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dal11
Guest
My point is you might repent on a daily basis, but you don’t actually have too. Why would you have to. You are going to heaven with out any doubt.
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ALLFORHIM
Guest
Because we are suppose to confess our sins to God so we can be right with him. He does discipline believers if they continue to sin and do not confess and turn away. I believe that is in Hebrews 11 or 12. God already knows what are sins are and will be so when we confess we are simply agreeing with God that we did something wrong and are being obediant by confessing.
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BlestOne
Guest
There is so much misunderstanding about what reconcilliation is… People fear confessing to a priest and that many times motivates them to think this practice is wrong. Truth be told, when you are perfectly contrite you have no problem humbling yourself before man and confessing to your confessor whether that be a priest or otherwise. After adulthood one chooses whether they go or not, and that means that if you open your heart back up to God you will go and confess, because you want to repair your relationship with God, not necessarily because you fear hell. Sin seperates us from God, reparation to that relationship is necessary.
When I was a child I went to confession because my mom and dad made me. When I became an adult I stopped going for a while. I suppose it was partly out of rebellion, but it also was not understanding the graces and the benefits of going. Not to mention the counsel you receive from a totally impartial person. When I finally went back to confession, I couldn’t believe how good it felt. The minute I confessed, it was like all my burdens just went away. I have felt the same way every time since.
The point is, confession is not something we feel we have to do, out of fear of hell. It is a way to repair the seperation from God that sin causes. Humbling ourselves before God, not man, because in confession the priest is acting “in persona Christe” and telling him our transgressions, promising to try not to commit that sin again, is a liberating experience, not an act that causes or alleviates fear.
It’s like going to the doctor when you are sick. You know that the shot or the pills or the treatment you receive to make you better may hurt, but you aren’t going to get better any other way. When you are sick and tired of being sick and tired, you will do anything to feel better right? So the pain is worth the cure… I submit that the pain is ridding yourself of your pride and confessing is the treatment, the cure is being absolved of your sins and the graces that you receive is the benefit of doing the right thing.
When I was a child I went to confession because my mom and dad made me. When I became an adult I stopped going for a while. I suppose it was partly out of rebellion, but it also was not understanding the graces and the benefits of going. Not to mention the counsel you receive from a totally impartial person. When I finally went back to confession, I couldn’t believe how good it felt. The minute I confessed, it was like all my burdens just went away. I have felt the same way every time since.
The point is, confession is not something we feel we have to do, out of fear of hell. It is a way to repair the seperation from God that sin causes. Humbling ourselves before God, not man, because in confession the priest is acting “in persona Christe” and telling him our transgressions, promising to try not to commit that sin again, is a liberating experience, not an act that causes or alleviates fear.
It’s like going to the doctor when you are sick. You know that the shot or the pills or the treatment you receive to make you better may hurt, but you aren’t going to get better any other way. When you are sick and tired of being sick and tired, you will do anything to feel better right? So the pain is worth the cure… I submit that the pain is ridding yourself of your pride and confessing is the treatment, the cure is being absolved of your sins and the graces that you receive is the benefit of doing the right thing.
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Lori_Hodgert
Guest
I am a convert to Catholicism but a Christian since I was five. The term saved means it was the forgiveness of sin when one first prayed the prayer of inviting Jesus in. Protestants must ask for forgiveness for any veniel sins before they take of communion and are always convicted by the Holy Spirit like Catholic Christians when they have made wrong choices (sinned). Protestants believe that their salvation can never be taken away once saved. The thought is that if they really made a decision to follow Christ and fall in love with Him, then they won’t deny Him as their Savior.
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AdamAnt
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I completely agree, and this is misunderstood by many catholics who believe that protestants do not continue to repent and ask for forgiveness of sins. I was taught to repent and ask for forgiveness on a daily basis, if not more. We all have weaknesses and we all continue to repeatedly commit the same sins. That does not mean that, as protestants, we feel that it is ok to continue committing the same sins. It is an ongoing battle and it does not matter if youre catholic or protestant when it comes to giving in to temptation. The important thing is to humble ourselves before Jesus Christ, confess our sins and ask for forgiveness. Even if a believer goes to confession, he/she must ask Jesus for forgiveness. No man, priest or otherwise, is capable of forgiving sin directly or through prayer. It is only capable through Jesus Christ.
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nilofc
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When one confesses to a priest, it is Jesus ultimatley forgiving us. Jesus himself gave this power to the apostles and not just to anybody else. Protestants must understand this.
But let me ask you, so you don’t beleive in “Once saved always saved, I got it made under the shade!” doctrine?
…because it is really anti-biblical.
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AdamAnt
Guest
I believe that a priest or any other person can lead someone through prayer. But the person praying has to understand who they are praying to. If they pray to the priest and ask the priest for forgiveness…then that doesnt mean much. I understand that Jesus gave the power to forgive sins, heal the sick, etc… to the originial apostles, but I do not believe that power exists today.
( Let me clarify, it does not exist in Roman Catholic priests simply because they are Roman Catholic priests. Being a priest, or any man of God, does not mean that he/she is able to forgive sins. No human is without sin and no human is capable of forgiving sin. It is through prayer to Jesus Christ that sins are forgiven. Now, if that happens to be in the presence of a priest during confession, then great! But the prayer has to be made by the sinner directly to Jesus Christ.)
Otherwise, priests would be able to heal people at will, and that just doesnt happen. Not even the Pope can lay his hands on someone and heal their affliction at will. Healing and forgiveness has more to do with an individuals faith in Jesus Christ and less to do with a priest (who is also a sinner just like the rest of us).
As far as the idea that “Once saved always saved, I got it made under the shade!” goes…I certainly do not believe that either because, as you say, it is unbiblical. The Bible specifically talks about those believers that turn away from Jesus, but it is talking about those that make a specific decision to no longer believe. Like a Christian becoming an athiest, buddhist…etc. Its not referring to a backsliding Christian going through a dark period in his/her life.
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nilofc
Guest
I don’t think a Catholic thinks he is praying to the priest when he goes to confession. That is the Protestant misconception instead of the Catholics. And the power to forgive sins were given to men but it is Jesus himself who is doing the forgiving. Again, this another general Protestant misconception.
Reconciliation is a sacrament just like Holy Matimony. In Marriage, you and your girlfriend cannot just go inside a room and lock the door…and say to God “marry us!!”.
The same goes with Reconciliation… you can go directly to God, but you must remember that Jesus established a channel for this to happen.
You said that the power to forgive sins were given to the Apostles but it doesn’t exist today… let me ask you now… prove it.
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expectthebest
Guest
I’m glad you are able to feel that way but I certainly do not. I totally feel like that is a text book definition that doesn’t necessarily relate to the real wold. Confession is something I do because the Church requries it to get to heaven. Frankly, just going to confession does not always allviate my shame and sorrow for offending God. This sometimes remains even weeks after confession. The main reason is to retain salvation.
I know the Church says that a mortal sin totally seperates oneself from God. Well, I live my life by that rule. But, I do not feel that way in my heart. I do not feel seperated from God because I’ve done something wrong. I feel sorry for doing it and tell God how sorry I am. But, in my heart, I feel like he is looking down on me with pitty and love. Confession doesn’t make me more sorry and it doesn’t necessarily make me feel closer to God. Confession is left as something I must do, go through the motions as it were, to assure slavation. I am already sorry so the act of a formal confession is really just a routine the Church mandates. Confession is to make sure I don’t go to hell.
It’s the fear of hell that brings me to confession. It’s difficult to reconcile because I don’t feel seperated from God. I don’t feel like God is just waiting there for me to die before I am able to get to a formal confession so He can damn me to hell. But, It’s what the Church says I must do and therefore I do it. It’s not up for disucssion.
In short, I have often thought that it must be much easier for a protestant to offer perfect contrition. I know that as a Catholic, my contrition may never be enough until I can get to confession. That automatically injects the fear of hell, which a protestant doesn’t have to deal with. I think it’s really a pretty simple realization.
I will say one thing…The fear of not making it to confession before I die and just the hassle of getting to confession (like when the family wants to do something Saturday afternoon and Dad has to come up with an excuse in order to make it to confession. One always feels like people are thinging, man, he must of done something really bad. This actually defeats the purpose of confession being totally secret and anonimous)
If I’m going wrong here, please let me know. This is one thing I have struggled with and am trying to find peace through education.
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AdamAnt
Guest
The channel that you speak of is Jesus, not a priest, and if Jesus is doing the forgiving, then what purpose does a priest serve when it comes to the confession and forgiveness of sins? There is no purpose unless the individual in question does not know how to pray and needs guidance.
No one can prove that anyone has the power to forgive sins, and that’s my point. The Apostles, after receiving the power of the Holy Spirit, were able to forgive sins and perform amazing miracles such as healing, etc. If a priest is not capable of performing miracles like the apostles, then why should I believe that they can forgive sins? And if they can forgive sins, then why would I need to ask Jesus? The focus should always remain on Jesus Christ - nothing else is needed - nothing else can be added.
On the topic of Holy Matrimony -
The sacrament of marriage is similar to baptism in that a priest need not be present. A marriage is between the man, woman, and God. It is about the love that the man and woman have for each other. There does need to be a witness, but that witness does not need to be a priest. The marriage certificate is also needed for it to be legal. Again, if a priest officiates a wedding, his purpose is that of a witness only.
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LilyM
Guest
I remember hearing something by Fulton Sheen about confession - he said, if his experience was anything to judge by (and I’m sure it was) - perfect contrition was more usual than imperfect. In other words genuine sorrow at having offended God rather than simple fear of hell. A heartening thought for Catholics and non-Catholics alike 
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JustaServant
Guest
My wife and I sat at a kitchen table counseling a wife and husband who were having problems. This lady was still living with shame of getting pregnant at 16, a fact her family and the ‘christians’ in the small town she was in never let her forget. She was still crying over something that had happened 13 years before. She was now ‘marked’ and would never be able to live down that sin. She was genuninly sorry, but had no real way of knowing whether her sin was truly forgiven. To her God would always hold it against her.
“Once saved always saved” is an illusion that even the adherants to it, deep down, do not believe.
“Once saved always saved” is an illusion that even the adherants to it, deep down, do not believe.
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Ziggamafu
Guest
From one of my final papers this semester:
Anyway, perfect contrition requires the intent towards sacramental absolution. Therefore, it would seem that Protestants would not be able to have perfect contrition. Nevertheless, it could be that, as with baptism of implicit desire, we can assume that the Protestant would have recourse to confession if he knew its truth and importance; the Church has not (that I know of) spoken on this possibility of receiving the graces of confession in such a manner. We must place our trust in God’s mercy in any case.
…the footnoting didn’t transfer from Word, so that will have to do. I added emphasis (bold) to some bits.
Anyway, perfect contrition requires the intent towards sacramental absolution. Therefore, it would seem that Protestants would not be able to have perfect contrition. Nevertheless, it could be that, as with baptism of implicit desire, we can assume that the Protestant would have recourse to confession if he knew its truth and importance; the Church has not (that I know of) spoken on this possibility of receiving the graces of confession in such a manner. We must place our trust in God’s mercy in any case.
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expectthebest
Guest
So, perfect contrition is not a feeling of sorrow? But, instead, it’s the will to receive the sacrement of confession while trying to will one’s sorrow towards the hurt placed on God rather than the punishment? It sounds like perfect contrition is merely the will to receive the sacrement while making an effort to be sorry for hurting God. It sounds like perfect contrition is not an absolute. In this case, perfect contrition would not be difficult, I think, for most to achieve. What am I missing?
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nilofc
Guest
Maybe you should ask Christ why He established it that way?..and maybe you can tell Him why you think it’s not right.
Why do you read the bible? Surely, you know how to pray.
I can.
Christ told the apostles to follow his example: “As the Father has sent me, even so I send you” (John 20:21). Just as the apostles were to carry Christ’s message to the whole world, so they were to carry his forgiveness: “Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven” (Matt. 18:18).
This power was understood as coming from God: “All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation” (2 Cor. 5:18). Indeed, confirms Paul, “So we are ambassadors for Christ” (2 Cor. 5:20).
Prove that the power to forgive sins ceased to exist when the last apostle died. That’s all I am asking. Because you can never find this idea of yours in the beliefs of the early church not until the Protestants introduced brand new unbiblical doctrines in the 1500s.
Why do you associate performing miracles, healings and forgiveness as one? Which is easier to say? Stand up and take your mat or your sins are forgiven?
Sure, a priest is not needed to be present in order for the baptism to be valid. In fact, the Catholic Church recognizes the non-catholic baptisms as valid as long as it is done with the form, water and the words.
What I am trying to point out is, can a man and a woman wed themselves or can a person baptize himself?
There is only one family of God, and that is His Church. If you knowingly, put yourself outside this family, then it is to your own detriment.
This is the truth that the Catholic Church has proclaimed and we all know that the pillar and foundation of the truth is the Church. (1 Tim 3:15)
Peace Bro.
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Ziggamafu
Guest
You’re not missing anything. When you make an act of perfect contrition, you immediately prove that God has already given you the grace to which you have responded by the act. You prove that charity exists within your heart; that God has saved you from your mortal sin in anticipation of your intended sacramental absolution.
However; perfect contrition is no more achieved by you than your salvation is “achieved” by you. Both necessitate God’s initiative of grace. Our acts of the will in each case - reception of Christ or perfect contrition - is our cooperation with the grace that was already there. Perfect contrition is a gift available to anyone.
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