Proof that sola scriptura is not true

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am confident that the Gospel which Jesus taught, and the recording of His message in Scripture, is sufficient for salvation.
Wayne,

Where is this in scripture? Which Gospel? Which verses? Explicit? Point me there…maybe I’ve missed them. Implicit? Show us using formal logic and verses.

By the way, do you have scriptural evidence to support that “Some God-breathed things are sufficient” and all other “God-breathed things” are not?

I seek more feedback on my “deductive reasoning”. I’ve proved that “All Scripture is insufficient” using 2nd Tim…of course it all rests upon the Major premise…the axiom.

(Barbara syllogism):

(True) Major Premise: All God breathed things are insufficient
(True) Minor Premise: All Scripture is God breathed
(True) Conclusion: All Scripture is insufficient

Most of us are truth seekers here…I am…and I’m open to reading responses from “Scripture sufficient believers” and/or Catholics to show us where in Scripture does it say that, “Some God-breathed things are sufficient”…which is the negation of the Major premise.

If someone can prove using scripture that the negation of the Major Premise is TRUE…then the above syllogism I have posted cannot make its conclusion.

Thanks for the feedback and for sticking with me with this logical proof or disproof of Scripture insufficienty, which in way relates to SS:)
 
Examples of Jesus’ and the Apostles’ Reliance on Oral Tradition

Matt. 2:23 - the prophecy “He shall be a Nazarene” is oral tradition. It is not found in the Old Testament. This demonstrates that the apostles relied upon oral tradition and taught by oral tradition.

Matt 23:2 - Jesus relies on the oral tradition of acknowledging Moses’ seat of authority (which passed from Moses to Joshua to the Sanhedrin). This is not recorded in the Old Testament.

John 19:26; 20:2; 21:20,24 - knowing that the “beloved disciple” is John is inferred from Scripture, but is also largely oral tradition.

Acts 20:35 - Paul relies on the oral tradition of the apostles for this statement (“it is better to give than to receive”) of Jesus. It is not recorded in the Gospels.

1 Cor. 7:10 - Paul relies on the oral tradition of the apostles to give the charge of Jesus that a wife should not separate from her husband.

1 Cor. 10:4 - Paul relies on the oral tradition of the rock following Moses. It is not recorded in the Old Testament. See Exodus 17:1-17 and Num. 20:2-13.

Eph 5:14 - Paul relies on oral tradition to quote an early Christian hymn - “awake O sleeper rise from the dead and Christ shall give you light.”

Heb. 11:37 - the author of Hebrews relies on the oral tradition of the martyrs being sawed in two. This is not recorded in the Old Testament.

Jude 9 - Jude relies on the oral tradition of the Archangel Michael’s dispute with satan over Moses’ body. This is not found in the Old Testament.

Jude 14-15 - Jude relies on the oral tradition of Enoch’s prophecy which is not recorded in the Old Testament.

scripturecatholic.com/oral_tradition.html#oral-III
 
Matt. 28:20 - “observe ALL I have commanded,”
but, as we see in John 20:30; 21:25,
not ALL Jesus taught is in Scripture.
So there must be things outside of Scripture that we must observe.
This disproves “Bible alone” theology.

www.ScriptureCatholic.com

scripturecatholic.com/scripture_alone.html
May I refer you to posts #208 and #228 where these texts are examined more closely.
Maybe you would care to address the issues raised there, and offer your reasonings as to why the interpretations in post #228 is incorrect and your interpretation is correct?
 
The ban on Abortion is not a Doctrine, it’s understood that it is wrong in the framework of Catholic Church teaching.
Could you help me here, as I do not understand the distinction.
The Catholic encyclopaedia includes in the definition of “doctrine” the words “the knowledge imparted by teaching”.
So what is taught is doctrine, but you believe otherwise.
Could you explain your reasoning for us, and perhaps provide definitions of “doctrine” and “teaching” ?
 
So there must be things outside of Scripture that we must observe.
True, but some SS believers bring up that, the things outside of scripture or “traditions” must not contradict scriptures. And we all agree with that. The problem is “interpretation”…on whether the traditions contradict the scriptures.

The tradition of the Trinity…is not in scripture explicitly…implicitly?..Trinitarians believe it is…I plan on working on that one of these days…using the concept of “Equivalence Relation” and scriptural verses.
 
if they were not with Rome, they were considered heretical.
incorrect, the birthday of the Catholic Church is Pentecost. approx 30 AD.
This is incorrect, Church came first (Penecost). Bible was compiled by Catholic Church.
Hmmm … “if they were not with Rome, they were considered heretical”.
So there were these Christian churches (not Catholic, or can you show that they considered themselves Catholic at the time?), and some decided that they didn’t agree with putting the primacy in Rome just because Rome said so, so they were declared heretical. Just which heresy was this, when was it declared so, and when did Rome publish the doctrine that allowed the Eastern churches to be identified as heretical?

As to your reference to the Bible, you have joined many of your colleagues, but fortunately not all, who seem not to understand the difference between Gospels, Scripture, and the Bible.
The Bible is a collection of Scripture, which pre-dates the Bible. The Gospels are what Jesus taught, were recorded by four separate authors, and form part of the Scripture of the New Testament. The Old Testament is also Scripture.
So for you to suggest that the Catholic Church “owns” Scripture simply because it at some point compiled the Bible is simply nonsensical.
You might also read up on the sources that Jerome used to compile the Latin Vulgate, and how and why he, and other Church Fathers, opposed the inclusion of what we now term the deuterocanonical books (not Apocryphal as many Protestants incorrectly describe them).
It would be helpful if you understood the history of these books.
 
A bull is a a seal on a letter.
Ok, but that is not the same as a Papal Bull, which is what we were discussing, so your point is … ?
In 1555, I probably would never have heard of it, I wouldn’t be able to read,. Communications to peasants, who were 95% of the population, was poor. I probably would only know about the doctrines of the Church, and not understand much more. Clergy were inordinatley decimated by the Black Death due to their ministering to the sick, so there were a lot of poorly educated clergy. There were likey liturgical abuses due to unintential ignorance. I doubt I would be seeing a doctor in the first place.
Taking what you have said to be true, what was the point of the Papal Bull under discussion?
Did Pope Paul write it simply for his own edification, or did he intend it for a wider audience?
What did Pope Paul expect to happen when he issued it?
If I take your intent correctly, and I may be misunderstanding, you are proposing that the Papal Bull had no effect?
Have I got that right?
And even were that true, how does that argue against the immorality of the Pope’s action, and how does that argue that an edict issued by the Pope is not a teaching or a law.
If you offer that this Papal Bull was not an edict, what was it, what was the intention of issuing it, what did Pope Paul expect to result from him publishing it, did he expect people to implement it, what was it all about.
So far you have offered explanations of what it was not, but not what it was.
 
May I refer you to posts #208 and #228 where these texts are examined more closely.
Maybe you would care to address the issues raised there, and offer your reasonings as to why the interpretations in post #228 is incorrect and your interpretation is correct?
Maybe you would care to address the issues raised there, and offer your reasonings as to why the interpretations in post #228 is incorrect and your interpretation is correct?

WOW. IF MY POSTS ARE THAT CONTRADICTORY TO THE POSTS YOU’VE MENTIONED, THEN I’LL HAVE TO SEE WHY, BUT AS FAR AS YOUR USING THE TERMS “INCORRECT” AND “CORRECT”, SPEAKING FOR MYSELF, WHEN IT COMES TO FAITH, I THINK THAT THOSE ARE STRONG TERMS.

I NEVER SEE SOMEONE WHO CONTRADICTS MY BELIEF AS NECCESSSARILY “WRONG”, JUST DIFFERENTLY OPINIONATED FROM ME.

🙂

BUT I’LL LOOK INTO THE POSTS.

PAX
 
True, but some SS believers bring up that, the things outside of scripture or “traditions” must not contradict scriptures. And we all agree with that. The problem is “interpretation”…on whether the traditions contradict the scriptures.

The tradition of the Trinity…is not in scripture explicitly…implicitly?..Trinitarians believe it is…I plan on working on that one of these days…using the concept of “Equivalence Relation” and scriptural verses.
True, but some SS believers bring up that, the things outside of scripture or “traditions” must not contradict scriptures. And we all agree with that. The problem is “interpretation”…on whether the traditions contradict the scriptures.

MOST DEFINATELY. I’M A FIRM BELIEVER IN THE MAGISTERIUM. 2,000 YEARS OF A BUILT UP STOREHOUSE OF EXPERIENCE, OF TESTING, OF PROVING AND UNPROVING IS ALOT MORE THAN I AM CAPABLE OF IN MY LIMITED LIFETIME.

I TRUST THE CHURCH. WHO BETTER TO ASK ABOUT A STEPHEN KING NOVEL THAN STEPHEN KING HIMSELF?

🙂

The tradition of the Trinity…is not in scripture explicitly…implicitly?..Trinitarians believe it is…I plan on working on that one of these days…using the concept of “Equivalence Relation” and scriptural verses.

WELL, MY VIEW ON THAT IS THIS…AS DOCTRINES, WHAT WE BELIEVE DOESN’T EXIST IN SCRIPTURE (THE RAPTURE, JUSTIFICATION, ETC…). THE SEPERATE TEACHINGS EXIST, BUT I DON’T KNOW OF ANY COMPLETE DOCTRINES THAT EXIST. EVEN OUR DOCTRINES TODAY ARE COMPILATIONS OF VARIOUS TEACHINGS THAT CONTRIBUTE TO THE REVELATION OF A DOCTRINE.

EXAMPLE:
VERSE IN A BOOK; RAIN WILL WET YOU.

VERSE IN ANOTHER BOOK; UMBRELLAS SHED WATER.

WHILE THE TWO ARE IN SEPARATE BOOKS, THEY ARE UNDENIABLY RELATED (OT/NT, GOSPEL TO EPISTLE, GOSPEL TO GOSPEL, ETC…). THE REVELATION OF THE DOCTRINE IS WHEN SOMEONE PUTS THE TWO TOGETHER AND DEFINES THAT USING AN UMBRELLA WILL KEEP YOU DRY WHEN IT RAINS.

ALL THE MISINTERPRETATION IN THE WORLD CAN’T DENY THAT THEY TWO BELONG TOGETHER (REASONABLY SPEAKING) AND I’M A FIRM BELIEVER THAT ALONG WITH SPIRITUAL CONFIRMATION, REASON PLAYS A GREAT PART IN THE DISCERNMENT OF SCRIPTURE.
 
Regarding Jews, remember, it was sinful for them to fraternize with Gentiles. They kept to themselves. Human Dignity is an evolving concept. Many Jews today eat pork, and intermarriage today is much more common than it was even 100 years ago.\QUOTE]
Human dignity is an evolving concept ???
What on earth do you think that Jesus was trying to teach us !!!
It is only “evolving” amongst those who refuse to listen to His Word. Human dignity has not changed since God first created man in his own image, and God, His Prophets, Jesus, his disciples, and hopefully the Catholic Church has been trying to drill that into thick skulls for thousands of years, yet some people still don’t get it.
Really …
Civilization as it was known in the Roman times was wiped out by Barbarians. The light of Roman civilzation went out and the Dark Ages began. The Catholic Church at the time had the only structure in place that could effect some order. The Church kept civilzation alive in her monastaries and in Rome. \QUOTE]
So what, since when was the mission of the Church to keep civilization alive? And by the way, persecuting people is not a recommended practice for the maintenance of civilization.
One of the complaints about the Catholic Church, for centuries, has been that it places more emphasis on its secular welfare than on tending the spiritual needs of the flock. When I view the church history and structure, I see little evidence that the Catholic Church places its faith in Jesus Christ to provide, it expends enormous effort in maintaining its secular self-sufficiency, even to the extent of having its own city complete with police force, army, hospital, post office, and according to the Italian Tax Office, its own interpretation of tax law.
That you even suggest that the Church has such a role simply illustrates that the transition that Jesus tried to accomplish, from Mosaic Law and the Old Testament Covenant with Israel, to the New Testament Covenant, has failed to make it into the consciousness of many.
I think you are placing to much importance a this Bull, it has nothing to do with the Church’s doctrines and beliefs. It is the writing of one man; this man is not a Church Doctor/Father (as in St. Ambrose, St. Augustine) whose writings greatly influenced the Church’s understanding of Scripture and Christ’s teachings. Saul persecuted Christians, he was instrumental in the martyrdom of St. Stephan, the first martyr, whose feast we celebrate today. St. Peter denied Jesus after he accepted Jesus as his “personal savior.” John 6:6xxsomething

I can accept that, the Pope, the Bishop of Rome, the successor of Peter, the Vicar of Christ, a man granted the gift of infallibility when speaking ex cathedra, His Holiness the Holy Father, is not to be compared with someone like Augustine, who while being an influential writer, had no authority.
One final point.
Either you decided that it was not important, or you simply missed it, but you did not address the issue that while the Papal Bull was issued by one man, the edicts it contained were extended by the following two popes, who obviously agreed with Paul IV. This is evidence of systemic behaviour, not simply “the writings of one man”.
I also do not understand why you consider a Papal Bull relatively unimportant, nor do I understand why you consider a written edict not a teaching.
Do you have children?
Tell them that if you behave badly, don’t take any notice, leading by example has nothing to do with teaching. Also tell them that if you put a list of house rules on the refrigerator, they don’t apply to the youngest becasue he/she can’t read yet, and they don’t apply to anyone else who can’t read them for any reason. And also tell them that just because you as the House Father wrote a list of instructions, that is not to say that they need to be obeyed because they are not laws and not teachings, they are just your opinion and you can be wrong, except of course when you say you are not.
And if they then ask why you wrote the list in the first place, and what they are meant to learn from them, you will of course tell them … what?

P.S. Why can’t I get these quote marks working properly? They appear consistent when I insert them, but do not result in consistent behaviour in the post. Does someone know the correct syntax?
 
Let us examine these texts.

John 20:30 says “There were many other signs that Jesus worked in the sight of the disciples, but they are not recorded in this book”.

John 21:25 says, “There was much else that Jesus did; if it were written down in detail, I do not suppose the world itself would hold all the books that would be written”.

Both of these quotes relate to what Jesus did, not to what He said, taught, or commanded (the word used in Matthew 28).
How do you know that it does not include what “he said, taught, or commanded” ?? Like you said, “there is no way to tell” what John meant. But we can reasonably assume that the successors and disciples of John know what he meant…and they in turn passed it on thru tradition.

Are the scriptures/verses here “insufficient” for you to come to a sure conclusion?
The “signs” in John 20:30 are most likely miracles, as this is consistent with the usage of the word “signs” in other parts of Scripture. Possibly John 21:25 is referring to the same types of activities, there is no way to tell.
Sure I agree…most likely miracles in John 20…John 21? How do you know?..you say possibly…there is no way to tell for a bible alone christian… Again, are the scriptures/verses here “insufficient” to explain to what John meant to say?
But no matter what one may imagine these signs and activities to be, neither of these passages hints at teachings of Jesus, thus neither supports the contention that “not ALL Jesus taught is in Scripture”.
How do you know “neither of these passages hints at teachings of Jesus” ?? It is according to your own interpretation…which you believe is taught to you by the SPRIT…or are you not sure? Or you have a “teaching authority” which has helped reveal this to you?
There is no mention of Jesus’ teachings, let alone any being left out. If John meant teachings, do you not think he would have said so?
There is no mention of the Trinity in Scripture. Do you think the Gospel writers and Paul would have said so explicitly? Trinity comes from Sacred Tradition…outside of scripture…which unfortunately some non-trinitarian christians say it contradicts.
The Catholic position, using these passages of John as proof texts, is more than a little dubious in my opinion. If you think otherwise, I would be interested to hear how you derive your interpretation.
This is good…in fact, I will use some “formal logic”👍 to help support the interpretation. In my opinion, it will take some koine greek in conjunction.

Wayne, correct me if I’m wrong, you accept “Sacred Tradition” only if it is in agreement with Scripture??
 
Besides that, we are taught to hold fast to “traditions” by Paul. \QUOTE]

Which traditions would those be?
Paul was speaking of specific traditions, which can be ascertained from the context, and I would not consider it valid to extrapolate to all traditions.
For example, the traditions of the Jewish priesthood, the ritual sacrifices, the rules regarding entering the Temple, are we to hold fast to those?
And finally, a Priest is distinguished from an ordinary man. He is set apart from men. When Jesus healed a man, He told that man to tell no man, but to go show himself to a Priest and to do what said Priest prescribed to him to do. \QUOTE]

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… continuing
Of course, this leads to the argument of “which” is the best translation to which I answer…the traslation in your “heart”. A physical visible object (a book) only acts as a reference. Men who are right with God recognize The Word of God when they see it because it is reflected in their hearts. But the man who’s reasons for wanting to learn scripture are not of a holy intent will not have the scriptures opened up to him.
Any literate person could read the Bible, but only the holy man can understand it as God reveals His Word to said man (be they Catholic, Protestant, non-Denominationalist, whatever.
The fact is, Sola Scriptura doesn’t exist “in” the Bible,
therefore, it cancels itself out.
Wish I can understand how you draw the conclusion in the last sentence from the content of the previous paragraph, which incidentally, is very well expressed.
As to the last sentence, I don’t agree with you, but from previous posts on this thread, we have a long way to go to a common understanding of the meaning and application of the term “sola scriptura”. Some of the concepts are most definitely in Scripture, and some are inferred from debatable interpretations.
 
How do you know that it does not include what “he said, taught, or commanded” ?? Like you said, “there is no way to tell” what John meant. But we can reasonably assume that the successors and disciples of John know what he meant…and they in turn passed it on thru tradition.
Romulus, are you just having me on?
The rules of Scripture exegesis, expounded by Gregory the Great and others, say that one is to take the simple literal meaning unless there is clear evidence in the text to do otherwise. The reason for this is to prevent people from reading anything they like into the text. If John uses the word “did”, we are to accept that he meant just that. He was quite capable of using a different word if he meant something different, but he didn’t, so we are to accept that he meant what he said.
Under your rules, we could make no sense of Scripture whatsoever.
I’m sorry, but that is just silly.

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No, I am prepared to accept Tradition provided that it does not contradict Scripture, and provided that its provenance can be shown. If it does contradict Scripture, and let’s not go back down the path of “how would I know”, I reject it. If its provenance is unclear, I think about whether it is important in the context of salvation, I pray about it, and eventually decide on how to deal with it.
Thanks for the dialogue.
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we have a long way to go to a common understanding of the meaning and application of the term “sola scriptura”.
Wayne, just a clarification… Does “sola scriptura” conclude that “scripture is sufficient”…for understanding…for salvation??
Some of the concepts are most definitely in Scripture, and some are inferred from debatable interpretations.
Where are these concepts in Scripture? You say, some are “inferred”…meaning “deductively reasoned”…alright! yay! And I believe I have asked you to prove using logic before. Can you now show us using formal logic to support “sola scriptura” using scripture/verses??

Again, here are some good links to put together your “deductive reasoning” argument to “infer”.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syllogism
roninabox.com/venndiagram.html
csee.umbc.edu/~stephens/203/PDF/2-1.pdf
people.umass.edu/gmhwww/110/text/c01_3-99.pdf

If you know of any other good link, please post.🙂
 
The fact that the word “Trinity” does not appear in Scripture cannot be interpreted to mean that the concepts and teachings are not there.
I agree they are in there implied…and one of these days I’ll use formal logic and the concept of “Equivalence Relation” to investigate proofs…yes I have faith…but we can’t not let go of “reason”… In fact, I highly recommend everyone to learn to use formal logic within bible studies. I invite you Wayne to prove SS using “formal logic”👍

By the way, I’m still waiting for your feedback in regards to, “show us where in Scripture does it say or imply that, “Some God-breathed things are sufficient””?

Thanks for the feedback
 
One other extended analogy that might assist with understanding the error of Sola Scriptura can be drawn from the Hebrew langauge itself,

During the time of the ancient Hebrews sojourn their alphabet had no spaces nor vowels. So, for example, to demonstrate in English, we would read this passage here…
2 Corinthians 3:3:
You show that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.
…something like this if expressed in the same manner as the Hebrews did…
YshwthtyrlttrfrmChrstthrsltfrmnstrywrttnntwthnkbtwththSprtfthlvngGdntntbltsfstnbtntbltsfhmnhrts
This is actually allowing more than the Hebrew actually allows because, to my knowledge, there are no distinguishing between capital and lowercase letters in Hebrew.

So, if one could not read the language, they would not know the vowel sounds that are autotmatically naturally configured within certain letter structures and they would also most likely also either blend words together or seperate them incorrectly without realizing it.

In short, it would be very difficult to discern between “can” and “con” for example. Or, in the above example, someone might take mCh and say it must mean “much” instead of recognizing two different words-- from and Christ.

I think this may be refered to when the Sciptures say in 2 Timothy 2:15…
Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a workman who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth.
I will note that some translations, such as the King James, actually says to “rightly divide the word of truth” or something similar.​

Anyway, when we look to patterns between the Isaelites and the Church, we note two very special actions happening on the same day.

50 days after the Feast of Firstfruits God gave the Israelites the Torah through Moses whereas the God gave Christians the indwelling of the Holy Spirit through Christ Jesus-- both on the day of Pentecost.

This, to me, speaks volumes.

It wasn’t just a book which was given on the day of Pentecost to Christians. God allowed the gift of the Holy Spirit to move them to understand and speak in languages the people themselves did not understand. This implies a God-given ability to understand and pass on the Living Witness of the Church as we move out into the world-- because we are the language that God himself is speaking in.

Consequently, a Christian that relies solely on the Scriptures without Tradition can be in just as much danger of misunderstanding the New Covenant in Christ as a non-Israeli relying solely on their non-Hebrew language is in danger of misunderstanding the Old Covenant under Moses.

Acting like the naturalized alphabetical vowel configurations in the ancient Hebrew language, a church without tradition is like a non-Israeli that lacks the ability to speak and read Hebrew itself-- and very much in danger of reading the Scriptures, both Hebrew and Christian, like this…
yshwthtyrlttrfrmchrstthrsltfrmnstrywrttnntwthnkbtwththsprtfthlvnggdntntbltsfstnbtntbltsfhmnhrts
 
Hmmm … “if they were not with Rome, they were considered heretical”.
So there were these Christian churches (not Catholic, or can you show that they considered themselves Catholic at the time?), and some decided that they didn’t agree with putting the primacy in Rome just because Rome said so, so they were declared heretical. Just which heresy was this, when was it declared so, and when did Rome publish the doctrine that allowed the Eastern churches to be identified as heretical?

As to your reference to the Bible, you have joined many of your colleagues, but fortunately not all, who seem not to understand the difference between Gospels, Scripture, and the Bible.
The Bible is a collection of Scripture, which pre-dates the Bible. The Gospels are what Jesus taught, were recorded by four separate authors, and form part of the Scripture of the New Testament. The Old Testament is also Scripture.
So for you to suggest that the Catholic Church “owns” Scripture simply because it at some point compiled the Bible is simply nonsensical.
You might also read up on the sources that Jerome used to compile the Latin Vulgate, and how and why he, and other Church Fathers, opposed the inclusion of what we now term the deuterocanonical books (not Apocryphal as many Protestants incorrectly describe them).
It would be helpful if you understood the history of these books.
So there were these Christian churches (not Catholic, or can you show that they considered themselves Catholic at the time?),

SINCE THERE WERE NO DENOMINATIONS OF CHRISTIANITY, ALL CHRISTIANS WERE UNIVERSAL CHRISTIANS. THE CHURCH WASN’T REFERRED TO AS A “UNIVERSAL” (AKA CATHOLIC) CHURCH UNTIL 110 AD. HOWEVER, FOR THE FIRST 1500 YEARS OF CHRISTIANITY OR SO, WHEN ONE SAID ONE WAS CHRISTIAN, IT WAS AUTOMATICALLY ASSUMED THAT THEY WERE UNIVERSAL CHRISTIANS.

THAT’S WHY WHEN THE CATHOLIC CHURCH IS SPOKEN ON BEFORE THE REVOLT OF THE 16TH CENTURY IN EUROPE, IT’S REFERRED TO AS SIMPLY, THE CHRISTIAN CHURCH OR THE CHURCH.

CHRISTIANS WERE ALWAYS “UNIVERSAL”. JESUS COMMISSIONED HIS APOSTLES TO MAKE DISCIPLES OF ALL NATIONS (“ALL” IS LITERALLY A SYNOMYM FOR THE WORD CATHOLIC OR UNIVERSAL).

As to your reference to the Bible, you have joined many of your colleagues, but fortunately not all, who seem not to understand the difference between Gospels, Scripture, and the Bible.
The Bible is a collection of Scripture, which pre-dates the Bible.

I WOULD SAY THAT ALL SCRIPTURE “PRE-DATES” THE BIBLE SINCE NONE OF IT CAME BEFORE THE WORKS WERE CANONIZED.

The Gospels are what Jesus taught, were recorded by four separate authors, and form part of the Scripture of the New Testament. The Old Testament is also Scripture.
So for you to suggest that the Catholic Church “owns” Scripture simply because it at some point compiled the Bible is simply nonsensical.

THE CATHOLIC CHURCH “OWNING” SCRIPTURE? OF COURSE NOT, WE JUST HAPPENED TO BE THE RELIGIOUS INSTITUTION THAT GOD CHOSE TO REVEAL TO THE WORLD WHAT HE WANTED HIS COLLECTION OF BOOKS (LITERALLY, “BIBLE”) TO CONTAIN.

IF GOD (WHO IS THE AUTHOR) TRUSTED US ENOUGH TO DO THIS GREAT WORK WHICH WOULD BE USED AS THE MAIN IMPLIMENT TO BRING SALVATION TO THE WORLD, THEN WE MUST HAVE SOMETHING WORTHY OF HIS TRUST…OH YES; APOSTOLIC SUCCESSION.

You might also read up on the sources that Jerome used to compile the Latin Vulgate, and how and why he, and other Church Fathers, opposed the inclusion of what we now term the deuterocanonical books (not Apocryphal as many Protestants incorrectly describe them).

ULTIMATEY, IN MY HUMBLE OPINION, THE HOW’S AND WHY’S ARE IRRELEVANT. THE BIBLE IS HERE. IT’S LIKE DISCUSSING HAVING AN ABORTION “AFTER” THE BABY IS BORN.

PAX
 
Open question:

Does it literally state or imply that the Bible alone is to be used as the final authority for teaching?

If so, could one post the Chapter & Verse?
 
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