Proof that Christ's Church was not Sola Scriptura

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alwayswill said:
It seems that most of the Catholic apologetic discussions arguing against Sola Scriptura are aimed at other Catholics, to convince them SS is an error.
It’s a Catholic to Catholic discussion.
I’m here to tell you that you are often missing the view of the Sola Scriptura proponents…

now follow this key point:

misunderstanding what God says from His throne does not diminish the authority of His words

misunderstanding what God says in writings breathed out bu God does not diminish the authority of those writings

misunderstanding God does not diminish His authority.
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Now follow this key point, if you can: Nowhere in His writings does He say that His writings are the ultimate, or final authority, which is odd, if this is what He intended. But looking at the divisions that rent the Reformers within just a few short years, all of whom clung to sola scriptura, the reason becomes obvious, it cannot work. History has shown this.

His delegating His authority to human beings, does not in any way undermine His authority. And from Scripture we see whom He gave ultimate authority to, human beings. Whatever they bound on Earth would be bound in Heaven. And they pass it on in perpetuity.
 
PRmerger said:
Ah. Sorry.

So you defer to the Church on several matters then. 👍

And by the Church, you mean the Catholic Church, for that is the only Church that was around in the 4th century when the ancient texts were examined and then contained in a Book.
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Are u insane!
 
I don’t have the patience to read
ALL the posts on this thread but
Scripture ITSELF recognizes the
importance of the Church’s teach-
ings:
“But if anyone seem to be content-
ious. we have no such custom,
neither the Churches of God”
1 Cor. 11:16
“Now we command you [believers].
in the Name of our Lord Jesus
Christ, that you withdraw yourselves
from everyone that walks disorderly,
and not after the tradition which he
received from us”
2 Thess. 3:6
“But if I tarry long… know how to be-
have yourself in the house of God,
which is the Church of the Living
God, the Pillar and Support of the
Truth” (Thus proving that the
**Church’s teachings ** are the grounds
and foundation of the NT Church)
 
alwayswill said:
Sola Scriptura is not SOLO Scriptura

redeeminggod.com/sola-scriptura-solo-scriptura/
…when most people today talk about Sola Scriptura, what they really have in mind is Solo Scriptura. “Solo” Scriptura is the idea that we can learn all matters about faith and practice using the Bible alone, plus nothing else.** If a group or person studies the Bible, and they think they have found some truth, doctrine, or practice in Scripture, then they should believe or practice this idea**, whether or not it was ever believed or practiced previously in the history of the church. This is “Solo” Scriptura.

Sola Scriptura, on the other hand, as talked about by the Reformers, held to nothing of the sort. They believed that Scripture should be studied in conjunction with the rest of the community of the Saints, especially those Early Church Fathers who helped develop the Creeds of Nicaea and Chalcedon.
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So **do you ** believe in the idea that the Church TODAY
has authority to make up doctrines and teachings AS MUCH
as the Apostolic doctrines and teachings? Now that
is treading on thin ice indeed!! Eph. 2:20 “[Church] Founded
on the Apostles and Prophets w/ Christ Jesus as the chief
Cornerstone”
 
and as for Sola Scriptura:
Scripture ITSELF recognizes the
importance of the Church’s Apost-
olic teachings:
“But if anyone seem to be content-
ious. we have no such custom,
neither the Churches of God”
1 Cor. 11:16
“Now we command you [believers].
in the Name of our Lord Jesus
Christ, that you withdraw yourselves
from everyone that walks disorderly,
and not after the **tradition **which he
received from us”
2 Thess. 3:6
“But if I tarry long… know how to be-
have yourself in the house of God,
which is the Church of the Living
God, the Pillar and Support of the
Truth” (Thus proving that the
**Church’s teachings ** are the grounds
and foundation of the NT Church)
 
PRmerger said:
This doesn’t appear to be connected in any way to my post.
Click to expand...
In post 99, you replied to

Duane1966 in post 96
“At some point, you have let the church you belong to have the authority of interpreting Scripture, as long as you agree with them”

By stating

“If you don’t agree with your (fallible) church’s interpretation, then, hey, go start your own (fallible) church and create your own (fallible) doctrines.”​

Did you mean something other than differing interpretations must mean someone is misunderstanding Scripture?
 
Duane1966 said:
Now follow this key point, if you can: Nowhere in His writings does He say that His writings are the ultimate, or final authority, which is odd, if this is what He intended. But looking at the divisions that rent the Reformers within just a few short years, all of whom clung to sola scriptura, the reason becomes obvious, it cannot work. History has shown this.

His delegating His authority to human beings, does not in any way undermine His authority. And from Scripture we see whom He gave ultimate authority to, human beings. Whatever they bound on Earth would be bound in Heaven. And they pass it on in perpetuity.
Click to expand...
Start in Genesis, and look at all the instances God spoke to man, (Adam, Eve, Cain, Noah, Abraham, etc.)
When does God state He is the highest authority?

Is it a requirement for God to state that He is the highest authority for it to be true?
In post # 50, PRmerger answered that very question with a “not at all’’

He also answered this question;
“it is a requirement for God breathed writings to state they are the highest authority for it to be true?”

“Not at all. However–and this is a big HOWEVER–you don’t know what these God breathed writings are…except through deferring to the authority of the CC.”​

So it is NOT a requirement of the highest authority to state it is the highest authority for it to be true…

The Sola Scriptura practicing Christian view is this.

Sola Scriptura is true, not because of what Scripture says, but** because of what Scripture is. **

Writings breathed out by God, carrying the same authority as God Himself speaking from His Throne
 
GLam8833 said:
So **do you ** believe in the idea that the Church TODAY
has authority to make up doctrines and teachings AS MUCH
as the Apostolic doctrines and teachings? Now that
is treading on thin ice indeed!! Eph. 2:20 “[Church] Founded
on the Apostles and Prophets w/ Christ Jesus as the chief
Cornerstone”
Click to expand...
no: I reject Solo Scriptura
I reject that anyone can “make up” doctrines
 
alwayswill said:
In post 99, you replied to

Duane1966 in post 96
“At some point, you have let the church you belong to have the authority of interpreting Scripture, as long as you agree with them”

By stating

“If you don’t agree with your (fallible) church’s interpretation, then, hey, go start your own (fallible) church and create your own (fallible) doctrines.”​

Did you mean something other than differing interpretations must mean someone is misunderstanding Scripture?
Click to expand...
I simply meant that the Protestant paradigm has led to the obscenity of thousands of Christian denominations.

When one is free to divorce oneself from the authority of the Church, this is what happens.
 
alwayswill said:
Start in Genesis, and look at all the instances God spoke to man, (Adam, Eve, Cain, Noah, Abraham, etc.)
When does God state He is the highest authority?

Is it a requirement for God to state that He is the highest authority for it to be true?
In post # 50, PRmerger answered that very question with a “not at all’’

He also answered this question;
Click to expand...
Just a FYI: I am a she not a he. 🙂
 
alwayswill said:
Start in Genesis, and look at all the instances God spoke to man, (Adam, Eve, Cain, Noah, Abraham, etc.)
When does God state He is the highest authority?

Is it a requirement for God to state that He is the highest authority for it to be true?
In post # 50, PRmerger answered that very question with a “not at all’’

He also answered this question;
“it is a requirement for God breathed writings to state they are the highest authority for it to be true?”

“Not at all. However–and this is a big HOWEVER–you don’t know what these God breathed writings are…except through deferring to the authority of the CC.”​

So it is NOT a requirement of the highest authority to state it is the highest authority for it to be true…
Click to expand...
Only if you’re NOT Sola Scriptura.

If you are, then, yes, SS demands that the highest authority state that it is the highest authority.
 
alwayswill said:
Sola Scriptura is true, not because of what Scripture says, but** because of what Scripture is. **
Click to expand...
I think what conclusion we can get from Scripture being God-breathed is that we must submit to its authority.

But it doesn’t follow that it’s the ULTIMATE or ONLY authority.
Writings breathed out by God, carrying the same authority as God Himself speaking from His Throne
Click to expand...
But they’re not the ONLY authority.

And even you have acknowledged that you submit to the authority of the CC…each and every time you quote from the NT as being theopneustos.
 
PRmerger said:
So no one should be able to leave their church and form their own church?
Click to expand...
My stand -alone non-denominational church came out of another stand -alone non-denominational church:

And now our church is a sending church:

We equip people to do just that.
( I can’t wait to be part of the next church-plant!!)

and that church will send out others to form another church.

praise God!
 
PRmerger said:
I think what conclusion we can get from Scripture being God-breathed is that we must submit to its authority.

But it doesn’t follow that it’s the ULTIMATE or ONLY authority.

But they’re not the ONLY authority.

And even you have acknowledged that you submit to the authority of the CC…each and every time you quote from the NT as being theopneustos.
Click to expand...
when you say ultimate: do you mean highest or the last person you can ask?
 
alwayswill said:
My stand -alone non-denominational church came out of another stand -alone non-denominational church:

And now our church is a sending church:

We equip people to do just that.
( I can’t wait to be part of the next church-plant!!)

and that church will send out others to form another church.

praise God!
Click to expand...
Another non-sequitur.

Could you please answer the question:
Is it your church’s position that you are free to depart from it if you find its teachings to be non-scriptural?
 
PRmerger said:
Only if you’re NOT Sola Scriptura.

If you are, then, yes, SS demands that the highest authority state that it is the highest authority.
Click to expand...
no: I reject that is a requirement:

It is not a requirement of God
it is not a requirement of Scripture
 
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