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I
inJESUS
Guest
** inJesus, whatever you say is wrong and a bye-product of your own mind.**
i asked a simple question. Are those verse corrupt?
P
planten
Guest
**Ralph, Not at all. When Allah swears by something, there is no question of big or small. That thing belongs to him because he has created it and knows the nature and all about its reality. We own nothing and know nothing about anything. We cannot swear by anything.BY taking an oath, you are swearing upon that which is greater than you. In the Judeo-Christian Theology, God cannot take an oath by anything as He is supreme. Is Allah saying that these things are greater than he? He is making himself subject to them by swearing on them.
Please explain.
It is not problem of God being smaller than other things. Also we cannot swear by anything except Allah because all things are perishable.**
R
ralphinal
Guest
Obviously, there is an understanding difference in what an oath is.**Ralph, Not at all. When Allah swears by something, there is no question of big or small. That thing belongs to him because he has created it and knows the nature and all about its reality. We own nothing and know nothing about anything. We cannot swear by anything.
It is not problem of God being smaller than other things. Also we cannot swear by anything except Allah because all things are perishable.**
In the culture of the Bible, and of the Western world, an oath is taken in the name of something larger or more sacred. It is that fact that binds the oath. I cannot swear an oath by an earthworm. I can swear one by God. Even peoples who had no understanding of God knew that. Native Americans swore by the seasons, stars, and time.
For Allah toi swear an oath by creation, he is saying that the things are greater than he. How can he be bound to that which is less than he?
I
inJESUS
Guest
Are those verse corrupt? yes or no
I
inJESUS
Guest
Allah even swore by Muhammad. It seems Allah hold in great esteem Muhammad that he swore by no one else for thousands of years or that Allah esteems humanity and creatures so much but don’t say the Word took a human flesh for our sake for it doesn’t befit Allah to have anything with humanity yet he swears by Muhammad for Muhammad’s sake because he was fit that the Lord of this universe picks him as an object of swearing though humanity is not fit for Allah .For Allah toi swear an oath by creation, he is saying that the things are greater than he. How can he be bound to that which is less than he?
Now i asked if my previous quotes are corrupt, and am sure no Muslim will say they are corrupt because their arguments will be beyond absurdity and irrationality for they cannot deny that there is nothing greater than God as the quotes say. My question will be : why would God, thousands and hundreds of years before Muhammad, in the writings BC and AC, why would He swear only by Himself because no one is greater than Him, yet after Muhammad, supposedly the same God would swear by Muhammad, falsifying His previous claims throughout housands of years and implying that Muhammad is actually greater than Him? (astaghfirullah). Since we know that God does not make mistakes, and surely not ones of polytheism, can anyone convince me how are we supposed to believe that Muhammad’s words are from God?
I
inJESUS
Guest
Any answer? i hope my question is not classified as “don’t ask us about these things” category.
A
anjoh66
Guest
Hi!
The jews were expacting the messiah to come and according to their believes he must be an Israelite.
In the time of Mohammad the jews, didnt acknowledge Jesus as teh Messiah, well also today they dont, so they didnt accept Mohammad as a prophet because he was not Israelian, even if they could have made an exception with reference to him being an Ishmaelite, means one from their cousins and a decendant of Abraham, maybe by reasoning like that they could have accepted him being a prophet.
The main problem was that this prophet declared Jesus to be the Messiah thus creating a dilemma, because according to jewish belief there would be no more prophets after the messiah.
So their conclusion was that this Mohammad must be a false prophet as he was declaring Jesus to be the Messiah and still claiming the he(Mohammad) was a prophet from God.
The jews were expacting the messiah to come and according to their believes he must be an Israelite.
In the time of Mohammad the jews, didnt acknowledge Jesus as teh Messiah, well also today they dont, so they didnt accept Mohammad as a prophet because he was not Israelian, even if they could have made an exception with reference to him being an Ishmaelite, means one from their cousins and a decendant of Abraham, maybe by reasoning like that they could have accepted him being a prophet.
The main problem was that this prophet declared Jesus to be the Messiah thus creating a dilemma, because according to jewish belief there would be no more prophets after the messiah.
So their conclusion was that this Mohammad must be a false prophet as he was declaring Jesus to be the Messiah and still claiming the he(Mohammad) was a prophet from God.
R
ralphinal
Guest
What does it mean to be the Messiah in Muslim thought? What does that term imply? What job does the Messiah have?Hi!
The jews were expacting the messiah to come and according to their believes he must be an Israelite.
In the time of Mohammad the jews, didnt acknowledge Jesus as teh Messiah, well also today they dont, so they didnt accept Mohammad as a prophet because he was not Israelian, even if they could have made an exception with reference to him being an Ishmaelite, means one from their cousins and a decendant of Abraham, maybe by reasoning like that they could have accepted him being a prophet.
The main problem was that this prophet declared Jesus to be the Messiah thus creating a dilemma, because according to jewish belief there would be no more prophets after the messiah.
So their conclusion was that this Mohammad must be a false prophet as he was declaring Jesus to be the Messiah and still claiming the he(Mohammad) was a prophet from God.
P
planten
Guest
**anjoh, good thoughts. The Israelis were right in thinking that there would be no prophet amongst them after the Messiah. Indeed, the Messiah was the last prophet amongst the Israelis. He was their Khatam an Nabiyyeen. That was the end of prophethood amongst the Jews. But it did not mean that there would be no prophet in the world again.Hi!
The jews were expacting the messiah to come and according to their believes he must be an Israelite.
In the time of Mohammad the jews, didnt acknowledge Jesus as teh Messiah, well also today they dont, so they didnt accept Mohammad as a prophet because he was not Israelian, even if they could have made an exception with reference to him being an Ishmaelite, means one from their cousins and a decendant of Abraham, maybe by reasoning like that they could have accepted him being a prophet.
The main problem was that this prophet declared Jesus to be the Messiah thus creating a dilemma, because according to jewish belief there would be no more prophets after the messiah.
So their conclusion was that this Mohammad must be a false prophet as he was declaring Jesus to be the Messiah and still claiming the he(Mohammad) was a prophet from God.
Muhammad told the truth about Moses and Jesus. That Jesus was a sub ordinate prophet under the command of Moses and that he was the true promised messiah of the Jews.
Of course the Jews who did not accept Jesus in his life time (600 years earlier) could not accept Jesus as a messiah in the time of Muhamamd. So they rejected Muhammad too. Muhammad accepted Moses and Jesus as the true prophets of Allah and taught the same to teh Muslims.**
S
swariffin
Guest
Are you saying that Muhammad is the Messiah?**anjoh, good thoughts. The Israelis were right in thinking that there would be no prophet amongst them after the Messiah. Indeed, the Messiah was the last prophet amongst the Israelis. He was their Khatam an Nabiyyeen. That was the end of prophethood amongst the Jews. But it did not mean that there would be no prophet in the world again.
Muhammad told the truth about Moses and Jesus. That Jesus was a sub ordinate prophet under the command of Moses and that he was the true promised messiah of the Jews.
Of course the Jews who did not accept Jesus in his life time (600 years earlier) could not accept Jesus as a messiah in the time of Muhamamd. So they rejected Muhammad too. Muhammad accepted Moses and Jesus as the true prophets of Allah and taught the same to teh Muslims.**
I
inJESUS
Guest
What, was my question too hard?
A
anjoh66
Guest
That is muslim belief but it has no connection to the israeli belief and who said that the messiah should be the end of prophets only for jews? No the Messiah would be the end of prophets no need for a prophet after him, thats why the jews didnt accept Mohammadas a prophet be cause he couldnt claim that Jesus was the Messiah and in next breath say that he was the last prophet**anjoh, good thoughts. The Israelis were right in thinking that there would be no prophet amongst them after the Messiah. Indeed, the Messiah was the last prophet amongst the Israelis. He was their Khatam an Nabiyyeen. That was the end of prophethood amongst the Jews. But it did not mean that there would be no prophet in the world again.
Muhammad told the truth about Moses and Jesus. That Jesus was a sub ordinate prophet under the command of Moses and that he was the true promised messiah of the Jews.
Of course the Jews who did not accept Jesus in his life time (600 years earlier) could not accept Jesus as a messiah in the time of Muhamamd. So they rejected Muhammad too. Muhammad accepted Moses and Jesus as the true prophets of Allah and taught the same to teh Muslims.**
A
anjoh66
Guest
Mohammad he no idea of what the Messiah meant, he only heard the christians refferring to Jesus as the Messiah thats why he copied that as he also copied a story from the apocryphic gospel of Thomas, when Jesus was an infant or small boy, he created a bird of clay then blew his spirit into it and it became alive and flew away.
Mohammad didnt realise the meaning of this story, because if it is true it means nothing less than that Jesus is God, because only God created life from clay.
Mohammad didnt realise the meaning of this story, because if it is true it means nothing less than that Jesus is God, because only God created life from clay.
A
anjoh66
Guest
I think the muslims themselves doesnt know what the term imply and what job he has, Mohammad didnt know thats for sure.What does it mean to be the Messiah in Muslim thought? What does that term imply? What job does the Messiah have?
P
planten
Guest
O.K. anjoh, you explain it please if you are so sure. Let us know what was the meaning and duty of the Messiah, the Promised Messiah of the Jews. Please tell us.I think the muslims themselves doesnt know what the term imply and what job he has, Mohammad didnt know thats for sure.
A
anjoh66
Guest
The answer would be too long i therefore paste a link where you can read about the messiah in different religions and their views about him, even the muslim view, but one thing is for sure, Muhammad never claimed to be the messiah but instead referred to Jesus as the messiah and thats why the jews couldnt acceppt him as a prophet because in their views only a false prophet could claim to be a prophet after the messiah.O.K. anjoh, you explain it please if you are so sure. Let us know what was the meaning and duty of the Messiah, the Promised Messiah of the Jews. Please tell us.
answers.com/topic/messiah
R
ralphinal
Guest
Further, the Jews could not have accepted Muhammed as the Messiah because he was not a Jew. Only a Jew who keeps the law can be the Messiah.The answer would be too long i therefore paste a link where you can read about the messiah in different religions and their views about him, even the muslim view, but one thing is for sure, Muhammad never claimed to be the messiah but instead referred to Jesus as the messiah and thats why the jews couldnt acceppt him as a prophet because in their views only a false prophet could claim to be a prophet after the messiah.
answers.com/topic/messiah
The Jews saw him for what he was: a false prophet.
A
anjoh66
Guest
I know that i was only pointing out that even if they could have accepted by reason that he was a decendant from Ishmael and thus a decendant of Abraham and therefore maybe accepted him as a prophet, he himself(Mohammad) put himself in the dilemma when he declared Jesus as the Messiah, i guess he didnt fully understand what it really meant.Further, the Jews could not have accepted Muhammed as the Messiah because he was not a Jew. Only a Jew who keeps the law can be the Messiah.
The Jews saw him for what he was: a false prophet.
R
ralphinal
Guest
No, he did not understand. You think that Allah would have known and explained it to him.I know that i was only pointing out that even if they could have accepted by reason that he was a decendant from Ishmael and thus a decendant of Abraham and therefore maybe accepted him as a prophet, he himself(Mohammad) put himself in the dilemma when he declared Jesus as the Messiah, i guess he didnt fully understand what it really meant.
It is just another way that Islam prooves itself false.
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