blood and other fuels present in the body, every particle of powerful reproductive fluid in the system is sucked up through the spinal canal to irrigate and feed the various nerve junctions and the brain. This entirely biological operation is carried out in such an unmistakeable way that even a novice in physiology cannot fail to notice it. The semen in men is now produced in such abundance that a tiny stream rises day and night through the spine into the cranium to provide the richest and the purest food for the now heavily overworked brain cells. In women, the sexual energy and secretions involved in erotics are used as the fuel. This is a perfect example of the forethought and ingenuity of nature to keep the body equipped with all the necessities to make the completion of the evolutionary process, normally needing eons to accomplish, possible in the short span of one life."
~ Gopi Krishna – The Biological Basis of Religion and Genius
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simple_soul
Guest
CjforJesus, I have been thinking/dwelling on your posts in this thread and have gone back and reread a few of them. It seems to me you are “hell bent” on proving that for one to be a mystic it means it is evil. Why are you doing this? From what I understand, and you agreed 100% with, is that Mystisism is a gift from God. To me this means that no matter how corruptly it was “forced” or how corruptly one uses this gift it is still a gift from God. Do you not agree with this? If not why? How can Mystisism be a gift from satan if we know it is a gift from God. Now in saying this please keep in mind that I beleive I know and understand that this Beautiful gift from God can be illicitly obtained, I beleive that is why the Church in her wisdom condemns trying to obtain it in the ways you are describing certain souls to have done, and I also know how this Gift from God can be used for evil. Heck just look at Satan and how he uses his Gifts from God. I also believe I know and understand how it can be manipulated and “controlled” be others to make it seem like it is from. Satan instead of a gift from God. I’m not sure about you but I am beginning to believe you speak with a forked tounge. I am beginning to beleive that you are one of hose who wants to try and manipulate and control this Gift from God. Why are you doing this?
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cjforJesus
Guest
Not all mystical experiences are from God.Read St John of the Cross,and also St Thomas Aquinas who both warn about it. I think St Teresa also cautions people about spiritual pride too.
I do not believe this kundalini arousal to be anything spiritual but probably a deception. Read the absurd claims of Gopi Krisha concerning how this force is fueled! However he channeled these writings they are not holy but very secular and worldly. How can someone believe that this "force is fueled by semen or vaginal fluid that gets into the spine. That almost sounds psychotic. As far as I know the brain is fueled by glucose.
I think mysticism is a special gift and I have only met one person who was raised to contemplation. She was the most gentle modest woman ever and she never told anyone but me about her experience.She was not even sure what it was. Humility is a true sign of someone spiritually advanced.
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simple_soul
Guest
I do beleive you are missing what I am trying to say. Either deliberatly or indeliberatly and I will have to just leave that between you and God. Take care of youself and stay close to Him and please say a few prayers for me.
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Sephero
Guest
I would think meditation, without words, bringing your attention to your sense of existence, is direct communion with God.
How could it not be? God is existence itself, the very being of your being. The feeling of existence that you have, is from God, the Heart of your Being, is Gods being, you have no Being of your own.
So, if I bring my attention, to that sense of Existence, and abide there in, am I not abiding in God?
Where is the room for evil forces to come in? I am focusing my attention, on Existence, Being, I am looking at what is looking, or simply looking at that which IS, God is what IS.
“What you are looking for is what is looking.”
Saint Francis of Assisi (c. 1181 - 1226)
I believe Jesus Christ is I AM, this Existence, this Being of our Being. But I also believe that anyone that comes to this place in devotion, and in search for Truth is finding the same One.
I agree, that some meditations done with invocations, etc may open you to unwanted forces, but simple meditation focusing on Being/Existence without words, I find hard to believe this would bring any harm, you are focusing on God.
Perhaps someone can try to explain how this could be any other way? I’m hoping it doesn’t involve much philosophy, otherwise the simplicity of it, of approaching God is marred.
I am someone who loves Jesus, and wishes to know Him better and more. I am possibly on my return to the Chuch, but the above is what I have learned on my travels.
Mark
How could it not be? God is existence itself, the very being of your being. The feeling of existence that you have, is from God, the Heart of your Being, is Gods being, you have no Being of your own.
So, if I bring my attention, to that sense of Existence, and abide there in, am I not abiding in God?
Where is the room for evil forces to come in? I am focusing my attention, on Existence, Being, I am looking at what is looking, or simply looking at that which IS, God is what IS.
“What you are looking for is what is looking.”
Saint Francis of Assisi (c. 1181 - 1226)
I believe Jesus Christ is I AM, this Existence, this Being of our Being. But I also believe that anyone that comes to this place in devotion, and in search for Truth is finding the same One.
I agree, that some meditations done with invocations, etc may open you to unwanted forces, but simple meditation focusing on Being/Existence without words, I find hard to believe this would bring any harm, you are focusing on God.
Perhaps someone can try to explain how this could be any other way? I’m hoping it doesn’t involve much philosophy, otherwise the simplicity of it, of approaching God is marred.
I am someone who loves Jesus, and wishes to know Him better and more. I am possibly on my return to the Chuch, but the above is what I have learned on my travels.
Mark
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JimR-OCDS
Guest
You’re on the path toward contemplation, which is where God is drawing you to.
Centered In Christ Jesus
Jim
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friardchips
Guest
There is only one real Creator. And abiding in Him is what He asks (as you said) - by coming to Him in prayer and thanksgiving.
And this is why Yoga is unnecessary. Sorry if this doesn’t float your boat. Because if Yoga just incorporated sitting there resting in His peace quietly then Yoga would be fine. But then that would not be Yoga. The reality is that there are all these fancy stretches that are understood to be used as ways of reaching Him in order to draw down grace - and this is Yoga. As if He is simply a robotic grace-dispenser. This is not to say He doesn’t but that He gives us this grace as and when He decides and in whatever amounts He chooses. We do not draw down graces! We go to Him in prayer and He, in relationship, gives us what we need.
For the non-Christian to practice Yoga is quite understandable and I can quite see why they have such systems; however, for Christians to do Yoga is unnecessary. They would probably achieve more by sitting quietly than sticking their bums in the air and chanting using funny noises.
The fact that all these other philosophies can come with it don’t exactly help either. And if they are included then distractions - as you said - can occur. And also interference too. And considering that satan tends to prize Christians as special meat leaves Yoga as a method of ‘contact’ that is asking for trouble.
Take care.
This is an old thread, btw…if you’re interested why not start a new one?
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Sephero
Guest
I wasn’t so much addressing Yoga or whether it was necessary or not, I understand it not to be necessary. I was more addressing this fear that I think is misplaced by some people here, that if you simply remain quite, without thought, still the mind, and abide in Being, that you are somehow opening yourself to Demonic influences. Which is what some people are saying here.
I simply think that this is wrong, and actually is making people fearful, essentially of their own Self, and Existence, and approaching God in pure Silence.
In a nut shell, are we saying we simply can’t just be, be without thought, or else we will become possessed? Some people are essentially saying this on this thread. Including the person who quoted Our Lady saying “Let the devil find no emptiness in you”
Personally I think abiding in pure silence, with the odd thought, of ‘God’ to bring you back to silence, is very much paramount to a spiritual life.
Following from this you mention Yoga. Yoga simply means, Union, to be united with God, at one with God, and so on.
“Yoga is the removal of the fluctuations of the mind” as described by Patanjali, one of the first people to systematise Yoga. This in essence, is also known as being Still (and know that I am God), or the removal of thoughts, to remain in Silence. However, what is widely known by most people who try to do this, is that it is quite a task to remain quiet/still, resting in our Being. So the rest of the systems of Yoga, is essentially methods of achieving this aim. Again the aim is yoga/union/communion with God, by the way of resting in Silence/Being/I am.
One part of the system deals with exercises which cleanse the body/mind system, so as to allow for long periods of restful Silence. As we know the mind/body is a complex system, and the exercises are used to balance this system. Just like we know how going for a good run in fresh air, will leave us feeling de-stressed, and calmer. This would allow us to more easily enter into Silence/Being longer, then if we were just to try to enter into it totally stressed out. The stretches and poses are a more subtle way of distressing the body, and in turn the mind, which in turn allows for deeper contemplation.
Another aspect is the focused attention on a point, to make the mind sharper, again aiding in contemplation.
Some sort of these exercises can be seen in the lives of some Saints, the strict disciplining of the body, the focused attention on an Icon, chanting etc.
The aim of Yoga, was always to come into Union with God, and as you said there is only one Creator God, and people of the Orient as much as anyone else in the world wanted to commune with God, this was their way of doing so, they knew to enter into Silence/Being, into contemplation was to still the mind, they realised that in itself was a very hard thing to do, so they went about trying to discover methods to still the mind, focus the mind better. Realising the body was connected with the mind, they sought to cleanse and clear there body, eating only very healthy food, fasting etc. Knowing the mind was prone to wandering, they came up with things to focus the mind on for longer periods of time, a fix point, or sound.
I think it is important to appreciate and respect peoples attempt to get to know their God, and to come to him. They wanted to know the Supreme Being, their Creator, God, of which there is only one, and they were looking for Him, this was their means.
Having said that I do understand that, like any other system, that it can be used for evil purposes. Meaning, that if one goes into it expecting special powers, or experiences other than a pure heart to know God, then most likely you will be attracting unwanted attention. However this is NOT recommended by most Sages of the Orient, they repeatedly warn that ‘Siddhis’ are a block to Union.
As for the western version of ‘Yoga’ it’s just like an alternate version of Pilates.
My view on all this in relation to Christ, is that, and my Theology might be off now, is that since we are aware of and know that their is The Holy Spirit now, as it was explicitly declared by Jesus, we simply invoke The Holy Spirit now, or Jesus, and attempt to enter into Contemplation that way. Having said that there has never been a time when the Holy Spirit has not been at work, and Pope John Paul II, has spoken of this in Crossing the Threshold of Hope. I suspect the Holy Spirit worked in those God Fearing, loving, pure of heart Indians of times past, and present.
Thank you for your reply Tom, I hope so.
p.s The thread is not that old, and I wish to communicate to those people who have been watching, and replying to this particular thread. I do not feel the need to start a whole new topic. Many thanks.
p.p.s Jesus also is quite often depicted making different Mudras.
Mark.
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friardchips
Guest
Silence is a big part of Christian understanding. This is what contemplative life is about. I agree with you that contemplation does not automatically open oneself up to the demonic. Yoga is a different matter to Christian contemplation.
Maybe what the person meant who possibly quoted Our Lady, is that we are not to remain in idle state. This is especially true of when people have gotten rid of demons, because if we don’t do anything to fill the void left after they’re gone - with grace - then they come back and are worse than before.
The word ‘emptying’ is a tricky one. In Christian mantras it is okay to led the mind be still, and I used to think one could empty the mind, now I would put it is resting the mind. I think there’ a difference in meaning there. One can have distractions during meditation but to fight them in order to empty the mind I think could be incorrect; rather, let the distractions come, as they could be what is on the mind for our Creator to heal, but instead of concentrating on the distractions, we rest in the Spirit. So we are not facing the distractions. This I think is the difference between ‘resting’ and ‘emptying’ (possibly).
Silence of the mind is good, surely?!
Maybe it does but in practice this is not what the term ‘Yoga’ means. And ‘union’ in eastern non-Christian religions means something different to how people interpret ‘union’ from a Catholic perspective.
Yes, but we do not need to actively remove, or do anything of a vigorous nature, in particular. To have to do stuff to fight distractions doesn’t seem trusting. Everything is in our Creator’s Hands. This is the difference. Yoga simply ‘forces’ out one’s distraction with another subtler one - activity and a reliance on some equilibrium of mind - without necessarily finding the Creator but some hyper sense of something.
Emptying is almost aggressive whereas resting is trustful.
…
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friardchips
Guest
I feel uncomfortable with the term ‘cleansing’ unless it is cleansing in the form of Sacraments.
Balance, to pray?! Who says that this balancing affects prayer? One can pray while doing the washing up if need be.
Then stretch if need be. No big deal. But this doesn’t affect prayer in the wider sense. Not that it is bad to relax but grace doesn’t come from feelings. Feelings are consolation. Yoga however, is more than just stretching, and we know this, because if it weren’t, then people would not seek Yoga websites, books and trainers to learn about it. They would simply reach their arms out, yawn, maybe give the legs a stretch and get on with it. No flamboyant twirls in lycra needed.
Christians have Scripture. We understand Scripture to contain The Word. No need to make the mind sharp. Grace does this.
Christian discipline, meditation and prayer are different to yoga.
St. Therese of Avila, said that the use of holy imagery was helpful for mediation. I agree. And music can be an aid too.
- I’m okay with everything in this paragraph up to here, but:
That word ‘cleanse’ again.
Christians participate in fasting - this is more about denying the flesh and world.
Not that eating healthily is bad for natural reasons but perfectionism in the worldly sense is a bit of a bore in (real) Christianity.
I don’t think there is anything wrong with that. Praying calmly is helpful. But it shouldn’t be the centre point. I would even go further and suggest that in order this need for absolute quiet and focus does not become an idolatry, to open the windows which might let some noise in sometimes, in order that the trust is in the Creator, not in one’s self or surroundings.
I like this paragraph. Absolutely. We are always to respect other people’s reach for the Divine. And there is a lot of ‘sense’ to some of their systems.
Exactly. I agree.
They obviously know something then. Although we can expect power, the power of love, even if we can’t feel it. Not that we will necessarily feel consolation; in fact, we might even experience desolation.
We sit with Him in His presence. There are Christian mantras. I sometimes wonder why people don’t enter deeper into their Christian heritage and treasury of faith first before looking into other more indirect means.
I think He is always with people it is just whether they recognise and are with Him.
As you wish.
Cool.
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friardchips
Guest
Cat just hit the comp. button and pasted my post. So…edited.
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Sephero
Guest
You see the foundational aims are the same, this is what I am getting at.
Yoga seeks union with God (There is only one), so that they may know God, and become liberated(to be set free, ‘I have come to set the captives free’).
Jesus Christ was One with the Father. Now I am not suggesting that Jesus was just another Yogi, not at all, but I do believe that in Jesus Christ the Yogi found his ideal, even if Jesus Christ had not been born yet.
In order to do this, they knew to enter into Silence, there are not many kinds of Silence, whether resting/emptying or otherwise, Silence is Silence which ever way you look at it.
This is essentially the same thing we do when we do ‘Christian’ meditation, there is no difference, both Traditions are talking about coming to the same place, and staying there, the I AM.
How can we argue that doing this is not the same thing?
You seem to have issues with ‘cleansing’. It is simply taking care of the more subtle aspects of your being. If I get a tare in the muscle in my leg, it is not going to get better unless I work it out with some therapy, that I administer to myself. While I am disabled from moving, I may be more agitated, and prone to anger, and all sorts of other unwanted mental states. The Yogi, is simply taking this one step further, they know that to keep ones self totally healthy and in a balanced state of mind, is a much more subtle affair.
They have spent thousand of years developing a science about the bodies natural inner workings, just like modern science has discovered by means of the telescope the nervous systems and all it’s intricacies, the Yogi has found similar things by turning their minds (Gods gift) inwards. Using their minds in this fantastic manner is as legitimate as using our minds in a logical, discursive manor, or in an artistic way. The minds and discoveries of these Yogis should be considered as valid as any of the thoughts or creations of people like Plato, or Da Vinci.
My point being, that they discovered these things, and realised that balancing these systems, led to a calmer more joyful mind, and state of being. Which in turn led them to deeper contemplation in Silence. Think of someone with a shot nervous system from a high pressure work life, or some one who is just after walking away from a car crash, do you think this person is going to be able to just sit down calmly and enter in contemplation?
The reason we have hermits, and reclusive Saints, is because Nature does a lot of this kind of balancing for us, and it is why we find Nature so pleasing to be immersed in. So the Yogis basically made a science of discovering the subtle aspects of our being, and developed ways to balance them.
I understand where you are coming from with the Sacraments, but like the the example of the injured leg, they Sacraments won’t do your therapy for you, you have to do it yourself, they may in some miraculous event actually do it for you, but most likely you have to do it. So the same was for those people at the time, especially since they did not have the Sacraments. They went about finding out how to achieve the best state possible, to be more readily able to enter into deep Silence.
Again I am not claiming that all Yoga is safe, I’m simply showing that Yoga done in the right direction with a pure heart, with the aim to know God, is what a lot of sincere people of ancient times and modern times were try to do with Yoga.
My entire journey now is attempting to understand the uniqueness of Jesus Christ, and to try understand the Catholic Church.
I feel that people who were resting in Silence looking for God, were ‘taking heaven by storm’, but with the advent of Jesus Christ, it was made clear where heaven is and resides, in Him, but that that is also everywhere Now, as I am.
I see it as man ascending to heaven in the Yogis, and I see heaven coming to man in Jesus Christ.
Again, theology might be way off, but I am only learning about the Church now.
I don’t know if you would be interested, but there is a book called ‘Meditations on the Tarot’, it’s not a book in divination, but a book that looks at the doctrines, and theology of the Catholic church in a more esoteric way. Very interesting, and in case you are worried that it is anti-Catholic, it has a forward by Hans Urs von Balthasar. Though definitely, not everything in it is Catholic in its most fundamental sense. Still it is an exceptional read.
I just think the whole, everything else is demonic bar the Catholic church, is not a great way of looking at the world, it makes it seem totally disturbing if we were to look at it like that. What about Holy people of other religions like, Judaism, or Islam? Can their not be very Holy God loving people in those religions, or are they are demoniacally led astray also? (This probably is a whole other thread here)
Have a lovely weekend,
God Bless
Mark
Yoga seeks union with God (There is only one), so that they may know God, and become liberated(to be set free, ‘I have come to set the captives free’).
Jesus Christ was One with the Father. Now I am not suggesting that Jesus was just another Yogi, not at all, but I do believe that in Jesus Christ the Yogi found his ideal, even if Jesus Christ had not been born yet.
In order to do this, they knew to enter into Silence, there are not many kinds of Silence, whether resting/emptying or otherwise, Silence is Silence which ever way you look at it.
This is essentially the same thing we do when we do ‘Christian’ meditation, there is no difference, both Traditions are talking about coming to the same place, and staying there, the I AM.
How can we argue that doing this is not the same thing?
You seem to have issues with ‘cleansing’. It is simply taking care of the more subtle aspects of your being. If I get a tare in the muscle in my leg, it is not going to get better unless I work it out with some therapy, that I administer to myself. While I am disabled from moving, I may be more agitated, and prone to anger, and all sorts of other unwanted mental states. The Yogi, is simply taking this one step further, they know that to keep ones self totally healthy and in a balanced state of mind, is a much more subtle affair.
They have spent thousand of years developing a science about the bodies natural inner workings, just like modern science has discovered by means of the telescope the nervous systems and all it’s intricacies, the Yogi has found similar things by turning their minds (Gods gift) inwards. Using their minds in this fantastic manner is as legitimate as using our minds in a logical, discursive manor, or in an artistic way. The minds and discoveries of these Yogis should be considered as valid as any of the thoughts or creations of people like Plato, or Da Vinci.
My point being, that they discovered these things, and realised that balancing these systems, led to a calmer more joyful mind, and state of being. Which in turn led them to deeper contemplation in Silence. Think of someone with a shot nervous system from a high pressure work life, or some one who is just after walking away from a car crash, do you think this person is going to be able to just sit down calmly and enter in contemplation?
The reason we have hermits, and reclusive Saints, is because Nature does a lot of this kind of balancing for us, and it is why we find Nature so pleasing to be immersed in. So the Yogis basically made a science of discovering the subtle aspects of our being, and developed ways to balance them.
I understand where you are coming from with the Sacraments, but like the the example of the injured leg, they Sacraments won’t do your therapy for you, you have to do it yourself, they may in some miraculous event actually do it for you, but most likely you have to do it. So the same was for those people at the time, especially since they did not have the Sacraments. They went about finding out how to achieve the best state possible, to be more readily able to enter into deep Silence.
Again I am not claiming that all Yoga is safe, I’m simply showing that Yoga done in the right direction with a pure heart, with the aim to know God, is what a lot of sincere people of ancient times and modern times were try to do with Yoga.
My entire journey now is attempting to understand the uniqueness of Jesus Christ, and to try understand the Catholic Church.
I feel that people who were resting in Silence looking for God, were ‘taking heaven by storm’, but with the advent of Jesus Christ, it was made clear where heaven is and resides, in Him, but that that is also everywhere Now, as I am.
I see it as man ascending to heaven in the Yogis, and I see heaven coming to man in Jesus Christ.
Again, theology might be way off, but I am only learning about the Church now.
I don’t know if you would be interested, but there is a book called ‘Meditations on the Tarot’, it’s not a book in divination, but a book that looks at the doctrines, and theology of the Catholic church in a more esoteric way. Very interesting, and in case you are worried that it is anti-Catholic, it has a forward by Hans Urs von Balthasar. Though definitely, not everything in it is Catholic in its most fundamental sense. Still it is an exceptional read.
I just think the whole, everything else is demonic bar the Catholic church, is not a great way of looking at the world, it makes it seem totally disturbing if we were to look at it like that. What about Holy people of other religions like, Judaism, or Islam? Can their not be very Holy God loving people in those religions, or are they are demoniacally led astray also? (This probably is a whole other thread here)
Have a lovely weekend,
God Bless
Mark
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friardchips
Guest
But isn’t the “I AM” of Yoga impersonal?
It is not a bad thing to be healthy and yet the practical side of the Christian spiritual life is to offer up suffering not to avoid it unless it is essentially needed to be avoided. Joy in everything. Not that we wish suffering upon ourselves. But that sanctification via suffering in Christian terms is not just Orthodox old-hat but the very means of enjoining ourselves to the Via Dolorosa. Christianity is not pacifism and it is not escapism. Rather, we enter into all, and accept all. But we don’t renounce that which we know to be true (hopefully).
There may be cures. Some of this seems beneficial for medical reasons but I am concerned about some of these methods. Energy makes its way up (or down?) through the nervous system and while this can be healing - apparently - when certain ‘channeling’ is carried out, the worry is the side effects and too the difficulty in regulating this force. The problem is partly, who endorses the Yogi as a brain surgeon-level expert! However, more needs to be looked into, on this subject alone. IMO.
Seems aggressive. And Christianity is not so much about “turning the mind inwards” as it is about relationship, encounter, and trust. This is both inward AND outward. In a way, they are not separate. But in relation.
It depends on why they are doing this. And what they purport or claim from their experiences and skills. And to what degree such work induces power over another and whether this power is a legitimate use of the faculties in regard to the freedom of the will the participant has during the process.
It sounds great and also as if there is a whole bunch of info. missing from that you’ve said. Silence is not the same in every respect. And the state of a calm mind is not the same in every respect. It seems erratic in a subtle way. If they find the Creator in the ‘silence’ then great. I’m not going to argue with that. But I think there is more to this process and end result than is recorded in your post.
Yes.
As Aquinas said: “Grace builds upon nature” (or something!). Nice.
Well, if resting in nature made the saints saints then why not just do that, and rest.
Sure, our Creator works both ways, though both ways can come from Him, initially.
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friardchips
Guest
…
There is room for dialogue.
Will probably look further into other belief systems as time goes on but tend to do these things as needs present themselves. I already see many links to the Christian religion in other faiths but always take holy Scripture as the foundation point and bring any ideas back to Scripture
You too!
Sure, no one is doubting that.
There is room for dialogue.Sure, all is in Him. It is not that all of Creation is not of Him, because all of Creation came through Him, and most are trying to find Him, if not all even though they don’t know it, and using all sorts of means, to finding the meaning of true happiness. But not all routes are the best. I am not saying that other religions do not contain some truth or are completely invalid, because they are not invalid. But when people have found where the Creator truly resides in the closest ways possible, then this shouldn’t be forsaken for other means. It is a different matter for those who are so firmly rooted in the Catholic faith that they have taken it upon themselves to build bridges of dialogue with other belief systems. Even then, I’d say that definite and purposeful communication with the Catholic Church is sensible, when proceeding into such areas. To remain on firm Rock.
Pray about it.
Your have open arms for all people, evidently, and this is something very Christian.
Thanks. Sounds exciting. Yes, the word ‘tarot’ makes it less than appealing so I won’t be reading it.
Will probably look further into other belief systems as time goes on but tend to do these things as needs present themselves. I already see many links to the Christian religion in other faiths but always take holy Scripture as the foundation point and bring any ideas back to Scripture Agreed. However, evil does exist, so we have to discern. The existence of one thing does not automatically mean extremes in everything else though.
Yes, a whole new thread. I think holy people can come from many religions. Some might not be!
You too!
M
Michael_Mayo
Guest
The “I AM” of yoga is not so much impersonal as it is universal. We all and everything is “I Am” in most yoga philosophy. But there are many schools of yoga philosophy. One that I think is compatible with Christianity is called Vishishtadvaita or qualified nondualism. That yoga is not as monistic as Advaita or strict non-dualism. In Vishishtadvaita all the plurality we see is just as real as the unity it shares. So the “I AM” of that yoga is the “I AM” of who I am in God which is ultimately mystery. My individuality and need for God is just as real as the “ut unum sint” Jesus spoke of in the Gospel of John 17:21 that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us,.
Praise be to God Most High!
F
friardchips
Guest
Happy Saturday!The “I AM” of yoga is not so much impersonal as it is universal. We all and everything is “I Am” in most yoga philosophy. But there are many schools of yoga philosophy. One that I think is compatible with Christianity is called Vishishtadvaita or qualified nondualism. That yoga is not as monistic as Advaita or strict non-dualism. In Vishishtadvaita all the plurality we see is just as real as the unity it shares. So the “I AM” of that yoga is the “I AM” of who I am in God which is ultimately mystery. My individuality and need for God is just as real as the “ut unum sint” Jesus spoke of in the Gospel of John 17:21 that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us,.
Praise be to God Most High!
(I’m sure your avatar changed for a few days but you look back to normal again?!).I’m interested to see the dialogue between you guys. Not an absolute (pun intended) expert on these things myself so will have to be a silent participant!
M
Michael_Mayo
Guest
I haven’t been here in a couple of days but because of your comment I want to my profile page and there is an avatar of our little dog. Funny it is not on my posts.Happy Saturday!
I’m interested to see the dialogue between you guys. Not an absolute (pun intended) expert on these things myself so will have to be a silent participant!
M
Michael_Mayo
Guest
I think the arguments are in the interpretations of that “place”. Buddhists see it as impersonal, Christians as supremely personal relationship of the believer and God, Some yogis as complete unity in God or merging, classical yoga as an isolation. “solitude”, “detachment” “liberation” or “isolation”, (Kaivalya)en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaivalya
4.26 Then the mind is inclined towards the highest discrimination, and gravitates towards absolute liberation between seer and seen.
(tada viveka nimnam kaivalya pragbharam chittam)
swamij.com/yoga-sutras-42226.htm
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