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Socrates4Jesus
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What is this test of the Qur’an, H2H? I want very much to examine it for myself!
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AgnosTheist
Guest
The test requires fluency in Arabic. It claims that nobody can ever create a text similar to its chapters.
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Socrates4Jesus
Guest
I can think of only one way someone might actually prove to me that a religious book is divine rather than human in origin.
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AgnosTheist
Guest
WHAT A CHEAT!
After and Before the Tsunami:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
Oh look! All the tiny wooden houses got washed away except for the gigantic stone Mosque. Its a miracle! DUH!
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hamba2han
Guest
The tests are explained here but you do need to go through the whole thread in order to read the relevant posts.
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AgnosTheist
Guest
WHAT A CHEAT!
After and Before the Tsunami:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
Oh look! All the tiny wooden houses got washed away except for the gigantic stone Mosque. Its a miracle! DUH!
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Socrates4Jesus
Guest
I’d rather discuss the tests than read about it. Will you briefly explain what they are?
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Socrates4Jesus
Guest
Either a miracle or exceptionally good engineering!…Oh look! All the tiny wooden houses got washed away except for the gigantic stone Mosque. Its a miracle! DUH!
I’m more interested in putting the source of Islam to the test – the Qur’an itself. I’d also be willing to discuss any objective evidence against the scriptures. I’d like to hear what H2H has to say.
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De_Maria
Guest
Not true. Apparently, some larger structures survived the tsunami. For example, this public school building:
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**High School Building**
http://www.lestariheritage.net/aceh/support/sites12a.jpg
These Dutch public buildings, built in classical Greek temple style, are now used as senior high school buildings (Sekolah Menengah Atas Negeri 1 Banda Aceh). The building survived the tsunami, but the fence and surrounding buildings were seriously damaged....
fficial%26sa%3DGIn fact, he noted that when the tsunami struck, the resulting pressure on some buildings was much less than that of an earthquake, and properly designed buildings did survive the assault. He saw evidence of this on Phi Phi Island, where the wave swept over. “Even though the entire island was devastated,” he said,** “there were a number of hotels that stood up very well.”** Accueil | Gazette | Université d'Ottawa
images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.gazette.uottawa.ca/images/articleimages/050414tsunami-hotel.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.gazette.uottawa.ca/archivearticle_e_715.html&h=208&w=234&sz=19&hl=en&start=33&um=1&tbnid=boVroLb6_09NkM:&tbnh=97&tbnw=109&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dbuildings%2Bsurvived%2Bindonesian%2Btsunami%26start%3D20%26ndsp%3D20%26svnum%3D10%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US
fficial%26sa%3DNSo it seems a number of well built buildings survived the tsunami. Not just the mosques.
Sincerely,
De Maria
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hamba2han
Guest
Oh, you wish to see a picture of a small wooden mosque which survived in the midst of concrete buildings which were completely destroyed by the monster waves?
http://www.fixthingsnow.com/gallery1/albums/userpics/10001/38825312.jpg
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Valke2
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So the Tsunami killed thw worshippors but left the building of worship standing. What am I supposed to understand from this?
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AgnosTheist
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Its a miracle that wooden coconut tree survived without a scratch! but look at the Mosque, it looks heavily damaged. only the roof remained. nope, thats no miracle. sorry.
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hamba2han
Guest
Coconut trees will sway in the wind and are able to withstand being bombarded by huge waves because they have a very flexible trunk.
Are you saying that small wooden mosques have similarly highly flexible pillars and roofs that prevents them from being swept away by monster waves?
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AgnosTheist
Guest
Im saying that mosque was heavily damaged. Or is it that Mosque did not have any walls & furnitures in the first place?
Your miracles are cheap. A true miracle will leave that Mosque 100% damage free.
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De_Maria
Guest
I wonder is this a mosque?
Tsunami and Mahabalipuram
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One of the monuments that survived the tsunami was the [shore temple of Mahabalipuram](http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2001/05/images/020528_sunken.jpg) (named after Mahabali of [Onam](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onam) festival or Pallava king Mamalla).tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:Bh_uI7MXMK5qhM:http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2001/05/images/020528_sunken.jpgimages.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2001/05/images/020528_sunken.jpg&imgrefurl=http://varnam.org/blog/archives/2005/01/tsunami_and_mahabalipuram.php&h=250&w=180&sz=9&hl=en&start=9&um=1&tbnid=Bh_uI7MXMK5qhM:&tbnh=111&tbnw=80&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dtiny%2Bbuildings%2Bwhich%2Bsurvived%2Btsunami%26svnum%3D10%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US
fficial%26sa%3DNhttp://www.grandflavour.com/website/pages/updateimages/15apr/RickApr13cracks.JPG
We cant comment yet on the submersion being a fault line displacement or subsidence due to soft liquid soils. I saw evidence of a fault line with a step of over a meter well inland.
Incredibly many traditional structures survived the intense shaking fairly well.
Even well built concrete buildings floated through it intact.
The real problem is that the entire area is now not only vulnerable to future tsunamis but certain to flood badly.
The tsunami escape vehicles may be needed when the rains come and that is not acceptable. This area needs special attention
There are some interesting steel solutions that Blue Scope Lysaght have developed for flood prone areas. Floors float up the columns keeping everything dry then drop down for ease of access when the waters receed.
Any other ideas?
grandflavour.com/website/archive/2005_04_01_grandflavour_archive.html
Incredibly, some tiny structures survived very well. Seems as though you presented a very selective set of pictures.
Sincerely,
De Maria
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hamba2han
Guest
How about small brick & mortar mosques then which survived with walls and roofs intact, in the midst of similarly contructed brick & mortar buildings which were all completely destroyed and swept away leaving behind only their concrete foundations?
http://1.srv.fotopages.com/2/3771521.jpg
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Valke2
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Are we to assume that the deaths of so many muslims were a sort of miracle? Or that all other buildings had somehow sinned against God? Do you really think that those who survived, looked around and saw the 10s of thousands of their dead muslim brothers and sisters and then looked at the mosque that was still standing and shouted “IT’s a miracle!”???
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Valke2
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I think that Muhammed was angry at the Jews who wouldn’t acknowledge him as a prophet, and that he said hateful things about Jews because of this. Hateful things that ended up in the Quran and have been used as an excuse by many muslims to persecute Jews.
If the Jews of Muhammed’s time would have humored him, it is likely he would not have said some of the things that he said and the Quran would have ended up as a much more “jew friendly” book.
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Valke2
Guest
85 Mosques severely damamged in Sri Lanka. tamilnet.com/art.html?catid=79&artid=13812 (6,500 muslim bodies recovered).
The well known Kadakkaraipalli Mosque, which draws thousands of devotees to its annual flag festival, was also severely damaged by the Tsunami. More than three thousand were killed when this suburb was hit directly by two Tsunami waves.
I’d also point out that it is a virtual certainity that all those houses that surrounded whichever mosque you posted, belonged to Muslims. Why did not this miracle of saving a mosque extend to the houses of muslims or the lives of muslims.
I don’t say these things to mock Islam, but only to point out that when you look for these kinds of miracles to “prove” that your religion has a monopoly on truth, you are on very shakey ground. Pun intended.
The well known Kadakkaraipalli Mosque, which draws thousands of devotees to its annual flag festival, was also severely damaged by the Tsunami. More than three thousand were killed when this suburb was hit directly by two Tsunami waves.
I’d also point out that it is a virtual certainity that all those houses that surrounded whichever mosque you posted, belonged to Muslims. Why did not this miracle of saving a mosque extend to the houses of muslims or the lives of muslims.
I don’t say these things to mock Islam, but only to point out that when you look for these kinds of miracles to “prove” that your religion has a monopoly on truth, you are on very shakey ground. Pun intended.
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hamba2han
Guest
That on the Last Day when the whole world is destroyed, everyone who is living, whether they are good or bad, will be killed together.
I do not see any issue at all that so many Muslims were killed in the tsunami of December 2004.
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