Yes, I understand, but what does that say of the CC of that time if such a man could wrench it almost in half…does God indeed choose such “foolishness/weakness” to confound the “wise”, to choose such a man who was less than his predecessors (Huss, Wycliffe, or Savonarola, Kempis,) to ride the crest of what they had begun ?
Ok…but it SURE seemed that you did to me.adf417:
No, I am only stating i read two articles and highlighted it was a "quick’’ look, correct ? Also left room for OP’s experience, empathizing (sorry) with anyone’s negative experience, correct ? As to the "whole’’ of Carm, not sure even the OP suggests viewing everything. Safe to say room is left open to go into more specifics of what was offensive or rude, if one wished to in our brief posting here.
So, Catholics make things up, but other denominations do not? That’s an interesting take on ecumenism.goout:
Catholics.
I can hear my ACNA priest’s words echoing in my ear:
My point is not that that claim is wrong, but rather that it is unconvincing to non-Catholics. Saying “you should be a Catholic because it’s the true Church” is not only kind of begging the question but assuming that the question is important and legitimate to begin with. For Catholic ecclesiology to convince the typical Protestant, you first have to convince him that it’s actually an important topic. Then you have to convince him that the Catholic Church is the true church.
lol…well, sometimes we find what we seek.
I believe many Catholics here know our definition of “church”, and how it compares to CC definition. For sure it is the body of Christ, believers in Christ, the “called out ones” as the Greek “ecclesia” suggests. For sure true Christians have pastors, deacons , presbyters who have roots in apostolicity, as in “apostolic is as apostolic does”, a transfer of body of faith, as much as any laying on of hands as sign of transfer. The church is both visible and invisible (spiritual) reality. We do not obviously see the bishop of Rome as vicar to Christ, but rather the Holy Spirit, and hence do not judge subservience to Rome as litmus test , rather the latter.
There is a fine line between rightly dividing and justifying division wrongly. St. Paul warns of divisions, as in I am of Paul or I am of Peter and that feeling “right” over another brother could be, could be carnal.
We??? Can “we” use this philosophy on your assessment of CARM earlier? Especially since your sample size was only 2?adf417:
lol…well, sometimes we find what we seek.
Im not either (thank you LORD) but i do know a few who are - based on your description of church above who agree it should be visible but…well, they just cant agree that it is because of all the differences in salvific issues. :man_shrugging:t3:
The “idea” of the true Church, is a Jesus idea. Jesus never said, He would leave us a book but a Church. He never said when disagreeing, take it to the book, but take it to the Church. He never said a book would be a pillar and foundation of truth but a Church. The Bible is part of that Church. Without the Church, understanding Scripture leads to chaos, as is seen today.
A lot of the reasons you give here for protestants not coming into the Catholic church, they do not feel it is an important topic, is actually the very reason that brings most protestants into the Catholic church.
This is the very reason why there is a need for the Catholic church. Christ knew we would need the Church to show the way to salvation, the way to get washed in the blood of the Lamb, since as we can see, in the non-Catholic communities, there would be chaos. The big question among non-Catholics is, how do you get “washed in the blood of the Lamb?”. When asking you will easily get way, way more than two different answers. This difference of opinion on how one obtains salvation is the very thing that continues to cause division in non-Catholic churches and brings non-Catholics home to the Catholic church.