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Light_Seeker
Guest
Check out some Russian Santa’s. We have a few - they’re beautiful blends between Santa & St Nicholas.
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Jennifer_J
Guest
This is a bit of a tangent from the topic, but I found this while looking for St Nicholas statues:
stnicholascenter.org/Brix?pageID=618
They are going exactly opposite of what I would like–nice orthadox statues to Santa! yikes
stnicholascenter.org/Brix?pageID=618
They are going exactly opposite of what I would like–nice orthadox statues to Santa! yikes
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Light_Seeker
Guest
Jennifer, we’ve had different opinions on this thread … but I’m with you here. This is truly sad.
Yeah. The latest statue is kind of a reach.
But on a more positive note the St. Nicholas Center website www.stnicholascenter.org is a favorite of mine. I check it out several times a year to see if they have anything new.
But on a more positive note the St. Nicholas Center website www.stnicholascenter.org is a favorite of mine. I check it out several times a year to see if they have anything new.
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whatevergirl
Guest
I wish I knew you when my kids believed, and were little…because I actually like this ‘explanation’ the best…and best of all, it is absolutely true. Thanks for this post.I agree with you. I hardly even say Santa, I almost always say St Nicholas when we see a man in a red suit. Our school recently had a fund raiser at Barnes and Nobles and we had St Nicholas there handing out prayer cards and candy canes (in public!
) and speaking about who St Nicholas is. If we ever hope to take back Christmas and Santa, we have to relate it to who Santa REALLY is–I guess all the North Pole, elves and such bug me more than anything anymore. I read the article posted and I don’t disagree that fairy tales and fantasy are important, but I think for various children it can be harmful to perpetuate the fantasy of Santa–maybe to excess or beyond when the child should be moving on. If the child is asking questions, perhaps that’s the time we need to move on to the next step–instead of “insisting” they believe…?
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HouseArrest
Guest
I think once they “figure it out” there is no going back. I don’t know anyone that tries to convice their kids, either, after they know, that would just be futile.I agree with you. I hardly even say Santa, I almost always say St Nicholas when we see a man in a red suit
We do Santa. We have a St. Nicholas movie that we watch over and over at Christmas time, and I tell the kids that Santa IS Saint Nicholas. After awhile of course they don’t believe it, or the reindeer, or the sleigh. The oldest 2 know, for heaven’s sake they are 13 and 11. I think the 9 year old believes but the 7 year old is figuring it out. But we don’t go around talking about it - I really believe in keeping the spirit of Santa or St. Nick alive. I know a lot of parents who, after their kids stop believing, discuss the gifts they’ll get, do a little “bargaining”, get only cash, open everything on December 23rd so they can use it, etc. Not here - the only difference now is that I am Santa, or St. Nick. There will always be present hiding and a secret list of mine. Even when they’re 30.
As far as the poor kids - no matter how much we have there is someone with more. It’s true for all of us. My little kids ask (like the 5 year old, and I’m not telling her there’s no Santa…) why some kids get more. I say that Santa brings everyone a little bit more than what they are used to having. For some families that means enough food so there won’t be any toys. That’s why we get them some.
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Lee_M
Guest
Report him to the bishop for telling the truth?I’m sorry, but priests can be wrong in their actions, and for him to do that to the kids in his congregation was just obnoxious!
Commercialism or no commercialism, Coca Cola or Royal Crown, he had no right to undermine parents that way. If he doesn’t apologize, please write your bishop.
I lean on both sides of the fence with this issue. My youngest daughter still believes in Santa, but I wonder if sometimes it is bad by participating in this lie. I was devastated when I found out that there was no Santa. I think it would be easier if it never got started. Kids will still be anxious about Christmas with or without Santa.The problem I have with Santa is that there are kids who go to school. We all know that there are rich families, middle class families, and poor families. How does the kid in the poor family feel when he/she has been good all year and doesn’t receive much or anything and then there is the kid sitting across the room who received half the toy store from Santa. The message that this sends is not good.
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Litcrit
Guest
We’re, I guess, just different people with different personalities and different notions of how *literal *the truth we hear and tell must be. That’s why Santa is so divisive - because he’s borderline between myth and actuality.
No one would suggest we stop reading and telling stories to our children, or playing with them, taking them to the theatre, or letting them watch cartoons. These are all things that are literally not factual, but there is always a medium, a barrier between them and actuality - you open a book, say “Once upon a time”, turn the TV on, use toys or costumes, say “Let’s play doctors/school/whatever”. Santa, OTOH, comes into contact with actuality, because he supposedly comes to the child’s very house and brings the gift the child gets - a tangible, material item.
Some people don’t feel this difference between these degrees of fiction, or they don’t mind it, and they are the ones who can do Santa and they were probably the kids who liked believing in Santa and didn’t feel lied to.
I’m just a different sort of person with a maniacal need for facts. I could never do Santa. I confronted my parents on the subject of Santa when I was 4 and they confessed. I felt betrayed and lied to. I expected my parents to always tell me the truth. There are so many things to be discovered about the world, and when you’re misinformed, you lose precious time, and are sidetracked, see?
I told my 2yo daughter “This is Santa. There’s a story that he brings presents etc.” I informed her about the myth, like I will inform her about Zeus, Hamlet, and Penelope, but I will never claim that, e.g., thunder comes from Zeus.
Just to illustrate how maniacal I am: when dd was 21 months old, she wanted to go to a neighbor’s house at 11.30 PM. She wouldn’t understand “It is not appropriate to visit at this late hour”, so I said “The neighbor’s sleeping… probably.” She most probably *was *asleep, but I didn’t know that for a fact, so I had to add “probably” in order not to lie.
People like me should not be made to feel guilty for denying magic to our children - I’m very much into literature , so my kids will have lots of fantasy and fiction in their lives, it’s just that I won’t claim they’re facts. Similarly, people who don’t feel this distinction as acutely shouldn’t be judged for doing Santa, if they don’t have kids like me and sanctamaria17 (who I sometimes think is my long-lost twin, and ignore the fact that she’s 6 years younger )
No one would suggest we stop reading and telling stories to our children, or playing with them, taking them to the theatre, or letting them watch cartoons. These are all things that are literally not factual, but there is always a medium, a barrier between them and actuality - you open a book, say “Once upon a time”, turn the TV on, use toys or costumes, say “Let’s play doctors/school/whatever”. Santa, OTOH, comes into contact with actuality, because he supposedly comes to the child’s very house and brings the gift the child gets - a tangible, material item.
Some people don’t feel this difference between these degrees of fiction, or they don’t mind it, and they are the ones who can do Santa and they were probably the kids who liked believing in Santa and didn’t feel lied to.
I’m just a different sort of person with a maniacal need for facts. I could never do Santa. I confronted my parents on the subject of Santa when I was 4 and they confessed. I felt betrayed and lied to. I expected my parents to always tell me the truth. There are so many things to be discovered about the world, and when you’re misinformed, you lose precious time, and are sidetracked, see?
I told my 2yo daughter “This is Santa. There’s a story that he brings presents etc.” I informed her about the myth, like I will inform her about Zeus, Hamlet, and Penelope, but I will never claim that, e.g., thunder comes from Zeus.
Just to illustrate how maniacal I am: when dd was 21 months old, she wanted to go to a neighbor’s house at 11.30 PM. She wouldn’t understand “It is not appropriate to visit at this late hour”, so I said “The neighbor’s sleeping… probably.” She most probably *was *asleep, but I didn’t know that for a fact, so I had to add “probably” in order not to lie.
People like me should not be made to feel guilty for denying magic to our children - I’m very much into literature
, so my kids will have lots of fantasy and fiction in their lives, it’s just that I won’t claim they’re facts. Similarly, people who don’t feel this distinction as acutely shouldn’t be judged for doing Santa, if they don’t have kids like me and sanctamaria17 (who I sometimes think is my long-lost twin, and ignore the fact that she’s 6 years younger )
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Litcrit
Guest
The most important Truth is both fact (as in ’ happened in actuality’) and myth (as in ‘important and beautiful story that explains the cosmos in some way and is for ever relevant, not just in a limited way’).
The Second Person of the Trinity, God the Son, was born as a man to the Virgin Mary and died on the cross for us. He harrowed Hell and rose on the third day, and ascended to Heaven in body. He will come again.
There is no story more beautiful and magical than this, and nothing truer in the world. Fact and myth are not at odds here. The myth is true, and the facts are not dreary or trivial, but beautiful.
This is why I don’t really understand the need for Santa. Christmas is amazing without him!
I must admit that the fat guy in a red suit with the laugh always creeped me out a little. St. Nicholas is a wonderful saint, but I couldn’t have him bringing actual presents, because, well, he’s not. He did in his earthly life and he prays for us and can be prayed to for help, but he does not bring presents.
The Second Person of the Trinity, God the Son, was born as a man to the Virgin Mary and died on the cross for us. He harrowed Hell and rose on the third day, and ascended to Heaven in body. He will come again.
There is no story more beautiful and magical than this, and nothing truer in the world. Fact and myth are not at odds here. The myth is true, and the facts are not dreary or trivial, but beautiful.
This is why I don’t really understand the need for Santa. Christmas is amazing without him!
I must admit that the fat guy in a red suit with the laugh always creeped me out a little. St. Nicholas is a wonderful saint, but I couldn’t have him bringing actual presents, because, well, he’s not. He did in his earthly life and he prays for us and can be prayed to for help, but he does not bring presents.
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Lee_M
Guest
I don’t like telling lies to my kids. I’m on both sides of the fence with Santa. My youngest daughter still believes in Santa but if she ever asks if he is real, I’ll have to tell her the truth. I took it hard when I found out that there was no Santa. I wasn’t shattered because there wasn’t one, I just felt stupid when another kid was making fun of me for believing in him. When my parents told me that there wasn’t one, I felt about an inch tall.
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yellowbird
Guest
Well *of course *thunder doesn’t come from Zeus… it comes from the angels bowling in heaven.
duh!
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OutinChgoburbs
Guest
Absolutely correct yellowbird. And the lighting is a stirke!Well *of course *thunder doesn’t come from Zeus… it comes from the angels bowling in heaven.
duh!
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HouseArrest
Guest
I don’t consider it a lie. To me, a lie involves some ill intent.
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