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MikeInVA
Guest
No. The military has (or had) many units that were male-only without these issues. Think about the crews of ships or submarines that are out of contact with “normal” society for weeks and months at a time. They do not tolerate this kind of behavior.
Tis_Bearself
Patron
I did the exact same thing. Went to the convent for piano lessons, as did dozens of other kids from my school. Nothing ever happened except the piano-teacher nun was cranky and probably shouldn’t have been teaching kids because she would get impatient and yell if you didn’t practice enough, but it didn’t rise to the level of abuse (nor were any other types of abuse going on in the convent) and the lessons were also voluntary so you could quit any time.
I went to her for lessons for 8 years. I had gotten rather fond of her, crankiness and all, by the time I left that school and moved on to the high school piano teacher. She was like a crabby tough sports coach who challenges you to improve your personal best. I think of her often.
I went to her for lessons for 8 years. I had gotten rather fond of her, crankiness and all, by the time I left that school and moved on to the high school piano teacher. She was like a crabby tough sports coach who challenges you to improve your personal best. I think of her often.
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Phemie
Guest
While it makes perfect sense to instill practices that keep kids and adults from being alone together, it still breaks my heart to think that today I would never get the help I got from my gr. 10-12 English teacher back in the late 60s.
He was there for me and held me as I cried my heart out. There was never an inappropriate move on his part and I don’t think I would have made it through high school without a major breakdown if he hadn’t been there.
He was there for me and held me as I cried my heart out. There was never an inappropriate move on his part and I don’t think I would have made it through high school without a major breakdown if he hadn’t been there.
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ZMystiCat
Guest
In these arguments, did he give an explanation for why the celibacy requirement didn’t cause a higher rate of this problem among the priesthood than among the the general population?
Based on my experience, people question both. People also realize that there’s other explanations for why someone becomes a priest or just stays a bachelor. To say that one has a stigma attached that the other doesn’t frankly makes me question how much confirmation bias or sheltering the person making the claim has.
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JanetF
Guest
Uniform policies are used to instill discipline in children. In my daughter’s school we were given the policy before classes started and we sat down and talked about the requirements. Didn’t seem that difficult to me. We bought approved items and that’s what she wore.
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F_Marturana
Guest
Someone posted a link to all the priests in the us who had been credibly accused.
I found a priest at my former parish. He heard my first confession.
Apparently, he ran and coordinated a “youth group” in my parish, to foster “vocations” in the late 1960’s early 70’s. He left my parish, and was shuffled around the diocese. The abuse apparently happened in my parish.
When I read the news I hoped that maybe I misremembered who my first confessor was. But I found an article with a photo and it confirmed I was right.
I found a priest at my former parish. He heard my first confession.
Apparently, he ran and coordinated a “youth group” in my parish, to foster “vocations” in the late 1960’s early 70’s. He left my parish, and was shuffled around the diocese. The abuse apparently happened in my parish.
When I read the news I hoped that maybe I misremembered who my first confessor was. But I found an article with a photo and it confirmed I was right.
My dh was tutored one on one with his teachers, a Religious Brother.
Today there is no one on one tutoring, it is peer tutoring or groups.
It is in place this way to protect both the child and the adult.
My husbands experience was completely innocent too. But these days we have to be very careful.
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Tis_Bearself
Patron
You are right that they do not tolerate it, but the Navy did have a reputation for attracting gay men because it provided an environment where they might be able to engage in certain activities far away from the eyes of anyone “back home”. There is a reason why the gay disco group The Village People had a hit song called “In the Navy” about how great it was to be in the US Navy.
One reason why San Francisco became a hub of gay activity was because of the Navy presence there.
Before anyone accuses me of bashing the Navy, my father was in the Navy for years (WWII, reserves, and Korea) and my mother worked for the Navy Department for years before switching to a different federal government agency. Dad was well aware of the stuff going on. It doesn’t mean every sailor was gay, but there were definitely a group who were.
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MikeInVA
Guest
I wonder if the timeline for these problems in the Navy parallel the priesthood? The culture of the U.S. military in general was severely damaged by the Vietnam War, and the all volunteer force of the 1970’s accepted a lot of problems to keep their numbers up.
Tis_Bearself
Patron
From all I have heard about the military, many problems of the military got worse in the 1970s, since they were taking a lot of people with mental illness, criminal history, etc. who were not motivated to be there and had no respect for discipline and just didn’t care.
However, by the 1970s, gay people were more able to go about their business openly in civilian life in at least a few major cities, and there was no draft going on, so they had more options open to them than a guy in the 1940s or 50s did.
However, by the 1970s, gay people were more able to go about their business openly in civilian life in at least a few major cities, and there was no draft going on, so they had more options open to them than a guy in the 1940s or 50s did.
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Joey12
Guest
It is not difficult. I didn’t say it was.
A uniform is an inconsequential thing but you are correct that it is used as a tool in Catholic schools to instill “discipline”. In public schools in Australia they have uniforms too but nobody cares if the wrong socks are worn.
My children always wear the uniform but they understand the threat of detention is there if they don’t. The point is not the uniform, it is how it is used to control the kids and let them know what will happen if they disobey. There is no need to have fear as a present danger over something like this.
If you can’t see the cultural connection then I can understand why you may wonder why kids don’t speak up about an abusive teacher or adult Catholics don’t speak up about an abusive priest. The “discipline” in many small and easy to comply with forms simply tells them not to stand up to authority. So when they really need courage, they fail.
We need to move beyond this form of cultural indoctrination if we want kids to speak out when a person in authority abuses that authority. Sure have a uniform, but have it without the fear.
A uniform is an inconsequential thing but you are correct that it is used as a tool in Catholic schools to instill “discipline”. In public schools in Australia they have uniforms too but nobody cares if the wrong socks are worn.
My children always wear the uniform but they understand the threat of detention is there if they don’t. The point is not the uniform, it is how it is used to control the kids and let them know what will happen if they disobey. There is no need to have fear as a present danger over something like this.
If you can’t see the cultural connection then I can understand why you may wonder why kids don’t speak up about an abusive teacher or adult Catholics don’t speak up about an abusive priest. The “discipline” in many small and easy to comply with forms simply tells them not to stand up to authority. So when they really need courage, they fail.
We need to move beyond this form of cultural indoctrination if we want kids to speak out when a person in authority abuses that authority. Sure have a uniform, but have it without the fear.
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xwingz2
Guest
1.) It seems to me that in ‘the old times’ there was little interaction with priests. As you say…times as an alter server. The Priest was mostly aloof…and there was little incidence where a “child” would be present with a priest. A child might spend more time with “The Sister”…who was nurturing. 2.) In those times, parents trusted the Church and 3.) there was no imagined possibility that the events as being depicted of our Church could happen.
Yesterday afternoon, August 28th, Fox News interviewed the Attorney General of The State of Pennsylvania. The moderator, Sheperd Smith, seems to suggest that The Roman Catholic Church should be bankrupted …as though it was an entity as a corporation with a “bad product”. This afternoon, 8-29, the same news outlet broached the topic od child sexual abuse in other religions. To coin a phrase that some will not like…the Fake News is really whipping the news cycle and we, as individuals, are also going to be challenged by our contemporaries and peers: “How can you be a Catholic?” Prayer and faith can only go so far…I believe we must do as Jesus did: “Throw the money changers out of the temple”!! The events are horrific…but to propose the remedy of bankrupting the Church…is also.
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Joey12
Guest
We the church should pay the proper compensation to victims and if the coffers run dry so be it. I lost my job because my Diocese had to sell our services to pay for victim payouts. So be it. I found another one.
The Church exists in the hearts of the faithful and always will whether there is money there or not.
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