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MartinJordan
Guest
Can you provide proof of a Grand Mufti that believes this, and who stipulates Biblical evidence for such. Can’t wait
MJ
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MJ
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Servant19
Guest
Why would Jesus use the word “Comforter” and “Paraclete” when He could quite decisively use the word “Holy Spirit” to refer to the Holy Spirit, which He did on so many occasions one may lose count?
Is Jesus specifically trying to be vague and confusing?
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marywarfield
Guest
Quite obviously Jesus is describing who and what
the Holy Spirit is and does.
Sort of like calling God God, God the Father, God the Creator etc.
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daler
Guest
Dear Next,
The historical pattern seems to be that followers of the various religions are usually taught that their Prophet is final. In each case, however, there is a renewal of religion when another Prophet appears, as He is followed by a few, while rejected by the leaders of the former religion(s).
i.e.
The last legitimate Prophet recognized by the Jewish community is Moses.
The last legitimate Prophet recognized by the Christian community is Jesus.
The last legitimate Prophet recognized by the Muslim community is Muhammad…
To even consider the appearance of a new Prophet sent by God requires one to go against the grain of orthodoxy. Thus, one must be willing to be stigmatized, ostracized, and condemned by one’s fellow believers from whatever group one originates from.
This tests ones metal.
“With fire We test the gold, and with gold We test Our servants” Baha’u’llah
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MartinJordan
Guest
Every word Jesus said must be taken seriously. Besides, its clear when Jesus continues speaking about the paraclete "He will glorify me because it is **from me that he will receive **what he will make known to you.
Praise God!
MJ
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Servant19
Guest
Is that official Church teaching? If so can you provide a link please?
Thankyou
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Servant19
Guest
So you understand from this that Jesus is referring to a “body of persons” (i.e the Church) when it is clearly and categorically talking about a single Person (i.e HE will glorify me, HE will recieve etc etc)???Every word Jesus said must be taken seriously. Besides, its clear when Jesus continues speaking about the paraclete "He will glorify me because it is from me that he will receive what he will make known to you.
Praise God!
MJ
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MartinJordan
Guest
Don’t get confusedSo you understand from this that Jesus is referring to a “body of persons” (i.e the Church) when it is clearly and categorically talking about a single Person (i.e HE will glorify me, HE will recieve etc etc)???
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From the CCC:
727 The entire mission of the Son and the Holy Spirit, in the fullness of time, is contained in this: that the Son is the one anointed by the Father’s Spirit since his Incarnation - Jesus is the Christ, the Messiah.
Everything in the second chapter of the Creed is to be read in this light. Christ’s whole work is in fact a joint mission of the Son and the Holy Spirit. Here, we shall mention only what has to do with Jesus’ promise of the Holy Spirit and the gift of him by the glorified Lord.
728 Jesus does not reveal the Holy Spirit fully, until he himself has been glorified through his Death and Resurrection. Nevertheless, little by little he alludes to him even in his teaching of the multitudes, as when he reveals that his own flesh will be food for the life of the world.110 He also alludes to the Spirit in speaking to Nicodemus,111 to the Samaritan woman,112 and to those who take part in the feast of Tabernacles.113 To his disciples he speaks openly of the Spirit in connection with prayer114 and with the witness they will have to bear.115
729 Only when the hour has arrived for his glorification does Jesus promise the coming of the Holy Spirit, since his Death and Resurrection will fulfill the promise made to the fathers.116 The Spirit of truth, the other Paraclete, will be given by the Father in answer to Jesus’ prayer; he will be sent by the Father in Jesus’ name; and Jesus will send him from the Father’s side, since he comes from the Father. The Holy Spirit will come and we shall know him; he will be with us for ever; he will remain with us. The Spirit will teach us everything, remind us of all that Christ said to us and bear witness to him. The Holy Spirit will lead us into all truth and will glorify Christ. He will prove the world wrong about sin, righteousness, and judgment.
730 At last Jesus’ hour arrives:117 he commends his spirit into the Father’s hands118 at the very moment when by his death he conquers death, so that, "raised from the dead by the glory of the Father,"119 he might immediately give the Holy Spirit by “breathing” on his disciples.120 From this hour onward, the mission of Christ and the Spirit becomes the mission of the Church: "As the Father has sent me, even so I send you."121
MJ
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marywarfield
Guest
Common sense and I’ve never heard anyone exceptIs that official Church teaching? If so can you provide a link please?
Thankyou
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“Servant19” question it. You know Servant 19 don’t you?
The “Baha’i Apologist”? The “Catholic Answers Forum Member”?or
are you arguing merely for the sake of arguing?
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MartinJordan
Guest
Oh and keep in mind, when it is said “the other Paraclete” (because this will likely go over the head
) the first Paraclete is Jesus himself. Gospel of John helps clarify ( and 1 John, Gospels of Luke, Matthew and Mark, plus Acts too ).
However, all this should be for another thread…seriously.
MJ
) the first Paraclete is Jesus himself. Gospel of John helps clarify ( and 1 John, Gospels of Luke, Matthew and Mark, plus Acts too ).However, all this should be for another thread…seriously.
MJ
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TimothyH
Guest
There were prophets after Jesus. Prophets are all over Acts of the Apostles. One even binds Paul and prophesies.
*Now in these days prophets came down from Jerusalem to Antioch. (Acts 11:27)
Now in the church at Antioch there were prophets and teachers, Barnabas, Simeon who was called Niger, Lucius of Cyre’ne, Man’a-en a member of the court of Herod the tetrarch, and Saul. (Acts 13:1)
And Judas and Silas, who were themselves prophets, exhorted the brethren with many words and strengthened them. (Acts 15:32)
While we were staying for some days, a prophet named Ag’abus came down from Judea. And coming to us he took Paul’s girdle and bound his own feet and hands, and said, “Thus says the Holy Spirit, `So shall the Jews at Jerusalem bind the man who owns this girdle and deliver him into the hands of the Gentiles.’” (Acts 21:10-11)*
The prophets in the Church in Corinth wouldn’t shut up.
Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said. (1 Corinthians 14:29)
The elders who ordained Timothy uttered prophesy.
Do not neglect the gift you have, which was given you by prophetic utterance when the council of elders laid their hands upon you. (1 Timothy 4:14)
The Church at Thessalonica had prophets.
do not despise prophesying, (1 Thessalonians 5:20)
St. John was a prophet. The Book of Revelation is full of prophesy and was written decades after Jesus.
And I was told, "You must again prophesy about many peoples and nations and tongues and kings." (Revelation 10:11)
Scripture makes it crystal clear that there are prophets after Jesus. It is not debatable.
-Tim-
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Dialogues
Guest
Hi,
Okay, you tell me what is the meaning of this verse:
*[John 14:30] I will not say much more to you, for the prince of this world is coming. He has no hold over me, 31 but he comes so that the world may learn that I love the Father and do exactly what my Father has commanded me. *
Peace.
Do you presume to tell the Jews what ‘their sacred scriptures’ mean??
Okay, you tell me what is the meaning of this verse:
*[John 14:30] I will not say much more to you, for the prince of this world is coming. He has no hold over me, 31 but he comes so that the world may learn that I love the Father and do exactly what my Father has commanded me. *
Peace.
I
Isaiah45_9
Guest
That is exactly what Jesus and the Apostles did.
Let’s look at a better translation, shall we?
RSVCE: John 14:30 I will no longer talk much with you, for the ruler of this world is coming. He has no power over me; 31 but I do as the Father has commanded me, so that the world may know that I love the Father. Rise, let us go hence.
Jn 14:30 – The prince of this world is satan. Who has no hold over Jesus and whose gates will never, ever overcome Jesus’ Church.
Jn 14:31 – Jesus loves the Father, and all His deeds are to honor the Father (see Jn 8:29, Jn 15:10). Jesus and the Father are one (Jn 10:30). Whoever really knows Jesus, knows the Father and whoever has seen Jesus, has seen the Father (Jn 14:7-9).
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:
*606 The Son of God, who came down “from heaven, not to do [his] own will, but the will of him who sent [him]”,413 (Jn 6:38) said on coming into the world, “Lo, I have come to do your will, O God.” "And by that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all."414 (Heb 10:5-10) From the first moment of his Incarnation the Son embraces the Father’s plan of divine salvation in his redemptive mission: "My food is to do the will of him who sent me, and to accomplish his work."415 (Jn 4:34) The sacrifice of Jesus "for the sins of the whole world"416 (1 Jn 2:2) expresses his loving communion with the Father. “The Father loves me, because I lay down my life”, said the Lord, "[for] I do as the Father has commanded me, so that the world may know that I love the Father."417 (Jn 10:17; Jn 14:31).
607 The desire to embrace his Father’s plan of redeeming love inspired Jesus’ whole life,418 (Lk 12:50; Lk 22:15; Mt 16:21-23) for his redemptive passion was the very reason for his Incarnation. And so he asked, "And what shall I say? ‘Father, save me from this hour’? No, for this purpose I have come to this hour."419 (Jn 12:27) And again, "Shall I not drink the cup which the Father has given me?"420 (Jn 18:11) From the cross, just before “It is finished”, he said, "I thirst."421 (Jn 19:30; Jn 19:28).*
Christ is what everyone is not - fully human and fully god. Through His humanity, He reveals His Divinity.
Quid Pro Quo
What does this mean:
[bibledrb]Matthew 9:13[/bibledrb]
D
Dialogues
Guest
Hi,
Is this rule given to him by the All-Powerful God, and since when did God Almighty lose overall control of the world?
Peace.
Christians make many interpretations of the OT which neither Jesus nor his disciples made.
So, you are suggesting that Satan wasn’t there before, but was prophecied to come? At what time did Satan begin his rule of the world? And why would Jesus no longer talk much with them because of satan coming?
Is this rule given to him by the All-Powerful God, and since when did God Almighty lose overall control of the world?
Do you claim that there are no sinners among the priesthood in the church?
Peace.
R
rinnie
Guest
Christ said that he would come AGAIN in glory to judge the living and the dead and his kingdom would have no end.
Now who did Christ say would Come?? Did he not say he would return the same way as he left? He rose into heaven and will come back again the same way.
Until then what are we told? Stay true to the teachings of the Apostles, do not stray from the Gospel.
There if only ONE Holy Apostolic Church. One Truth, One God, One Faith.
Christ only told us there would be MANY claiming to come. But remember what he said, claiming to BE HIM.
All of the other claimed to be prophets, he told us you will know they are false by their works. Look how simple it is to know them by their teaching.
The reason it is IMPOSSIBLE for us to believe in them is their version of the truth. Its so different. Its the starying from the gospel Christ warned us about.
D
Dialogues
Guest
Hi,
The Jews were waiting for at least 3 prophets; this is apparent from their questioning of John the Baptist, viz:
Jesus said that John was the Elijah who was to come. He had come in the spirit and power of Elijah. So John’s denial can be taken to mean that he was either denying that he was the same person who was Elijah, for he had come in his likeness, or it can be taken to mean that John was not himself aware that he had fulfilled the prophecy of the return of Elijah.
And Jesus himself was the Christ. It is clear that there was to come one after him, described as ‘the Prophet’. This is understood to be a reference to the Prophet prophecied about in [Deut 18:18].
Apart from ‘the Prophet’, Jesus also prophecied his own second coming. There is no reason why this would not be in the form of another prophet who was to come in the spirit and power of Jesus, just as John the Baptist was the Elijah.
So, we can safely say that at least 2 prophets were expected to come after Jesus.
Peace.
It was quite clear to me that Jesus was referring to himself as a Paraclete whilst making the prophecy. Hence I said it was a prophecy by a prophet about another prophet who would prophecy.Oh and keep in mind, when it is said “the other Paraclete” (because this will likely go over the head
The Jews were waiting for at least 3 prophets; this is apparent from their questioning of John the Baptist, viz:
- John 1:19 And this is the testimony of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, “Who are you?” 20 He confessed, he did not deny, but confessed, “I am not the Christ.” 21 And they asked him, “What then? Are you Eli′jah?” He said, “I am not.” “Are you the prophet?” And he answered, “No.”
Jesus said that John was the Elijah who was to come. He had come in the spirit and power of Elijah. So John’s denial can be taken to mean that he was either denying that he was the same person who was Elijah, for he had come in his likeness, or it can be taken to mean that John was not himself aware that he had fulfilled the prophecy of the return of Elijah.
And Jesus himself was the Christ. It is clear that there was to come one after him, described as ‘the Prophet’. This is understood to be a reference to the Prophet prophecied about in [Deut 18:18].
Apart from ‘the Prophet’, Jesus also prophecied his own second coming. There is no reason why this would not be in the form of another prophet who was to come in the spirit and power of Jesus, just as John the Baptist was the Elijah.
So, we can safely say that at least 2 prophets were expected to come after Jesus.
Peace.
S
Servant19
Guest
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Dialogues
Guest
Hi,
This proves that Prophet Muhammad s.a. was the Promised Paraclete, who exonerated Jesus of the insulting charge of being ‘accursed’ made against him, thereby glorifying him.
Peace.
And the words of Jesus are made known to the people in the Qur’an, which glorifies Jesus as the Messiah who was blessed with nearness to God, and was not accursed by God (i.e. separated from God), which is what both Jews and Christians allege against him, according to their understanding of Deut 21:23 [see Gal 3:13].
This proves that Prophet Muhammad s.a. was the Promised Paraclete, who exonerated Jesus of the insulting charge of being ‘accursed’ made against him, thereby glorifying him.
Peace.
D
Dialogues
Guest
Hi,
Here is a link to a newspaper article confirming the clear fulfillment of a prophecy:
flickr.com/photos/engrmhk/3302912161/
The text of the newspaper article is typed in the right hand side column for clarity.
Peace.
Prophets make prophecies which are fulfilled. Did your Bab make any fulfilled prophecies?Yes, Muhammad and the Bab
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Here is a link to a newspaper article confirming the clear fulfillment of a prophecy:
flickr.com/photos/engrmhk/3302912161/
The text of the newspaper article is typed in the right hand side column for clarity.
Peace.
M
MartinJordan
Guest
Prince of this world is the devil.
Now is the judgment of the world; now will the **prince of the world **be cast out. And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all things to myself.” Now He said this signifying by what death He wants to die (Jn 12: 31-32).
And of course the verse you asked.
Then,
I speak the truth to you; it is expedient for you that I depart. For if I do not go, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go I will send Him to you and when He has come He will convict the world of sin, and of justice, and of judgment; of sin, because they do not believe in me; of justice, because I go to the Father, and you will see me no more; and of judgment, because the prince of this world has already been judged” (Jn 16: 7-11).
That is the sequence.
MJ
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