Priests should be allowed to marry

[bilop]

Actually, I am Greek Catholic, and I am not the least bit insulted… To ordain married men in the Latin Church would change the institutional face of the Latin Church in a way that could easily be devastating. Rectories and workloads were designed for single men, not families.

But the Latin Church does ordain married men. About 100 in the U.S. alone, all converts to this point.

Presumably, the Latin Church would only ordain married men if it would increase the number of priests significantly. That would clearly help with the workload. Also, many old rectories are vastly underutilized. They could easily accomodate families.

I could certainly see a limited increase in the ordination of married men in the near future. It would probably be restricted to older men who had been married a long time, and didn’t have young children. Much like the permanent Diaconate, or the priesthood in the early Church.

God Bless

 

[Corki]

But the Latin Church does ordain married men. About 100 in the U.S. alone, all converts to this point.

Presumably, the Latin Church would only ordain married men if it would increase the number of priests significantly. That would clearly help with the workload. Also, many old rectories are vastly underutilized. They could easily accomodate families.

I could certainly see a limited increase in the ordination of married men in the near future. It would probably be restricted to older men who had been married a long time, and didn’t have young children. Much like the permanent Diaconate, or the priesthood in the early Church.

God Bless

I think the Church would go into this VERY slowly. While the Church does accept requests from married converts for ordination, under the terms of the Pastoral Provision, they are not supposed to have “the ordinary care of souls in a parochial setting”. The only real exception to this is the Anglican use parishes.

 

[eucharisteo]

There is a former married Baptist Minister becoming a priest, which facinates me for some reason.

 

[marchoi]

It seems to me that there are actually two questions being discussed in this thread. First, whether married men can be priests. Second, whether priests, once ordained, ought to be allowed to marry.

The answer to the first is an obvious yes. Married men who are converts have been permitted to serve as priests, almost always if they were ministers prior to conversion and with the approval of the Bishop.

The answer to the second is what seems to be fuzzy. It shouldn’t be fuzzy. I think that men who pursue the priesthood ought to be aware of the sacrifices asked of them. You can’t just try to have the best of both worlds. Further, it is unreasonable to expect a married man to minister to his parish and to look after his family. Check out what St. Paul has to say about that - 1 Cor. 7:32).

Also, eucharisteo - you mentioned that 20% of Catholic priests are married. Could you provide some evidence to that effect, please? I just find that hard to believe… I know quite a few priests and none of them are married…

 

[Corki]

It seems to me that there are actually two questions being discussed in this thread. First, whether married men can be priests. Second, whether priests, once ordained, ought to be allowed to marry.

The answer to the first is an obvious yes. Married men who are converts have been permitted to serve as priests, almost always if they were ministers prior to conversion and with the approval of the Bishop.

The answer to the second is what seems to be fuzzy. It shouldn’t be fuzzy. I think that men who pursue the priesthood ought to be aware of the sacrifices asked of them. You can’t just try to have the best of both worlds. Further, it is unreasonable to expect a married man to minister to his parish and to look after his family. Check out what St. Paul has to say about that - 1 Cor. 7:32).

Also, eucharisteo - you mentioned that 20% of Catholic priests are married. Could you provide some evidence to that effect, please? I just find that hard to believe… I know quite a few priests and none of them are married…

Two points of clarification. First, the ordinations are with the individual approval of the Vatican - requested by the Bishop on behalf of the candidate.

Second, I found it interesting to read that the Pastoral Provision is viewed as a compassionate, pastoral solution for the converts involved but was not envisioned as a solution for any crisis or need in the Church.

 

[bpcatholic]

I hear frequently of “a different vocations crisis.” There are places, such as Miami about a year ago, where there are to many men considering the priesthood. The Seminaries aren’t large enough. Thanks be to God!

 

[po18guy]

Just wanted to say, ordaining married men would NOT ruin the Church. To say so is an insult to our Eastern Catholic brothers, who have always had married (as well as celibate clergy), and the many married Latin priests (mostly converts).

Priest marrying is not going to happen: this has never been allowed, East or West, Catholic or Orthodox.

For a priest or deacon to validly marry, he must be laicized (returned to the lay state) by Rome, and can no longer be an active clergyman.

God Bless

I could have been more clear. Having the ordinary practice of celebate priests is the norm. “Loosening” their discipline (in any occupation) has traditionally not helped. However, the movement of many Anglicans, Episcopalians and others to the Catholic Church is a blessing, but does present some challenges. So far, the Church is dealing rather well with married converts.

I was speaking to a discipline change that would allow all priests to be married - a general rule of discipline. In this case, it would be a detriment - notwithstanding the assimilated priests who are from other communions. At the very least, the Deaconate should fill up.

Again, until the priest shortage hurts, our young men will not stand up and discern their vocations whole-heartedly.

Christ’s peace.

 

[ASimpleSinner]

But the Latin Church does ordain married men. About 100 in the U.S. alone, all converts to this point.

Presumably, the Latin Church would only ordain married men if it would increase the number of priests significantly. That would clearly help with the workload. Also, many old rectories are vastly underutilized. They could easily accomodate families.

I could certainly see a limited increase in the ordination of married men in the near future. It would probably be restricted to older men who had been married a long time, and didn’t have young children. Much like the permanent Diaconate, or the priesthood in the early Church.

God Bless

I am well familiar with the pastoral provision priests - I count at least 3 of the 120+ as friends of mine.

That being said, it is the exception, not the rule, not the norm.

It is NOT something that will be changing as a standard for the Latins any time soon, nor do I believe should it be.

Ultimately, the bishops who turn away solid celibate candidates are not going to be in a rush to embrace the married father of 6 who is open to life and fully on board with the Church’s thinking on any number of “issues of controversy”.

Again, I am familiar with the exception, but that does not change my thinking.

 

[ASimpleSinner]

I could have been more clear. Having the ordinary practice of celebate priests is the norm. “Loosening” their discipline (in any occupation) has traditionally not helped.

One could well look at the ELCA or PECUSA - two now very liberal Prot. denoms that ordain ANYONE - male, female, married, single, celibate, no so celibate, partnered with the opposite sex, partnered with the same…

And while in both circumstances there seems to be a “boost” in the numbers in the short term as a goodly number of their leaders opted to take in as ministers a goodly number of idealogues who solidify their leaders hold on power… (In some diocese you would be hard pressed to find heterosexual men who work full time as ministers being ordained much anymore…)

Well this has not solved their own vocations situation all that much. A lot of women seeking a second career “doing ministry” and a lot of men and women involved in the homosexual lifestyle have come forward to be ordained and rostered… but how many of them are serving as paid full time pastors?

The Orthodox in America of course do ordain married men… and in some of their diocese and jurisdictions they have even started doing “correspondance training” of “second career priests” who will end up being “bi-vocational” (biding their time between a secular career and their priestly ministry)… It has not proven to be the jackpot certain disaffected Roman parties who promote married priesthood think it will be. Not by a long shot.

 

[kristie_m]

Until then, we enjoy the priests that we have and pray for vocations. When is the last time we all did that?

Well, I can’t speak for everyone, but I pray for them every day!

I wonder if any of my daughters will hear a call…if they do, I pray the answer is a resounding YES LORD!! It always surprises me to see how many parents panic when their kids discern for the priesthood/religious life. I’d be delighted!

 

[po18guy]

Well, I can’t speak for everyone, but I pray for them every day!

I wonder if any of my daughters will hear a call…if they do, I pray the answer is a resounding YES LORD!! It always surprises me to see how many parents panic when their kids discern for the priesthood/religious life. I’d be delighted!

Amen! I have offered my children to the Lord. Will they accept? That is the question of the age.

Christ’s peace.

 

[ChristmasKnight]

It’s not “to think that priests should marry’, rather, “to be in awe of the relationship with the Lord which they are blessed to live”.

Don’t be disapproving, be respectfully envious.

Holy Orders are actually very attractive to most of those in discernment.

The attraction is not so incomprehensible when considering the beautiful words of JPII in Vita Consecrata

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_exhortations/documents/hf_jp-ii_exh_25031996_vita-consecrata_en.html

As stated in Fishers of Men, the lifestyle is surely countercultural; especially while considering contemporary cultural norms.

http://www.billpetro.com/blog/uploaded_images/star-706445.jpg

 

[SenorSalsa]

Well, I can’t speak for everyone, but I pray for them every day!

I wonder if any of my daughters will hear a call…if they do, I pray the answer is a resounding YES LORD!! It always surprises me to see how many parents panic when their kids discern for the priesthood/religious life. I’d be delighted!

I am currently in a Catholic University Program that is for men discerning the priesthood. We fulfill all the philosophy and formational requirements needed to enter Seminary, including praying the LotH, having formation nights, and many have Spiritual Directors. There are currently about 50 men in the program.

I can guarantee you that we are all very grateful for all the vocation prayers, and in addition often pray for all those who pray for us. We know that many of our blessings come because of those who remember us in prayer, and I hope you receive many as well

 

[distracted]

Never in the history of the Church have those who are in Holy Orders been allowed to marry.

.

not true… priests were married up till about the 12th century… i heard it was mostly the people (ordinary people) who decided priests should be celibate… but don’t know how true that is or whatever… All i know is that a celibate priesthood is a tradition, not a dogma…

 

[distracted]

i used to think that priests should be allowed to marry… but then i got to thinking/praying about it and… investigating it… I was never in favor of such a thing just because of shortage of priests… That by itself is Not a good reason… for one thing, that woiuld seem more like a caving in… or a weakening of the Church… a selling out to Protestant ways or what have you…

I still believe that some priests should probably leave the priesthood and marry… or mabye be allowed to stay in the p/hood and be married… but i am not 100% sure of that… just think about it once in awhile…

I have been attracted to a few priests… but let them go becasue… well… because I am Catholic, i guess… (etc)…

Priests are strange creatures… Maybe i take back what i said about them being allowed to be married… I think most of them are right where they belong… Some of them have serious issues w/ the opposite sex… so it seems to me…

 

[Rolltide]

not true… priests were married up till about the 12th century… i heard it was mostly the people (ordinary people) who decided priests should be celibate… but don’t know how true that is or whatever… All i know is that a celibate priesthood is a tradition, not a dogma…

Read carefully… what the poster is saying is it has always been the tradition of the Catholic Church that when priests are married, the marriage took place BEFORE ordination. So, married men can become priests, but single men, once they become ordained priests, cannot get married.

You are absolutely correct that it is a tradition, not a dogma.

 

[jpmcg]

Furthermore, Distracted, even deacons, to say nothing of priests and bishops, have always (and I mean from the early fourth century) been encouraged to discontinue relations with their wives subsequent to their ordination. So, while technically we have had still-married men be ordained priests, priests have never been permitted either to marry or to have relations.

Council of Elvira (c. 305), canon 33: “It is decided that marriage be altogether prohibited to bishops, priests and deacons, or to all clerics placed in the ministry, and that they keep away from their wives and not beget children; whoever does this shall be deprived of the honor of the clerical office.”

Council of Carthage (390), canon 3: “It is fitting that the holy bishops and priests of God as well as the Levites, i.e. those who are in the service of the divine sacraments, observe perfect continence, so that they may obtain in all simplicity what they are asking from God; what the Apostles taught and what antiquity itself observed, let us also endeavor to keep. . . . It pleases us all that bishop, priest and deacon, guardians of purity, abstain from conjugal intercourse with their wives, so that those who serve at the altar may keep a perfect chastity.”

When at a later stage it was clear that not all did refrain, the Western Church limited ordination to unmarried men and required a commitment to lifelong celibacy, while the Eastern Churches relaxed the rule, so that Eastern Orthodox and Eastern Catholic Churches now require their married clergy to abstain from sexual relations only for a limited period before celebrating the Eucharist.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Furthermore, Distracted, even deacons, to say nothing of priests and bishops, have always (and I mean from the early fourth century) been encouraged to discontinue relations with their wives subsequent to their ordination. So, while technically we have had still-married men be ordained priests, priests have never been permitted either to marry or to have relations.

Council of Elvira (c. 305), canon 33: “It is decided that marriage be altogether prohibited to bishops, priests and deacons, or to all clerics placed in the ministry, and that they keep away from their wives and not beget children; whoever does this shall be deprived of the honor of the clerical office.”

Council of Carthage (390), canon 3: “It is fitting that the holy bishops and priests of God as well as the Levites, i.e. those who are in the service of the divine sacraments, observe perfect continence, so that they may obtain in all simplicity what they are asking from God; what the Apostles taught and what antiquity itself observed, let us also endeavor to keep. . . . It pleases us all that bishop, priest and deacon, guardians of purity, abstain from conjugal intercourse with their wives, so that those who serve at the altar may keep a perfect chastity.”

These councils are for the Western Church. The Eastern Churches never required such a thing.

When at a later stage it was clear that not all did refrain, the Western Church limited ordination to unmarried men and required a commitment to lifelong celibacy, while the Eastern Churches relaxed the rule, so that Eastern Orthodox and Eastern Catholic Churches now require their married clergy to abstain from sexual relations only for a limited period before celebrating the Eucharist.

While it is true that there is a tradition abstaining from sexual relations before the celebration of the Divine Liturgy, it is just that, a tradition. I can not speak for the Orthodox but this is not spelt out in any way in Canon Law.

It would be a very hard thing to do with the advent of daily celebrations of the Divine Liturgy.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

not true… priests were married up till about the 12th century… i heard it was mostly the people (ordinary people) who decided priests should be celibate… but don’t know how true that is or whatever… All i know is that a celibate priesthood is a tradition, not a dogma…

You really need to read what people post.

No where have I denied the existence of married secular clergy. What I have said is what the Church Teaches and has held to from the beginning, that a man in Holy Orders can not marry. All of the married clergy were married before Ordination.

 

[father_guardian]

Priests have (generally) chosen of a free will the vocation of the celibate state during candidacy (to use modern terms), PRIOR to Ordination, and at the Ordination Rite.
Once Ordained it is forbidden for a Priest to Marry. This has been the Tradition of East and West. Read the Canons of the Seven Ecumenical Councils to gain a greater understanding (and eye opening of what exactly was going on in the Early Church).

Perhaps (as has been said) the question should be, can married men be Ordained as priests?

Please remember that the Vocation to the Priesthood is not a right. It is a gift. Too many try to claim it as their right, as has been seen in the protestant movements (but are they actually priests is yet another question).

For those that are married, it is a heavy but beautiful gift, likewise for those that are celibate, the gift is heavy and indeed beautiful.