Protestants and Mary

[RickHolland]

And on and on and on and on…

It is amazing what we cannot see (in scripture or anywhere else), when we do not WANT to see it.

This thread could go on for a million posts and people will still not see what they do not want to see, no matter how good a case is made for it.

Others have said it better than me, so to the great defenses many have given here for our Blessed Mother, let me add a few from people much better at it than I:

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from St. Augustine:
“If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don’t like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself.”

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from Martin Luther :
(Please note that Luther wrote these comments, not while he was a Catholic, but years after he left the Church, shortly before his death in 1546.)

“She, the lady above Heaven and earth, must have a heart so humble, that she would have no shame in washing the swaddling clothes or preparing a bath for St. John the Baptist, like a servant girl. What humility. Surely it would have been more just to arrange for her a golden coach, pulled by 4000 horses. And to cry and proclaim as the carriage proceeded, here passes the woman who was raised above the whole human race. She was not filled with pride by this praise, this immense praise.”

“No woman is like unto thee, thou art more than an empress or a queen. Blessed above all nobility, wisdom, or saintliness.”

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and of course from our Lady herself:
Luke 1:…
46 And Mary said: "My soul proclaims the greatness of the Lord;
47 my spirit rejoices in God my savior.
48 For he has looked upon his handmaid’s lowliness; behold, from now on will all ages call me blessed.

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So keep slugging away boys, but in my experience, teaching the truth to a fundamentalist is a lot like performing an exorcism.
I, like our Lady, am more interested in winning a soul than winning an argument.
+Peace,
Bob

Hi Bob,

That is because you can’t see the plain words of Mary herself. The one statement above eliminates and thought of an immaculate conception or perpetual sinlessness and any possibility of co-mediatrix; can you see that? She was like the rest of us; stained with the ugliness of sin and in need of a savior. She is what God would calls all saints; vessels of honor. The ones that deny the truth of Scripture are vessels of wrath prepared for the day of destruction.

John 7 - Therefore His brothers said to Him, "Leave here and go into Judea, so that Your disciples also may see Your works which You are doing. 4 “For no one does anything in secret when he himself seeks to be {known} publicly. If You do these things, show Yourself to the world.” 5 For not even His brothers were believing in Him. 6 So Jesus *said to them, "My time is not yet here, but your time is always opportune. 7 "The world cannot hate you, but it hates Me because I testify of it, that its deeds are evil.

You see Bob, He had brothers; no more virginity; you gave it up to her husband Joseph, just as God has it for all married couples.

Matthew 12:46-50 46 While He was still speaking to the crowds, behold, His mother and brothers were standing outside, seeking to speak to Him. 47 Someone said to Him, “Behold, ***Your mother and Your brothers are standing outside seeking to speak to You.” ***48 But Jesus answered the one who was telling Him and said, “Who is My mother and who are My brothers?” 49 And stretching out His hand toward His disciples, He said, "Behold My mother and My brothers! 50 “For whoever does the will of My Father who is in heaven, he is My brother and sister and mother.”

Gees; there it is again; brothers.
Mt 13:56 “And His sisters, are they not all with us? Where then {did} this man {get} all these things?”

Mr 6:3 “Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, and brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon? ***Are not His sisters here with us?” ***And they took offense at Him.

Gees; sisters too; now what will an unrational person do with all this?
See Bob; you have the truth from Scripture about Mary. Will you deny or accept the truth of the word of God or will you plainly reject the word of God? The choice is set before you; chose you this day, the way of life or the way of death; the choice is your and yours alone.

God bless you,
rick

 

[RickHolland]

bowing before statues is not something that the church requires people to do. They do it because they are paying respect to their mother - not worship. They realize that it is only a symbol of her.

it is exactly the same thing when a wife kisses a picture of her husband who went off to war - or a mother kissing the picture of her child. They’re not worshipping either - they’re expressing love.
Boy - i shudder to think of the lack of loving expression in your family.

your ignorant rants are getting really embarassing.

***the doctrine of the sole mediation of Christ ***(cf. 1 Tim 2, 3), which does not, however, exclude subordinate mediations, which must always be understood in relation to the all embracing mediation of Christ(275).

From 211 ***intercessors and friends of the faithful ***who are still on the earthly pilgrimage, because the Saints, already enraptured by the happiness of God, ***know the needs of their brothers and sisters and accompany them on their pilgrim journey with their prayers and protection; ***

**Elvis; show in Scripture where this is based. ** This is a sad discourse without merit.

patrons of the Local Churches, of which they were founders (St. Eusebius of Vercelli) or illustrious Pastors (St. Ambrose of Milan); patrons of nations: apostles of their conversion to the Christian faith (St Thomas and St. Bartholomew in India) or expressions of national identity ( St. Patrick in the case of Ireland); of corporations and professions (St. Omobono for tailors); in particular circumstances - in childbirth (St. Anne, St. Raimondo Nonato), in death (St. Joseph) - or ***to obtain specific graces ***(St. Lucy for the recovery of eyesight) etc…

Give us one example of an apostles, or writer or the Lord prayig to anyone except the Father. Just one example. Then, show us where a saint prays for the living and can obtain “graces”. Sounds like it is all made up; certainly outside the strict bounds of Scripture.

In thanksgiving to God the Father, the Church professes all this when she proclaims “You give us an example to follow in the lives of your Saints, ***assistance by their intercession, and a bond of fraternal love in the communion of grace”(***278).

Now you are thanking God for the intercession given by the deceased on earth saints. Sounds more like teaching people to take way the glory due only to God.

1. The ultimate object of veneration of the Saints …

From 214 (speaking of Angels) and ***they present the prayer of the Saints to God ***(cf. Ap 8, 34) blasphemy; the Holy Spirit is the one who does this.

1. The Church, which at its outset was saved and protected by the ministry of Angels, and which constantly experiences their “mysterious and powerful assistance”(281), venerates these heavenly spirts and has recourse to their prompt intercession. More blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

Why do you Catholics always deny the fact that you do worship, saints, angels, images and relics? Why not just admit it and move on? By denying what is so blatently obvious; you lose any credibility for honesty. At least you own writing do not deny it; they just redefine it to a “lessor form of worship”; so why do you deny it; is it embarrassing to you because it sounds ridiculous?

2141
The veneration of sacred images is based on the mystery of the Incarnation of the Word of God. It is not contrary to the first commandment. In other words, veneration or worship of sacred images is based on Jesus. Where is this in Scripture?

***There are several degrees of this worship: ***
When worship is addressed only indirectly to God, that is, when its object is the veneration of martyrs, of angels, or of saints, it is a subordinate worship dependent on the first, and relative, in so far as it honours the creatures of God for their peculiar relations with Him; it is designated by theologians as the worship of dulia, a term denoting servitude, and implying, when used to signify our worship of distinguished servants of God, that their service to Him is their title to our veneration newadvent.org/cathen/15710a.htm

Do you know what God calls this?
Quit denying you worship Mary, saints, and angels and saints that don’t even exist. Call a spade a spade or is it embarrassing to admit what you are taught?

Col. 2:18 ***Let no one keep defrauding you of your prize by delighting in self-abasement ***and the worship of the angels, taking his stand on {visions} he has seen, inflated without cause by his fleshly mind

Worship of angels is strictly forbidden in Scripture.

In Exodus "You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. 5 "You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God,

Elvis; what will you do with the truth and the reality of worshipping saints, angels and Mary in light of what God has said? The Truth sets before you; do you chose to obey God or not; the choice is all of yours and no one can force you make a choice.

 

[RickHolland]

Everybody needs a Savior - EVERYBODY - and Mary was no different.
BUT - she was saved before she came into the world, whereas, we are saved AFTER.
Being the fulfillment of the Ark of the Covenant, Mary had to be as pure and blessed and untouchable as the Ark itself - even MORE SO.

ALL New Testament fulfillments are more glorious and more special that the Old Testament types. ALWAYS - without exception.

I was saved before I came to the world; will you worship me to?
Romans 8 - For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; 30 and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.

All in the past tense; I was predestined before the foundation of the world; my name was written in the Lamb’s Book of Life efore I was born. Will you worship me to?

It was also given to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them, and authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation was given to him. 8 ***All who dwell on the earth will worship him, (antiChrist) ***{everyone} ***whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb ***who has been slain.

 

[elvisman]

Hi there! Thank you for your appreciation! Yes, there are also a number of Evangelicals–as I have noticed in this forum–who are also ignorant of some biblical doctrines. By the way, I do not reject Mary being the mother of God the Son. I just don’t see the need to pray to her or to any other dead saint when I can directly pray to God through Jesus. It just takes the same amount of time and effort anyway. As to asking a living person to pray for me or when I am asked to intercede for someone, Scripture supports that as taught by Jesus when He said that "“Again, I tell you that if two of you on earth agree about anything you ask for, it will be done for you by my Father in heaven” (Matt. 18:19). Those who have died and have gone to heaven are already not on earth, so it is a different case. Besides, we can not even be sure if they can really hear our prayers, especially if we pray mentally, for only God is omniscient. Not even Satan, nor the demons, nor the angels can read our thoughts, only God. There was an argument posited by John Martignoni, a Catholic apologist. He said that the saints in heaven are able to hear our prayers because God tells them what we are praying for. I find that really absurd! Imagine the scenario: I am praying to a saint for him to pray to God for me. God hears my prayers and so He tell that saint to pray to Him for me and these are the things I want him to pray to God for me. Can you imagine that? Martignoni’s explanation didn’t help at all! In fact, it made it worse!

First of all - the saints in heaven are NOT dead. They are FAR more alove than you or I and have been made perfect and righteous in the presence of God.

Secondly, you say that the saints would have to be omniscient to hear our prayers. that is nonsense - IF you know the Scriptures. Haven’t you ever read 2 Peter 3:8 (also see Psalm 90:4) where we are told that, "… with the Lord one day is like a thousand years and a thousand years like one day"?
Heaven is outside of time and therefore everything happening on earth is like a finished painting.

Thirdly, in Rev 5:8 we are given a glimpse at just how alive these people in heav are and how they interced on our behalf:
"When he took it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each of the elders held a harp and gold bowls filled with incense, which are the prayers of the holy ones (us here on earth)."
To deny that they can aslo pray for us is to deny the Body of Christ - of which we are ALL a part (1 Cor. 12:12-26). ALL of the parts of Christ’s Body share in the joy AND suffering of one another.

Lastly, I think you have confused John Martignoni’s explanation. He contends that the petitions of the faithful are revealed to those in heaven by God - as is EVERYTHING else. God is in charge of everything and even those in heaven have no power without him.

No, you’re wrong here because Scripture indeed supports the idea of asking those in heaven - as well as those of us here on earth for prayers.

 

[BornAgain89]

As soon as I confirm some of the Catholic beliefs that i have learned here at Cathlic Answers, I am strongly considering leaving the Catholic religion. I am a convert of 13 years. What I was taught in RCIA never covered many of the beliefs I have learned here. I have found that I refuse to let go of much of my Protestant faith I had for 7 yr. I am not sure if i will ever join another church, I will in fact not deny the gathering together with other Christians to worship our Lord though.
You are thinking, this posting is not going along with the topic of this thread right? Well, you will find that it is. I am leaving the Catholic Church , i am almost sure of that but I am taking The Blessed Mother with me.

 

[elvisman]

I was saved before I came to the world; will you worship me to?
Romans 8 - For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; 30 and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.

All in the past tense; I was predestined before the foundation of the world; my name was written in the Lamb’s Book of Life efore I was born. Will you worship me to?

It was also given to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them, and authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation was given to him. 8 ***All who dwell on the earth will worship him, (antiChrist) ***{everyone} ***whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb ***who has been slain.

**You have already been shown and it has already been explained to you many times that we do not worship Mary or any of the other saints in Heaven. What you are doing now is bearing false witness - and that is a direct violation against God and his Church. In short - you have become a liar - and if that’s the best you can do - I feel sorry for you.

As I explained in post #761 - Heaven is outside of time. You would know that if you knew the Scriptures. Being outside of time, it is written about as being in the present tense. There is no future in heaven as it is all happening in the now. This is why it is written about the names being in the Lamb’s Book of Life. You CAN - as many DO - fall away.

Now - a little lesson about our cooperation with God’s grace and our perseverance here on earth in order to be saved:

Matthew 24:10-13 And at that time many will fall away and will deliver up one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise, and will mislead many. And because lawlessness is increased, most people’s love will grow cold But the one who endures to the end, he shall be saved.

John 15.10 If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father’ s commands and remain in his love

**1 Timothy 4:1 The Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith by paying attention to deceitful spirits and demonic instructions through the hypocrisy of liars with branded consciences. **

**Romans 11:21-22 For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either. Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off. **

**Philippians 3:11-14 in order that I may attain to the resurrection from the dead. Not that I have already obtained it or have already become perfect, but I press on in order that I may lay hold of that for which also I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus. Brethren, I do not regard myself as having laid hold of it yet; but one thing I do forgetting what lies behind and reaching forward to what lies ahead, I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus. **

**1 Timothy 1:18-19Timothy, my son, I give you this instruction in keeping with the prophecies once made about you, so that by following them you may fight the good fight, holding on to faith and a good conscience. Some have rejected these and so have shipwrecked their faith. **

Hebrews 6:4-6 For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and THEN HAVE FALLEN AWAY, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God, and put Him to open shame.

 

[elvisman]

continued . . .

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**2 Peter 2:20 If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christand are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning. 21It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them. **

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2 Peter 3:16-17 Paul’s letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction. Therefore, dear friends, since you already know this, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of lawless men and fall from your secure position.

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Revelation 3:5, 11-12 He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels. I am coming soon. Hold on to what you have, so that no one will take your crown. Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God.

 

[elvisman]

As soon as I confirm some of the Catholic beliefs that i have learned here at Cathlic Answers, I am strongly considering leaving the Catholic religion. I am a convert of 13 years. What I was taught in RCIA never covered many of the beliefs I have learned here. I have found that I refuse to let go of much of my Protestant faith I had for 7 yr. I am not sure if i will ever join another church, I will in fact not deny the gathering together with other Christians to worship our Lord though.
You are thinking, this posting is not going along with the topic of this thread right? Well, you will find that it is. I am leaving the Catholic Church , i am almost sure of that but I am taking The Blessed Mother with me.

**Well, that’s unfortunate.
What are the reasons for your leaving? You haven’t elaborated.

 

[RickHolland]

Mary was sinless as well. Even if not explicitly in Scripture, it does not violate Scripture, provided that you are competent at understanding contextual clues.

Probably explains why she said herself “my God my Savior”, but apparently you knew more than she did; how god-like of you

 

[elvisman]

Probably explains why she said herself “my God my Savior”, but apparently you knew more than she did; how god-like of you

You see, Rick - this is why I believe you’re nothing more than an anti-Catholic antagonist.
This has been explained ad nauseam but you refuse to read and unberstand. I don’t think that you’re unintelligent - just spritually prideful.

Just in case I’m wrong and you are unintelligent - I’ll explain it one more time:
Mary’s statement was true - she needed a savior. One ancient analogy puts it this way:
We are saved by Jesus, who pulls us out of the puddle of mud (sin), whereas, Mary was saved FROM falling into the puddle.

Now - hopefully we won’t be hearing this argument from you again as if you had never received an answer.

 

[RickHolland]

**
Secondly, you say that the saints would have to be omniscient to hear our prayers. that is nonsense** - IF you know the Scriptures. Haven’t you ever read 2 Peter 3:8 (also see Psalm 90:4) where we are told that, "… with the Lord one day is like a thousand years and a thousand years like one day"?
Heaven is outside of time and therefore everything happening on earth is like a finished painting.

No, you’re wrong here because Scripture indeed supports the idea of asking those in heaven - as well as those of us here on earth for prayers.

Exactly how does a day like a thousand years and a thousand years like a day equate to a saint in heaven hearing a prayer?

Where does Scripture support any idea of having a earthly dead saint of angel to interceed for us before God?

I’ll smoke a cigar:hey_bud: and eat some popcorn while we all wait with great anticipation for your Biblical intellect to shine forth.

 

[RickHolland]

You see, Rick - this is why I believe you’re nothing more than an anti-Catholic antagonist.
This has been explained ad nauseam but you refuse to read and unberstand. I don’t think that you’re unintelligent - just spritually prideful.

Just in case I’m wrong and you are unintelligent - I’ll explain it one more time:
Mary’s statement was true - she needed a savior. One ancient analogy puts it this way:
We are saved by Jesus, who pulls us out of the puddle of mud (sin), whereas, Mary was saved FROM falling into the puddle.

Now - hopefully we won’t be hearing this argument from you again as if you had never received an answer.

You see Elvis; the Truth could sneak up behind you and bite you and you still would deny it; it is called spiritual ignorance. Only you are not ignorant, therefore blindness might be more appropriate; you have the Truth layed before your eyes; you have chosen by you own admissions to ignore what God has said and actually change what God has said. Do you know what the end result of denying and changing the Word is? It is your choice and you will be judged by those choices just as the rest of us will, including myself.

It is you who is full of bitterness and hate for anyone who disagrees with your point of view. Sad, very sad, my heart goes out to you in pity; as God is my witness.
rick

 

[CWBetts]

Probably explains why she said herself “my God my Savior”, but apparently you knew more than she did; how god-like of you

I never said she didn’t need a savior. How god-like of you to decree that God is incapable of keeping the God-bearer from sin. Mary stayed sinless not of her own power, like you assume we believe, but from the unique graces given exclusively to the Mother of God. She needed a savior, its just that she was saved preemptively. Why is it that you feel the need to limit God, and tell Him what he can and cannot do, based on you own limited understanding?

 

[elvisman]

Exactly how does a day like a thousand years and a thousand years like a day equate to a saint in heaven hearing a prayer?

Where does Scripture support any idea of having a earthly dead saint of angel to interceed for us before God?

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I’ll smoke a cigar:hey_bud: and eat some popcorn while we all wait with great anticipation for your Biblical intellect to shine forth.

Clarify this sentence and I’ll be able to answer you better.**
**Not really sure what you mean here.

 

[Benn]

As soon as I confirm some of the Catholic beliefs that i have learned here at Cathlic Answers, I am strongly considering leaving the Catholic religion. I am a convert of 13 years. What I was taught in RCIA never covered many of the beliefs I have learned here. I have found that I refuse to let go of much of my Protestant faith I had for 7 yr. I am not sure if i will ever join another church, I will in fact not deny the gathering together with other Christians to worship our Lord though.
You are thinking, this posting is not going along with the topic of this thread right? Well, you will find that it is. I am leaving the Catholic Church , i am almost sure of that but I am taking The Blessed Mother with me.

Hi BornAgain89,
Don’t let anyone make you feel guilty for leaving the Catholic Church…that is between you and God and no one else.

Sad to say that they teach that you are not a Christian if you are not a Catholic but not so…Also thay you will not go to Heaven if you are not a Catholic…not so. I am sure you will do the right thing.

Benn

 

[RickHolland]

I never said she didn’t need a savior. How god-like of you to decree that God is incapable of keeping the God-bearer from sin. Mary stayed sinless not of her own power, like you assume we believe, but from the unique graces given exclusively to the Mother of God. She needed a savior, its just that she was saved preemptively. Why is it that you feel the need to limit God, and tell Him what he can and cannot do, based on you own limited understanding?

Context, context and context, when did she make this admission? What did God say of all humans; fall what? short? Short of what? Gods glory? All have what? Sinned? Is Mary a goddess as you make her out to be?

Rom. 23 for ***all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, ***"EXCEPT MARY", 24 being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; Is this what it says?

Rom 5 -Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned– "EXCEPT MARY" 13 for until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

Do you see that I have rewritten Scripture; now it fits your understanding of God’s word.

I heard about this website from someehre in one of these threads and it is very user-friendly and I found this. How true the letter is; I don’t know.

The Epistle of Ignatius to the Virgin Mary

Her friend(1) Ignatius to the Christ-bearing Mary.

Thou oughtest to have comforted and consoled me who am a neophyte, and a disciple of thy [beloved] John. For I have heard things wonderful to tell respecting thy [son] Jesus, and I am astonished by such a report. But I desire with my whole heart to obtain information concerning the things which I have heard from thee, who wast always intimate and allied with Him, and who wast acquainted with [all] His secrets. I have also written to thee at another time, and have asked thee concerning the same things. Fare thou well; and let the neophytes who are with me be comforted of thee, and by thee, and in thee. Amen.

Reply of the Blessed Virgin to This Letter.

The lowly handmaid of Christ Jesus to Ignatius, her beloved fellow-disciple.

The things which thou hast heard and learned from John concerning Jesus are true. Believe them, cling to them, and hold fast the profession of that Christianity which thou hast embraced, and conform thy habits and life to thy profession. Now I will come in company with John to visit thee, and those that are with thee. Stand fast in the faith,(2) and show thyself a man; nor let the fierceness of persecution move thee, but let thy spirit be strong and rejoice in God thy Saviour.(3) Amen.
FOOTNOTES:

1. Literally, “his own.”
2. Some omit this word.
3. Literally, “of herself.” Some read, instead of “de se,” “deorum,” when the translation will be, “the true God of gods.”
   searchgodsword.org/his/ad/ecf/

 

[lil_flower_luv]

A. I’m not God

No, you’re not. But that doesn’t mean you have to think as human’s do. Matt 16:23

B. God didn’t need her to be perfect. Jesus said only God is good; so Mary couldn’t be good unless she was God.

But think! Why would God be born unto a sinner? Yes, Mary needed a Savior like all of us…but God knowing who would be His mother long before she, chose to make her a pure vessel of grace - the vessel that would contain Him for nine months. God formed her for His purpose and honored her at the very moment of her existence.

The Blessed Mother was preserved free from sin, original and actual. This privilege is known as the Immaculate Conception.

Therese

 

[RickHolland]

As soon as I confirm some of the Catholic beliefs that i have learned here at Cathlic Answers, I am strongly considering leaving the Catholic religion. I am a convert of 13 years. What I was taught in RCIA never covered many of the beliefs I have learned here. I have found that I refuse to let go of much of my Protestant faith I had for 7 yr. I am not sure if i will ever join another church, I will in fact not deny the gathering together with other Christians to worship our Lord though.
You are thinking, this posting is not going along with the topic of this thread right? Well, you will find that it is. I am leaving the Catholic Church , i am almost sure of that but I am taking The Blessed Mother with me.

Depending on how you meant that; that would like trying to agonize through the narrow gate with some baggage; it is difficult w/o any baggage and you’ll never fit through it till you drop all the baggage. Just a thought from the Word.

 

[RickHolland]

No, you’re not. But that doesn’t mean you have to think as human’s do. Matt 16:23

But think! Why would God be born unto a sinner? Yes, Mary needed a Savior like all of us…but God knowing who would be His mother long before she, chose to make her a pure vessel of grace - the vessel that would contain Him for nine months. God formed her for His purpose and honored her at the very moment of her existence.

The Blessed Mother was preserved free from sin, original and actual. This privilege is known as the Immaculate Conception.

Therese

You do realize that the very God that you believe made Mary w/o the stain of is the same God that said all of sinned and fallen short; only God is incapable of not sinning. So either Mary is a goddess or she is a fallible human; this is what God has said. So do you believe what God has said or do you pick and chose what you want to believe? If so; what do you think God has said about that? Spiritual Food for thought.

 

[lil_flower_luv]

Context, context and context, when did she make this admission? What did God say of all humans; fall what? short? Short of what? Gods glory? All have what? Sinned? Is Mary a goddess as you make her out to be?

Rom. 23 for ***all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, ***"EXCEPT MARY", 24 being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; Is this what it says?

Rom 5 -Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned– "EXCEPT MARY" 13 for until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

Do you see that I have rewritten Scripture; now it fits your understanding of God’s word.

Because you do not choose to look further for your sources, you cannot understand the Blessed Mother’s standing in the Church. How is it possible to believe God sent His Son to this world to save us from our sins, if we do not understand how He got here? Mary was the vessel God used to come here. Like the moon reflects the sun’s rays, Mary is the reflection of God’s Grace.

You do realize that the very God that you believe made Mary w/o the stain of is the same God that said all of sinned and fallen short; only God is incapable of not sinning. So either Mary is a goddess or she is a fallible human; this is what God has said. So do you believe what God has said or do you pick and chose what you want to believe? If so; what do you think God has said about that? Spiritual Food for thought.

The question is: do you pick and choose what you believe?
Mary is not a goddess. She is not a fallible human being. Understand you must be forgetting how great God is if you bring Mary to a low standing. And understand you do not know Catholic teaching if you think we elevate her to a goddess.