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CWBetts
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It was a good question Jon. Part of the division between Protestants and Catholics is how we define words, including some as basic to the dialog as “blasphemy”, “faith”, and “works”Thanks for the clarification. I wasn’t aware of that. One thing my comment and your reply have done, however, is save all of us the inevitable charge from someone that your use of the term “blaspheme” in relation to the Blessed Virgin proves you think her a goddess.
Jon
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Dokimas
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Are you saying there are different ‘denominations’ of catholic churches?
=elvisman;5690392]**They ****WERE **right about many things that they learned from the Church.
OK, you’re one up on me, but I’ll come up with something.
Do you think this source, and we agree about their importance to a point, and the marian doctrines themselves, are articles of faith, necessary for salvation?
Jon
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lil_flower_luv
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Most definitely, yes!
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CWBetts
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No, but there are different Rites. We are in union when it comes to doctrine, faith, and morals. But practices can differ. The Divine Liturgy of the East is always chanted, and it lasts longer than the Mass of the West. In addition the ecclesial language of the west is Latin, and there are differnt languages used in the East, such as Old Slavonic. But the key is we agree in doctrine. We all have seven sacraments. We are in total communion in our beliefs. Unlike the Protestants, where there are doctrinal divisions even among different groups of Baptists (as an example, various communities of Baptists have different views on “eternal security”)
None. I just said it is good manners to refer to people as they prefer. I’ve found that some Catholics, particularly but not exclusively, of rites other than Latin, think the term “Roman Catholic” doesn’t well describe the whole of the Catholic Church. And some Catholics of the Latin rite don’t like it because of its roots as a pejorative.
Jon
Hi LFL,
Ok, based on what?
And, would you say that the Orthodox concept of the Blessed Virgin is sufficient?
What about my view (similar to Luther’s), - sinless because of God’s grace, ever virgin, in heaven though we can’t know the specifics of how she got there, that she (and the whole of the Church Triumphant) prays for us, the Church Militant, in a general sense (not in response to our petitions). Is this sufficient for salvation?
Jon
BTW, the picture in your signature is beautiful.
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CWBetts
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For the record, Vatican City may be surrounded by Rome, but it is not in Rome. Vatican City is its own independent City-State, Much like Lesotho is surrounded by South Africa, but is not in South Africa.
And another point, the Catholic Church has its roots, not in Europe, but on a mountain in Jerusalem called Calvary
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lil_flower_luv
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Hello Jon! 
Based on what I believe as a Catholic.
I’ll let God be the judge of your salvation, but, if you honor His mother, you are surely on the right road!
Thank you! I actually get really bored with my signature fast - I even changed it again! Lol.
Jon
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lil_flower_luv
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Thank you, your faith is all it takes, after all.
Yes, I find it is a lot easier to talk to Lutherans!
Sorry, I like variety…
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Dokimas
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The point being, the Vatican is not in Jerusalem. The RCC started later than the 1st century when the church started in the book of Acts.
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CWBetts
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I disagree. I encourage you to read the Early Church Fathers. You will find the Eucharist, Veneration of the Saints, praying for the dead, Liturgical worship, etc. Truth be told, the Scriptures tell as all about what to believe, but very little about the form of worship. For that we need to go to the writings of the earliest Christians, and you will find that form of worship is very Catholic.
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Justy90
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Justy90
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It’s actually Early Church if you want to be accurate. Catholic being a religious institution claiming to be part of the one holy catholic and apostolic Church.**Technically - it’s Catholic **- Anglicanism being a divorced faction from Catholicism . . .
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Radical
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Hi Jon…I haven’t read all the posts after this, so hopefully I am not repeating what has already been said. You may wish to consider the use of “blasphemous” found in Acts 6:
*8 And Stephen, full of faith and power, did great wonders and signs among the people. 9 Then there arose some from what is called the Synagogue of the Freedmen (Cyrenians, Alexandrians, and those from Cilicia and Asia), disputing with Stephen. 10 And they were not able to resist the wisdom and the Spirit by which he spoke. 11 Then they secretly induced men to say, "We have heard him speak **blasphemous words against Moses *and God." 12 And they stirred up the people, the elders, and the scribes; and they came upon him, seized him, and brought him to the council. 13 They also set up false witnesses who said, “This man does not cease to speak blasphemous words against this holy place and the law; 14 for we have heard him say that this Jesus of Nazareth will destroy this place and change the customs which Moses delivered to us.”
Thanks, Radical.
Jon
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CWBetts
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The Catholic Church is not “part of thr one holy catholic and apostolic church” It is said church. It is the only Church which bears all four marks (one, holy, catholic, apostolic)
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Justy90
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That’s what the Catholic church says. The Bible doesn’t tell us that nor does anyone else.
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