Protestant Contributions to Theology

[Randy_Carson]

Maybe the issue is that most or all of the heavy theological lifting was already done before the Protestants came on the scene.

:ehh:

But wouldn’t that mean it was done by…

 

[Cavaradossi]

Maybe the issue is that most or all of the heavy theological lifting was already done before the Protestants came on the scene.

Anybody who has seriously studied the history of Christian theology would realize that the Protestants have made many significant contributions to the field. The entire field of Systematic Theology was dominated by Protestants in the 19th Century, and historical criticism was likewise a field which was dominated by Protestants early on. Really, there is no need to be so juvenile, and to try to imply that the Protestants never produced anything of worth. After all, even Aristotle (who was a pagan) produced works which Christians have found worthwhile even to the present day. One can disagree with some tenets of their theology without completely debasing them and pretending that they never produced anything worthwhile or that no Roman Catholic theologians were ever inspired by or were writing in reaction to Protestant theologians.

 

[Randy_Carson]

Anybody who has seriously studied the history of Christian theology would realize that the Protestants have made many significant contributions to the field. The entire field of Systematic Theology was dominated by Protestants in the 19th Century, and historical criticism was likewise a field which was dominated by Protestants early on. Really, there is no need to be so juvenile, and to try to imply that the Protestants never produced anything of worth. After all, even Aristotle (who was a pagan) produced works which Christians have found worthwhile even to the present day.

Juvenile? You hurt my feelings.

Seriously, though, I can run down the list of heresies that were addressed and the creeds that were produced by the councils of the Church prior to the 16th century, and since then, we Catholics got the Immaculate Conception, the Assumption, papal infallibility and more recently Theology of the Body…but those were all by Catholic theologians.

So, I appreciate the suggestions you offered as Protestant contributions.

That’s why I ASKED.

I’m no expert…not even close, so I Googled “systematic theology”. The author(s) of the article reference Augustine, Origen, St. Maximus the Confessor and St. John of Damascus and a boatload of Catholics before and after the Reformation including St. Thomas Aquinas among many others. It’s like a Who’s Who of theology.

[edited for clarity]

 

[Pilosopo]

Maybe the issue is that most or all of the heavy theological lifting was already done before the Protestants came on the scene.

:ehh:

But wouldn’t that mean it was done by…

Well, historically, the foundations of Christianity are in the Catholic Church, with the Protestant Reformation coming to scene only in the early 16th century. Compare that to Aquinas whose theology and philosophy came in the 13th century.

With that said, I guess it was in part because of Protestantism that Catholicism experienced a need for better communication (use of the vernacular in liturgy), and accessibility (the Bible as a key source of understanding our Faith).

 

[RyanBlack]

Juvenile? You hurt my feelings.

Seriously, though, I can run down the list of heresies that were addressed and the creeds that were produced by the councils of the Church prior to the 16th century, and since then, we Catholics got the Immaculate Conception, the Assumption, papal infallibility and more recently Theology of the Body…but those were all by Catholic theologians.

So, I appreciate the suggestions you offered as Protestant contributions.

That’s why I ASKED.

I’m no expert…not even close, so I Googled “systematic theology”. The author(s) of the article reference Augustine, Origen, St. Maximus the Confessor and St. John of Damascus and a boatload of Catholics before and after the Reformation including St. Thomas Aquinas among many others. It’s like a Who’s Who of theology.

Are you SURE that Protestants led the way in this field?

He didn’t say that Protestants led the way in the field of systematic theology (they did not, and I don’t think he would try to claim that they did). He said that they dominated the field in the 19th century (an assertion with which I’m strongly inclined to agree).

 

[Randy_Carson]

He didn’t say that Protestants led the way in the field of systematic theology (they did not, and I don’t think he would try to claim that they did). He said that they dominated the field in the 19th century (an assertion with which I’m strongly inclined to agree).

My bad. I didn’t mean to misrepresent his view, and I have edited my previous post.

 

[AbideWithMe]

Can you name anything that Protestants have contributed to the study of theology that Catholics (or the Orthodox) have embraced?

<chirp, chirp, chirp>

Seriously, anyone got something?

Juvenile? You hurt my feelings.

Seriously, though, I can run down the list of heresies that were addressed and the creeds that were produced by the councils of the Church prior to the 16th century, and since then, we Catholics got the Immaculate Conception, the Assumption, papal infallibility and more recently Theology of the Body…but those were all by Catholic theologians.

So, I appreciate the suggestions you offered as Protestant contributions.

That’s why I ASKED.

If I may, Randy…the chirping crickets line in your first post doesn’t help me take you as a humble and sincere questioner. Nor does your little blue-faced gasping friend—this guy . I mean this constructively, so you’re not giving seemingly mixed messages about your intent with this thread.

 

[RyanBlack]

I’ll give a couple of examples of Protestant theologians with whom I’m personally acquainted, from my studies at Duke Divinity School.

Geoffrey Wainwright is British Methodist theologian, liturgical scholar, and ecumenist whose work is very highly respected not just by other Protestants, but by Orthodox and Catholic scholars. His early work, Eucharist and Eschatology played an important role in the recovery of a sense of the strongly eschatological dimension in the West (this was never really lost among the Orthodox). Also, his *[Doxology/I], which is probably the most important work of his career, is a very important work. It is probably one of a very few works by a western scholar that is a systematic theology based specifically on worship. Finally, he played a vitally important role in the ecumenical text, “Baptism, Eucharist, and Ministry,” which is widely recognized as one of the most important accomplishments of the Faith and Order Commission of the World Council of Churches.

Stanley Hauerwas in one of the leading figures in Christian ethics over the last several decades. His work both in both narrative theology and virtue ethics is very influential.*

 

[onenow1]

Can you name anything that Protestants have contributed to the study of theology that Catholics (or the Orthodox) have embraced?

<chirp, chirp, chirp>

Seriously, anyone got something?

HI,Randy, I would say Matthew, Mark , Luke and John, they sure helped get the bible spread and read, albeit sometimes not altogether in context teaching what it really states and a couple missing books.

God Bless
onenow1

 

[Randy_Carson]

If I may, Randy…the chirping crickets line in your first post doesn’t help me take you as a humble and sincere questioner. Nor does you little blue-faced gasping friend—this guy . I mean this constructively, so you’re not giving seemingly mixed messages about your intent with this thread.

That’s because I’m mixed myself on the meaning and value of Protestantism.

The chirping and the popcorn symbolize my view that we may have to wait awhile before getting any substantive response to the question concerning Protestant contributions to theology. Since you asked, yeah, it’s my contention that there really hasn’t been much.

As was stated by another poster previously, Protestantism gave us sola scriptura and sola fide…but those ideas were not accepted by the Catholic and Orthodox churches.

Oh, wait…Protestants okay’d the use of artificial birth control in the 1930’s, they have ordained women as priests and bishops and openly gay clergy now, too, I believe. Some Catholics are excited by these developments, I suppose…

Oh, and let’s not forget about the wildly popular RAPTURE.

So, it seems like a mixed bag, at best.

Protestants have done wonderful things regarding bible study and evangelism, and their megachurches with rock bands and coffee bars seem to draw a crowd.

Which brings me to the

Protestants got an awful lot of their theology (along with their scriptures) from Catholicism, but you won’t hear many of them admitting that. I’m not sure how many even know the magnitude of their debt to the Catholic Church. It always seems to come as a bit of a shock to them when they begin to learn a little Church history.

 

[Cavaradossi]

I’m no expert…not even close, so I Googled “systematic theology”. The author(s) of the article reference Augustine, Origen, St. Maximus the Confessor and St. John of Damascus and a boatload of Catholics before and after the Reformation including St. Thomas Aquinas among many others. It’s like a Who’s Who of theology.

The earlier theologians are said to be systematic in a different sense. They are said to be systematic in that they were thorough, but not systematic like the 19th century Systematic Theologians, who were systematic in a different fashion. They would start with a fundamental set of axioms and root out any potential contradictions within their systems. One finds far fewer apparent contradictions or paradoxes in the systems of 19th century Systematic Theologians than one would find in say St. John of Damascus or Thomas Aquinas.

 

[Cavaradossi]

Protestants got an awful lot of their theology (along with their scriptures) from Catholicism, but you won’t hear many of them admitting that. I’m not sure how many even know the magnitude of their debt to the Catholic Church. It always seems to come as a bit of a shock to them when they begin to learn a little Church history.

It depends on the Protestant in question. Some will even quote Aquinas and others, when they are in agreement. Whereas the less theologically literate may not be as aware.

 

[cheezey]

…
Protestants got an awful lot of their theology (along with their scriptures) from Catholicism, but you won’t hear many of them admitting that. I’m not sure how many even know the magnitude of their debt to the Catholic Church. It always seems to come as a bit of a shock to them when they begin to learn a little Church history.

I would acknowledge that, as do 100% of the others I know, who, admittedly, constitute just my tiny corner of a very large world. (But I have been around a while, too.)
Nor do any deny that The Catholic Church was there first, or that much is indeed owed to her, the First Christian Church.
So you can be sure of at least my corner of the world.

 

[Randy_Carson]

I would acknowledge that, as do 100% of the others I know, who, admittedly, constitute just my tiny corner of a very large world.
Nor do any deny that The Catholic Church was there first, or that much is indeed owed to her, the First Christian Church.
So you can be sure of at least my corner of the world.

Thanks.

Generalizations are problematic.

 

[cheezey]

Thanks.

Generalizations are problematic.

Oh, I wasn’t even thinking generalizations. Just wanted you to know that many, a significant number, are indeed aware.

 

[RyanBlack]

That’s because I’m mixed myself on the meaning and value of Protestantism.

The chirping and the popcorn symbolize my view that we may have to wait awhile before getting any substantive response to the question concerning Protestant contributions to theology. Since you asked, yeah, it’s my contention that there really hasn’t been much.

As was stated by another poster previously, Protestantism gave us sola scriptura and sola fide…but those ideas were not accepted by the Catholic and Orthodox churches.

Oh, wait…Protestants okay’d the use of artificial birth control in the 1930’s, they have ordained women as priests and bishops and openly gay clergy now, too, I believe. Some Catholics are excited by these developments, I suppose…

Oh, and let’s not forget about the wildly popular RAPTURE.

So, it seems like a mixed bag, at best.

Protestants have done wonderful things regarding bible study and evangelism, and their megachurches with rock bands and coffee bars seem to draw a crowd.

Which brings me to the

Protestants got an awful lot of their theology (along with their scriptures) from Catholicism, but you won’t hear many of them admitting that. I’m not sure how many even know the magnitude of their debt to the Catholic Church.

I’m afraid this post is an example of stereotyping of Protestantism and Protestant theology.

You say that it is your contention that there has not been much in the way of substantive Protestant contributions to theology, but you also say in another post that you’re “no expert, not even close.” As someone who has studied a fair amount of Catholic, Orthodox, and Protestant theology with Catholic and Protestant theologians and historians, I suggest that your viewpoint is one that is, well, marginal at best.

Openly gay clergy is accepted by a minority of Protestants. The Rapture is popular among only certain groups of Protestants, and is widely rejected by scholars in the Anglican, Lutheran, Presbyterian, and Methodist traditions. Finally, I disagree with your assertion that you won’t hear many Protestants admitting that they got a great deal of their theology from Catholicism. Of course there are many who don’t (especially those with little education in Church History), but in my experience, there are many, many Protestants (and certainly Protestant religious scholars) who acknowledge that there is a great deal (probably a large majority) of their belief system that is essentially Catholic/Orthodox.

 

[cheezey]

I’m afraid this post is an example of stereotyping of Protestantism and Protestant theology.

You say that it is your contention that there has not been much in the way of substantive Protestant contributions to theology, but you also say in another post that you don’t know much about Protestant theologians. As someone who has studied a fair amount of Catholic, Orthodox, and Protestant theology with Catholic and Protestant theologians and historians, I suggest that your viewpoint is one that is, well, marginal at best.

Openly gay clergy is accepted by a minority of Protestants. The Rapture is popular among only certain groups of Protestants, and is widely rejected by scholars in the Anglican, Lutheran, Presbyterian, and Methodist traditions. Finally, I disagree with your assertion that you won’t hear many Protestants admitting that they got a great deal of their theology from Catholicism. Of course there are many who don’t (especially those with little education in Church History), but in my experience, there are many, many Protestants (and certainly Protestant religious scholars) who acknowledge that there is a great deal (probably a large majority) of their belief system that is essentially Catholic/Orthodox.

 

[Randy_Carson]

I’m afraid this post is an example of stereotyping of Protestantism and Protestant theology.

You say that it is your contention that there has not been much in the way of substantive Protestant contributions to theology, but you also say in another post that you’re “no expert, not even close.” As someone who has studied a fair amount of Catholic, Orthodox, and Protestant theology with Catholic and Protestant theologians and historians, I suggest that your viewpoint is one that is, well, marginal at best.

Okay. I may be wrong.

Openly gay clergy is accepted by a minority of Protestants.

So far.

The Rapture is popular among only certain groups of Protestants, and is widely rejected by scholars in the Anglican, Lutheran, Presbyterian, and Methodist traditions.

My parents are Methodist and my mom loves the Left Behind series. But okay.

Finally, I disagree with your assertion that you won’t hear many Protestants admitting that they got a great deal of their theology from Catholicism. Of course there are many who don’t (especially those with little education in Church History), but in my experience, there are many, many Protestants (and certainly Protestant religious scholars) who acknowledge that there is a great deal (probably a large majority) of their belief system that is essentially Catholic/Orthodox.

I hope you are right, but hang around this forum awhile longer…you’ll hear it.

 

[AbideWithMe]

Which brings me to the

Protestants got an awful lot of their theology (along with their scriptures) from Catholicism, but you won’t hear many of them admitting that. I’m not sure how many even know the magnitude of their debt to the Catholic Church. It always seems to come as a bit of a shock to them when they begin to learn a little Church history.

It depends on the Protestant in question. Some will even quote Aquinas and others, when they are in agreement. Whereas the less theologically literate may not be as aware.

I would acknowledge that, as do 100% of the others I know, who, admittedly, constitute just my tiny corner of a very large world. (But I have been around a while, too.)
Nor do any deny that The Catholic Church was there first, or that much is indeed owed to her, the First Christian Church.
So you can be sure of at least my corner of the world.

Randy, I agree with Cavaradossi and Cheezey. It varies from person to person. You can find Protestants (probably reflecting the case among the general public) with little interest in history, and likewise you can find plenty of them well-read in the works of early Christian theologians and mystics. The latter are far more common than seems to be acknowledged by some Catholic posters on CAF.

 

[RyanBlack]

My parents are Methodist and my mom loves the Left Behind series. But okay.

Is your mom a theologian, biblical scholar, or church historian? If you re-read my post, you will notice that I was referring to scholars. I earned both the Master of Divinity and the Master of Theology at Duke University Divinity School, which is a Methodist theological school. I assure you, the rapture is not associated with scholars in the Methodist tradition.